Wiggins Talks Rachel

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Slew — Sun, 10 Oct 2010 13:02:40 GMT

fenpom: Check the DRF for photos of Rachel leaving Saratoga in her van. She's headed South.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

fenpom — Sat, 09 Oct 2010 18:45:48 GMT

Is Rachel still at the track or have they shipped her out already. Just curious. Andrea

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Mike Relva — Sat, 09 Oct 2010 01:30:42 GMT

PJJ

Great comments,on point!!!

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TerriV — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 21:19:21 GMT

There have been some really amazing posts on this blog. GunBow, Zen's Auntie, Dr D and so many more. Jason did a great job of egging everyone into this frenzy, which is exactly what he intended, I'm sure. But it has taken me forever to read it all. Back to the initial topic - very intriguing interview with Mr. Wiggins. Lots of room to read between the lines. I loved Rachel and was able to see 3 of her races last year in person. I'll never forget how moving and extraordinary the experience was. I'll treasure it until I die. And, even though I would've loved to have seen Zenyatta run on the East Coast, so I could've experienced her sooner - I will see her at the Breeder's Cup and just can't wait. No matter who says what, Zenyatta is one of the few and rare. She has been a boon to racing and touched many with her magic. She will go down in history. I don't care whether she wins the Classic again. Rachel's losses have not tarnished what she accomplished and nothing can tarnish Zenyatta either.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

PJJ — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 11:12:42 GMT

At the end of the day, and all things are said and done, Reality is, we can never say that Rachel beat the best in the world, because she didnt. Jess J. ducked the BC races last year and again this year, therefore, robbing Rachel of her chance in her career to go against the world's best. This is sad folks.

This is all about the mismanagement of a horse that should have competed in one of the BC races, this is not right.

Its a shame that Jess Jackson never allowed Rachel to end her career on a high note.

It seems JJ would have at least ran her in the Beldame and the BC races since they were on dirt this year.

Rachel, I hope you can find your true happiness in 2011!, God only knows you sure wont happy in 2010 or in the latter part of 2009.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Slew — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 09:02:53 GMT

Stacey: Fact..QR was scheduled for the BCC.

Fact...QR became uncontrollable when loading into the gate.

Fact...Zen was the largest horse to enter the gate at the BCC. In a herd, size is an intimidation factor, and used by alphas.

The keyword was "maybe"...and it was a response to Dray's laughable assumption about QR being the best, when he was unable to best Blame...a closer, who was unable to catch Haynesfield.

So before you label any remark "stupid", you might first want to consider that some remarks carry a lot of weight even when they're stated in jest. (Oops...so sorry you lost your funny bone.)

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

stevebiscuit — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 08:38:29 GMT

Draynay- I'll give you smoke and mirrors. How about a horse who's given soft fractions but still gets run down by a closer? What quality fields has Quality Road been beating lately? What makes you think they'll run in the Distaff? When asked immediately after the Lady's Secret if they were going to run in the Classic he confirmed, without hesitation, that they would. Even if she does run in the Distaff, she'll be facing a very strong group of fillies, some of whom could have given Rachel Alexandra a run for her money. The Mosses, unlike Jackson, don't won't run from a fight. They'll meet whoever the world has to offer.

Zenyatta's true greatness won't be "exposed" on November 6, it will be unveiled!

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

draynay — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 03:59:18 GMT

The countdown begins. Few than 30 days before Zenyatta is exposed. A poly horse mare from California cannot beat males on dirt.

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aldavis — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 01:53:21 GMT

This is a more accurate statement. Zenyatta may have gotten to Rachel last year at a mile and an eigth, may have. Zenyatta and a whole lot of other horses would have beaten her soundly at a mile and a quarter. Just keepin it real here. I hope RA has a bunch of grade 1 babies in her future, just adding to her already remarkable race campaign.

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Convene — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 01:03:16 GMT

Dr. Drunkinbum - yeah, I think you might be be right about laughing & rubbing his hands together! At least this time there's something legitimate to veer the discussion. I guess I'm just tired of the same thing happening in EVERY discussion even when there isn't a good reason. It's not that I don't want to talk about Zen. I'd just like to talk about Rachel when it's her turn! BTW - I enjoy a lot of your posts too - on all topics!

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My Juliet — Fri, 08 Oct 2010 00:08:08 GMT

Gary at Rough Creek,

Who were you addressing in your comment? People are allowed to come on here or any blog at any time, while they're still opened, or as per the Blog Host.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Stacey — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 22:57:34 GMT

OMG!!! It was only a matter of time before some doofus suggested that QR freaked at the gate because he was afraid to run again Z. And yet it still amazes me whenever someone comes out with that STUPID remark!

