Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

CHECKMATE — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 19:35:50 GMT

I'm from Canada and I'm confused.

Don't people in Kentucky "gamble" on the parimutuel system at the tracks? If the politicians were consistent wouldn't they bring in legislation to discontinue parimutuel betting???That might just get thed public's attention.

You can't be morally half right can you? Unless you're a politician?

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Benjamin LaRue — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 02:10:23 GMT

We need VLT's bad here in KY. Other states Horse Racing tracks across the country are getting them. I think it's silly. People say that Slots will cause more issues. I think the issues already exist. If people want to gamble in KY they already have BINGO, LOTTERY, and across the river in INDIANI we can go to River Boat Casino’s. So the temptation is already there for Kentucky Residents that want to gamble. Why not keep the money in Kentucky. (I think that’s to easy). Senator DAVID WILLIAMS he goes across the river to play blackjack at casinos. Why would he VOTE no. I think that he doesn’t want to be judged. Well he has been judged. Ellis Park was my place while growing up, Along with Lary Jones. Ellis park has so many childhood memories for me. Its Home, Its Family. My parents don’t know yet what there going to do with there horses. But when the pea patch closes at the end of the summer meet. I know I will shed a tear. It's been a very sad week here in KY. When and what will happen before KY gets slots? Benjamin Henderson KY

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Jonnyspark — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:34:24 GMT

The problem with KY is that the presidents of the race tracks are the ones that have no idea how to run their own sport.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Zookeeper — Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:50:58 GMT

Thomas S. Ballard,

Thank you for answering my question about the "make up" of the voters in Kentucky.

I'm a California resident. The racehorse industry is a very small portion of our economy and does not stand a chance in the legislature or the voting booth.

If you are correct, I was under the misguided impression that Kentucky was different. WOW! What a rude awakening!

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Thomas S. Ballard — Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:17:36 GMT

"We need to find out just how important the horse industry is to Kentucky--in both houses of its legislature."

Sadly, the answer to that question is; "It isn't." Go ahead and tell a legislator that so-and-so is taking his horses to Delaware if VLTs or gaming isn't legalized and see if he flinches. I doubt he will.

Racing isn't anywhere near the top of the list of priorities of Kentucky's politician's and anyone believing otherwise is deluded. Politicians care about votes and those not involved in the racing industry in KY by far outnumber those who are. The masses of this state aren't planning on breeding to A P Indy or any other stallion in KY next year. They're worried about their job at the auto factory or the hardware store. They don't give a hoot in hell about breeding or racing and it's those Kentuckians who are going to get the politicians re-elected. Not the horsemen. There simply aren't enough of us. We're the minority and we're being treated as such. I'm surprised any of us would believe we're going to be awarded special consideration from the legislators in light of our ranking on the proverbial food chain.

The thoroughbred industry in Kentucky is going to suffer as every other industry in the country is suffering right now. We're about to embark upon a new way of doing business- a way that's going to require creativity and ingenuity. The strong will survive while the weak fall by the wayside. We have to accept that change is no longer on the horizon- it's here, now and we have to adapt in a hurry or accept the consequences for lack of good planning and taking measures befitting the times.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Zookeeper — Thu, 25 Jun 2009 13:48:47 GMT

Soldier Course,

I used to think that politicians had the best interest of their contituents in mind. That's when I was young and naive. Years of disapointment have taught me otherwise. I now think that if their mouths are moving, they are lying. No more disapointment...only a bad taste in my mouth when I learn of another "family values" failure or, as in Kentucky, the "guardians of morality" imposing their sanctimonious attitude on the state's signature industry.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Bellwether — Thu, 25 Jun 2009 04:48:33 GMT

@ the very least we get some responce...GET A REEL PROMOTOR...

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Soldier Course — Thu, 25 Jun 2009 00:40:57 GMT

I live in South Carolina, a "family values" state with a large population of fundamental conservatives. These citizens have looked to our state politicians to represent and preserve their values. And their trust has been rewarded tonight by the lead story on the national evening news, a lurid scandal of proportions not seen before in SC in my lifetime.