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Mike Relva — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 20:41:55 GMT

CLEANRACING

Well said,and it's the same as my feelings for a very long time. I have zero respect for him. Mr. Wiggins is a credit to the game.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Slew — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 19:46:26 GMT

Wasn't QR supposed to run in last year's BCC. Didn't he have a temper tantrum and scratch at the gate? Guess he caught sight of the queen.

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Cleanracing — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 17:40:23 GMT

I sure would like to have seen RA stay with Hal. She's a class act & deserved class act connections. Steve took the heart out of her but probably tried to put it back in the only way he knows how - with a vet. It's a disgrace you can win an Eclipse award the same year you're on appeal for your 2ND lidocain offense. He's a dirty trainer & never deserved a horse like RA. HAL is the one who developed her into the horse she WAS. Steve made her into the horse she IS.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Gary at Rough Creek — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 17:19:42 GMT

I know you jumped on late because you were too chicken or too overmatched to appear earlier, but this attempt at the last word cannot stand.

Zenyatta took on the best males and whipped them...she didn't dodge them. And she won it in what - 2:00 and change?

Rachel "ran" 10 furlongs and lost to a filly that crossed the wire in what - 2:04 and change?

Z's connections let everyone know that she would be running in the 2010 Apple Blossom, at 9 furlongs, on the dirt. If Rachel even dared show up, the pot was a cool $5,000,000.

Whose connections blinked?

Yeah, you know who.

Who won it...again?

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kathleen o — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 14:54:09 GMT

Wow, Dray, thought you were too embarrassed to show up. So far, you have been wrong about everything. LOL

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Mike Relva — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 14:30:39 GMT

DRAYNAY

How many winners have you hit lately? Please.

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LAZMANNICK — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 06:24:26 GMT

Draynay

Seeing that you can see into the future.....do you have any hot stock picks?

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Draynay — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 03:17:25 GMT

Enough is enough. Zenyatta the male dodging poly horse is nothing but a one trick pony. Zenyatta will not be racing in the Classic and Mr. Moss knows it. He will take the easy path and run in the Distaff. He will have some excuse that Zenyatta followers will believe. 19 for 19 and doesn't even run in the biggest races in her own state? Never won a race east of the Mississippi? Never beat a male on dirt? Enough Jason. I can't take it anymore. Zenyatta will be exposed in 30 days and Mr. Moss will AGAIN take the easy route. Quality Road is your HOY and Zenyatta is another dodger who is all smoke and mirrors.

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skyfire — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 03:03:10 GMT

Lookin At Lucky of course (LAL).

Patriots look good.

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skyfire — Thu, 07 Oct 2010 01:04:32 GMT

I am going to be watching LOL these next 3 weeks -- I think that Baffert is as good as anyone at getting a horse ready to peak, and I think LOL is a very good horse. Billy's Empire, I agree with what you wrote about him.

Jimmy, you make very valid points.

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My Juliet — Wed, 06 Oct 2010 21:47:34 GMT

Thank You, Jason, for this interview. So nice to hear Hal Wiggins talk about Rachel A+, to get his imput. So nice for the fans to have this.

I esp enjoyed Hal's thoughts on the P.E., "I thought she ran tremendous." Sometimes a 2nd place finish shows how good a horse is, and I saw this to be true here. Rachel's first time going mile 1/4, and against Life at Ten, 6-race win streak and proven winner at that distance. Persistently benefitted from the large 9-lb wt allowance from Rachel. Her BSF & Times this yr I think still showed her greatness. I wanted nothing more than for this Champion to silence the critics with a huge win at the BC. So that wont happen, and now she beats them all to retirement. ha,ha :)

Afleetalexforever, (what a nice horse you're named after.) I think you're right on re the Mosses wanting no part of Rachel last yr, mentn'g the M.G. Her win in that race was beyond impressive. A 19-length victory, setting a new Track Record, all while being Eased to the wire.

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Kay — Wed, 06 Oct 2010 19:20:56 GMT

Billy:

"Kay, I just wanted to see her in 2010, race against males before the BC. I could care less where she raced. Everyone annointed her the Queen, the best in the world, she beat the best breeders cup classic field ever assembled etc etc etc. That is all I meant by that. Plus, and I know I will take hell for this statement, her owner and trainer said they wanted to travel and show her off, but they realized that all of the sudden at 6 she is not a good shipper. So be it, but at least run her against the boys on her home track. It is a moot point now, we wait for the BC, and I wish her and all of her die hard fans the best of luck."