Our governor Mark Sanford has admitted to having an illicit relationship with a married woman from a foreign country. Gov. Sanford is also married and has four sons; his paramour allegedly has two children. He disappeared from public view several days ago, and supposedly his wife, children, office staff, and Lt. Gov. Bauer knew nothing of his whereabouts. Father's Day came and went during this time. Sanford managed to float a ridiculous lie about walking the Appalachian Trail to clear his head after the recent legislative session. And this is just the beginning.

I share this cautionary tale with the good people of Kentucky, and in doing so I am reminded of powerful words from a Presidential Inaugural Address of almost 50 years ago: Sincerity is always subject to proof.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Shawn P — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 21:21:26 GMT

Here's a newsflash Ray, it isn't just Turfway and Ellis.

Some MAJOR trainers at Churchill have already said they are going elsewhere. Did you READ what Dale had to say in the CJ?

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Tony — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 21:01:20 GMT

As Kentuckians, it is our responsibility to ensure that all state reps who helped defeat this bill be held accountable come election time. We must make sure that this is a primary issue in their reelection attempt. I hope the Senate AP committee is totally gone in 2 years, just as the horse industry as we know it will be.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Ange — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:51:57 GMT

For those of you who think that gambling shouldn't be allowed, wake up! Why should the majority of us who don't have an addicition to gambling, alchohol, drugs, food, etc be denied these things because the vast majority of the population can't control the things they do?

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

berttheclock — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 15:14:40 GMT

His answer was "That's a qualified yes" So, what is your qualification?

St Ronny, also, said that "If you've seen one red wood tree, you've seen 'em all" and he thought trees caused smog. Yeah, some of the brightest did go into business instead of government. How has that Wall Street mess turned out? St Ronny may have like to ride horses, but, it was a Democrat, Ken Maddy, who moved California racing forward by passing a series of measures which created and expanded the system of off track betting and inter and intra state betting. The expansion came in short steps. It seemed to take forever to bring the tracks, the horsemen and the unions together to realize all would benefit. Of course, it, also, took forever, to dump the old 5 dollar minimum exacta bet. The Sport of Kings often moves at a snail pace. However, observing the right wing religious politicos at work in Kentucky, makes me think of that great comment from an Aussie, which said, "Thank Whomever, that we got the convicts and America got the Puritans"

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Shawn P — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 14:41:13 GMT

You people are on the outside looking in for the most part.

You cannot sit down and speak with some of these people. They bow down to special interest groups and they may even KNOW the correct information, they choose to overlook it. How many times have we seen that in our country?

Those of you who keep dragging all the issues that are isolated or not truly relevant to THIS particular issue are poser's as fans of racing. THIS is NOT the time to attack from within. This will devastate a state and our signature industry. I think it should be considered what domino effect might occur when a state that is built around the industry may not even have that industry.

belleweather? The 1945 etc, ignorant trying to push your own agenda in here. Besides the only Stewart that I know in racing is Dallas and Stewie Elliot. Now if you're speaking about the stewardship, maybe we need a 20 something leader in the industry. Not enough action for most of us that age. The old guard has really fallen by the wayside in the last 10 years. The guys with the violations and the issues people keep trying to interject? They are 40 something guys who have NOTHING to do with the old guard. Too Bad.

You have some kind of promotional firm for Horse Racing? Maybe THAT is what's wrong with it.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Ray Chatsworth — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 14:29:41 GMT

1) I'm shocked...SHOCKED, I say, to hear politicians are idiots.

2) Don't get caught up in what goes on in legislative hearings. It's all theater. David Williams told you what was going to happen anyway before the hearings even started.

3) Why the concern about the demise of a year-round circuit in Kentucky. Lexington has always been dependent on exporting their product to other racing centers. The Big Time breeders of Central Kentucky aren't going anywhere if Ellis Park closes.

4) Those of us in the industry just have to get our minds wrapped around the fact that Indiana, Pennsylvania and West Virginia will be the places where minor league racing will take place instead of Turfway and Ellis. Bad news if you work there, but racing fans haven't been going to these places anyway.

5) VLT's are subsidies for small-time horsemen and racetracks. It would be nice to get the handout - and I've been close to operations at racinos in other places - but they don't save the game. Gulfstream and Oaklawn are the two places where racing remains vibrant thanks to slots. They both have short meets. Delaware, Presque Isle and Mountaineer are just factories where horsemen punch the time clock and get paid.