OK. Gotcha. But about her shipping... she hadn't shipped since 2008. She's six. She shipped fine to Oaklawn but the return trip wasn't good and it took her months to come out of it and round back into form. By that point it's post-Vanity, and they know they have two starts left before the BC. I know they thought about the Beldame and maybe she would have shipped in and out and been fine. But that's quite a gamble to make, given how long it took her to recover from Oaklawn. So even though they said they wanted to travel, I don't understand why everyone is saying that they were lying and that they chickened out. They're really thinking of the horse first. I understand that people are disappointed she didn't travel but I wish they'd understand why instead of ignoring it all the time.

I personally would have loved to see her in the Gold Cup because I think she would have killed that field. However, I do trust her connections. They've won two BC races with her and if they thought running her against males wasn't in her best interest, then I accept that because of their track record with her so far. I wonder if people know how close she came to scratching at Del Mar this year, BTW...

Livesoutwest:

"I've complained a lot about Zenyatta's campaign, but if you compare her handling to Rachel Alexandra's now that her career is over, yeah, I'll have to say Zenyatta was handled better. That doesn't mean I'm happy with the tame choices they made. See Goldikova and Blind Luck for examples of how a great horse should be handled."

But they're also very different horses. Blind Luck's only a 3YO and Europe is completely different. Goldikova going to France, England, wherever isn't the same as shipping a 6YO mare across this country. And there aren't the level of class female mile races in Europe. It's just different and I don't think it's fair to compare them. Be disappointed, sure, but not because Blind Luck ships and Zenyatta doesn't.

As for Rachel, well... it's a choice, isn't it? Two completely different philosophies, both with their separate benefits and drawbacks. Personally, I prefer the Zenyatta way. Rachel had an amazing year but given what Hal Wiggins says in this interview, she could have had an amazing career. I think it's better for the horse, and I think it's better for racing. I hope Lucky runs as a 4YO because that'll be good as well. As racing fans we can obviously shift gears quicker than the casual fan but I like having horses to follow. Even this year what Zenyatta has done is amazing. She drew 12,000 at HP in June, then 34,000 at Del Mar and then nearly 26,000 Saturday. I guess her fans improve in the fall like she does...

"I just hope she's adequately prepared for the Classic. Switch & St. Trinians weren't slouches for girls, but they absolutely pale in comparison to what she'll face in the Classic - what she's never faced. I'm not worried about Blame, she'll easily outrun him in the stretch with a clear trip. But for the first time, she'll take on great early pace horses, Quality Road and Haynesfield on their preferred surface - dirt, not synthetics. The upside is Zenyatta seems to prefer dirt too. I don't question her ability to catch those horses, but whether she's ready to do it after facing lesser all year. That would have been the advantage to at least occasionally facing the very best competition - she would be used to having to work harder."

I totally see your point and it's something I've been thinking about, too. But I guess they can't be prepared for every eventuality. So they chose to go into the race with as fresh a horse as they can have and hope that the rest sorts itself out. If it doesn't work, then they didn't choose correctly. But if it DOES work... wow. I think she runs down everything that's in front of her. And if someone's really cruising out there, she DOES show enough tactical speed to move up on the backside. She'll be far back for the first quarter and maybe for the first half, but she will be picking it up towards the half-mile pole. I think it's going to take a perfect trip and a supreme effort from a horse like Quality Road to hold her off. Maybe he can do it. We'll see. But she'll get into her nice rhythm for most of the race and her closing move to actually just get into position is stronger than most horses' finishing kicks. Then she's got that sixteenth spurt that no other horse has. I think she's got several moves in her and it's different when she has a horse measured, like she has with these fillies. But these boys had better finish!

re: Wiggins Talks Rachel

Householder — Wed, 06 Oct 2010 18:26:25 GMT

Haynesfield was clear by 7-8 at 1:38 for the mile! Speaks volumns as to the caliber behind him. Rail Trip...7-2 for his first start on dirt? It was the first time Blame went 1 1/4. This race told us about as much as the Goodwood...nothing.

You Tube the first Lady's Secret stakes at Santa Anita and tell me what Zenyatta does when Gomez tries to slow the pace on the even money entry and BC Lady's Classic runner up, Hysterical Lady. 49 and change for 1/2 and big Z is 2 lengths off her. If Haynesfield tries another 1:38 mile, he is not only going to see her he is going to feel her breath at the back of his neck and who out kicks who that last 1/4 mile.