6) This opinion still doesn't change the fact that no single political figure should have the emperor-like power over a single industry that employs so many and produces real, primary source tax revenue. They had a similar situation in Massachusetts - and the last two guys in that post were both forced to resign under threat of indictments. So maybe there's hope...

7) I'm hoping my state senator has the guts to stop by my house during his next campaign the way he did last October. I will invite him in, show him my family and all my racing photos. Then I will ask him why he didn't show up for the committee vote.

8) I wonder if the senators from Bowling Green and Georgetown thought it would be a good idea to help GM and Toyota by taxing every other kind of car not made in Kentucky.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Smarty1217 — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 13:52:10 GMT

Do they not realize that the horse industry is a huge part of Kentucky's industry? If they kill the VLT bill, they're nearly killing the racing industry, which as I said, is a big part of the state's industry.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

MikeM — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 13:22:22 GMT

Of course they received PAC money.That's what their opposition is all about. Politicians (both parties)first and foremost act in their own best interest.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Soldier Course — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 12:54:12 GMT

The State of Maryland finally sat up and took notice when word began to spread that its prominent horse farm owners were seen shopping around for real estate in Pennsylvania with a view to relocating their operations.

There's not enough time left to "settle this in the voting booth".

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Jim P — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 07:03:33 GMT

Racing and the Thoroughbred industry are the only ones who can correct this. When I worked in child welfare we made sure we set down with every legislator and we also got legislators to every office across the state and to multiple events. You have to work your butt off. There is no "easy button". If they don't know, educate them.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Bellwether — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 06:39:38 GMT

THE WW2 CROWD HAS BEEN HOLDING THIS NATION BACK SINCE 1945...THIS MY FRIENDS IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE...THE STEWARTS OF OUR NATIONAL TREASURE HAVE BEEN ASLEEP @ THE WHEEL...LONG LIVE THE KING!!!...

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

EBlythe — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 06:15:43 GMT

BRAVO JimboScully! Your Dad would have been proud.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Alfred Nuckols, Jr. — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 03:03:40 GMT

I was present at the committee hearings yesterday afternoon and was truly amazed by how the advocates for HB 2 put up facts, figures and projections while the opponents had nothing but speculation and conjecture to offer.

It was not a fair hearing as Senator Shaughnessey pointed out. Those originally opposed to the Bill did nothing but distort or misinterpret the facts presented by those supporting the Bill without any attempt to truly understand the underlying issues.

I was extremely shocked by the total lack of understanding of the horse industry by those Senators in opposition to HB 2. If I was voting on the survival of the signature industry of my Commonwealth, I would certainly make sure that I truly understand their needs and what this legislation would or would not accomplish. It was purely a charade put up by those with a fear of David Williams and what might happen to their political committee appointments if they did not follow party lines. I really respect Senator Buford for crossing party lines. I do not understand Senator Kerr's vote as she read a statement from one of her constituents stating that her job was to represent them and not vote her personal feelings about the issue. I cannot imagine a representative not voting the feeling of her constituents when that is why she was elected in the first place and she is from the district representing Keeneland, Calumet, Gainesway, Overbrook, Juddmonte, Darley and other major nurseries.

One thing I would like to know is if Senator Williams has every received any contributions or PAC funds from the casino and riverboat operators in Indiana and/or Illinois. If he has, I think that he should recuse himself and disclose this conflict of interest.

Without a year-round racing circuit in Kentucky, smaller training operations will be forced out of business, Kentucky-breds will not have as much market value and the smaller farms will be forced out of business because of a lack of demand for their Kentucky-bred product. Keeneland sales will also suffer, resulting in less commissions which will mean a drop in Keeneland purses as well. Churchill Downs has already cut dates and purses and the likelihood of a public corporation dipping into their profits from operations in other states and their racino operations is nil because they are all about the bottom line.

As I see it, the horse business in Kentucky as been dealt a tremendously hard blow. Can we survive until our legislature authorizes alternative gaming? I have always been an optimist because I have had to be to survive in this industry. But I am afraid that now they have put us too far behind other jurisdictions that are actively supporting their breeding and racing industries. Without a year-round racing circuit and a decreasing demand for Kentucky-bred thoroughbreds, I see a large demand for horse vans heading out of Kentucky.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Karen in Indiana — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 03:00:59 GMT

I don't think any of this matters when this is an industry that is not so outraged at Ernie Paragallo that he is held to the highest accountability. His hearing yesterday was postponed for the second time with an undisclosed date 'sometime in late July' set for the next hearing. How can someone like that be allowed to do what trainers with drug violations are allowed to do - postpone and postpone until people quit thinking about it and then let it slide? I'm mad as hell about that.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

rowner — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 02:03:35 GMT

I am so tired of governments trying to legislate morality, telling me how I should spend my money.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

Curlin — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:32:52 GMT

Unfortunately, I fear it will take tracks like Ellis Park and Turfway Park closing their doors for good to make the point that VLTs are needed to help keep racing alive in this state. Then again, most KY senators won't care because they will still have a job. Each individual senator is supposed to represent the best interests of their district or at least that's the idea when they're elected. However, Sen. Kerr from Lexington is very opposed to VLTs. Are you kidding me? One of the biggest employers (horse racing industry) in her district is in desparate need of help and she is opposed to the idea of VLTs. Bottom line is, it's going to take either some officials being voted out of office or a state amendment being placed on the ballot in order to get VLTs in Kentucky. How sad is it that racetracks in the supposed "Horse Racing Capital of the World" have to ask for a reduction in live racing days because they are losing horsemen and horses to states like Indiana & West Virginia because of, you guessed it, purse increases due to VLTs? Those states are largely Republican as well, yet legislation was still passed to allow VLTs at their racetracks. It's absolutely pathetic.

VLTs will raise money for more than just the horse racing industry. I think that is what some of our elected officials in Kentucky are failing to truly realize. How hypocritical is it when government refuses to pass a bill allowing VLTs to raise money for the horse racing industry and other programs in the state because they don't want to "prey" on the state's "vulnerable" citizens, then turned around and make proposals to raise money for the horse racing industry that raise taxes? I guess they'll get the money one way or another. Can you imagine the amount of revenue that would be raised for the horse racing industry and all the other programs in the state that would benefit from VLTs on Kentucky Oaks day, Kentucky Derby day or the years when Churchill hosts the Breeders alone? Those days historically attract some of the biggest crowds at thoroughbred racing events in North America. Isn't it something like 5 of the 6 largest crowds in Breeders Cup history were when it was hosted by Churchill Downs? Hell, on Kentucky Derby day, between the Woodford and Derby people have almost 2 hours to kill. What better way to pass the time, lol.

Then I love those in government who are saying VLTs will hurt the horse racing industry because people will choose to spend their dollar on slot machines instead of parimutuel wagering. WOW! You're still going to have the same people who wager on horse racing today, wager on horse racing when VLTs are in place at racetracks. That won't change. You'll attract a more people to the track that usually wouldn't be there just so they can put their nickel in the slot machine. Obviously that leads to an eventual increase in purses because of the gained revenue. Increase the purses and the horsemen stay around which means more than just the 6 or 7 horse fields we've become accustomed to at Churchill Downs these days. Increase the field sizes and it peaks the horse players interest. Increased field sizes, in general, lead to better odds, which is what all horse players want. I mean what do you want as a horse player, a horse you like who is 5/2 because they're in a 6 horse field or that same horse who goes off at 6-1 or better because they're in a 11 or 12 horse field?

In retrospect, VLTs need to become part of Kentucky racetracks. They'll will benefit a wide demographic, not just the horse racing industry. I understand the feeling that you want to "look out" for the vulnerable citizens of Kentucky, but then again, they are adults. It's a catch-22. Without VLTs, you're not looking out for other vulnerable citizens, like horsemen, who need the increase in purses to keep they're livelihood in tact. This was a nice little article Tom.

re: Does the KY Legislature Really Understand Racing?

pg303 — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:11:17 GMT

and how about this: the small group of politicians who derailed this train apparently feel they need to "save" us from the evils of slots, but then they turn around and want to raid a state pension plan instead? Is that even legal? Have they lost all common sense and reason? Unbelievable.