Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Householder — Mon, 24 Nov 2008 06:10:07 GMT

Voting and a point system. It sounds a lot like the College Football BCS system. Texas or Oklahoma...Curlin or Zenyatta? What about Utah or Midnight Lute for HOY? Neither will get their chance.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Matthew W — Sat, 22 Nov 2008 04:44:40 GMT

I voted for Kotashaan over the great Lure---Kotashaan was a real good horse in his own right, truly the world's best at 1 1/2 and THAT is the classic turf distance....Also thought that 3 yo who won BC Turf this year had one wicked kick---would vote for him as this years Turf Champ....

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Householder — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:17:06 GMT

The "writers" sometimes can not reach a consensus regarding HOY either. The writers at the Daily Racing Form voted for Lure for HOY. The "writers" at TRA and NTWA voted for Kotashaan. I'm sure the same will happen this year. A point system sounds like a good plan but I can hear the naysayers already saying a Grade I Filly and Mare event, or a Grade I Spint, is not equal to a Grade I Handicap. There are some sprinters out there that racked up some Grade I and II events. Should they be considered for HOY this year?

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

I. W. Hammer — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 23:34:38 GMT

Midnight Lute. He is the Champion Sprinter. Who is faster? It would be like giving a sprinter award to someone other than Yousain Bolt. People would laugh.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

JCRobinson — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 20:48:27 GMT

Since when is a mile considered a sprint? When arguments are used citing performances in mile races as qualifications for a SPRINT championship, I'm left rather confused.

As for the Eclipse awards, I feel they should be revamped in 2 ways, using other awards as examples. 1- Have a minimum number of starts in North America requirement, like the 3 starts in Canada for the Sovereign awards. For the Eclipse awards, I personally would like to see a 5 start min, that would average out to 1 start every 8 weeks or so through the BC. Certainly that should be enough for even today's "softies", although for the juveniles, I'd probably go 4 starts, with their shorter season. Does this punish injured horses or those who go to Dubai? Yes, but for the former, well you can't do much about that, and for the latter, it's up to the owners what they want more. 2- Adopt a system like the Cartiers in Europe, a combo of points earned in pattern races, writers votes and I believe fans get a voting share too. I think such a system worked very well this year, Zarkava didn't have the most G1 wins (that was Duke of Maramalade, wasn't it?), but she won HOY, deservedly so IMHO. Such a system rewards both on-track performance and whatever else you want to call it, popularity, "wow" factor, feel good story etc. Now this system really wouldn't help settle the Bull-Lute debate, except to eliminate both of them.

One last thing, and I'm sorry for being long winded, but for those who want to compare horse racing to other sports, the closest thing you can come to is NASCAR. Their signature event, the one that even the non NASCAR fan could probably identify, is the Daytona 500. It's their FIRST race of the year! The seasonal championship is just that, a year long run not based on the results of the marquee event on the schedule.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

SundaySilenced — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 20:36:57 GMT

I agree with AJH, Jason. We nominate YOU as a voice of reason, keeping traditions as well as taking us into the future by change that is needed on all levels. Though we cannot affect much, I believe we (you) can be a voice for change in the way the awards are given at the very least. If we do have a single way of picking the winners..i.e all based on points, then we wouldn't need voters from all over. Only if there was a tie. You need help? Let us know what we, your loyal bloggers can do to help. (besides take out our frustrations on you) lol

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Alex JH — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:16:35 GMT

Had a little trouble reading and following your post Joan.

But my comment was a response to you about the 'INDUSTRY' and the politics and voting.

And actually, we WERE talking about the Eclipse awards.

Not sure what else you could be referring to?????????? on a post about who the Eclipse award winners will be in the Sprint category??????

Most of the industry people DO think it's political, reference the trainers posts on here from a couple months ago.

Talk to the writers and the NTRA (aren't their voters racing secretaries and officials, or did I get that info wrong Jason?)

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

chris — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 05:56:22 GMT

It has to be Benny the Bull. WOw did he run his heart out in Dubai. What a way to go BENNY.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Joan Cowin — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 05:56:02 GMT

I wasnt speaking of the Eclipse in general. However if you want to go there...

Someone said earlier that Year end awards should be a competition not a popularity contest.

Who do you think make it a popularity contest?

That is in fact what these end of the year awards are whether some of you want to admit it or not.

your telling me that is NOT politics?

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Alex JH — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 05:25:42 GMT

Okay Jason, I nominate you to chair a committee to come up with a point system and specific criteria.

As far as Joan, I absolutely know for a fact that the horsemen in the industry do not always agree with the Eclipse winners and THEY would like more input. They aren't always in it just for their own horse, they know talent even if it isn't in their own barn.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

jshandler — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 04:58:29 GMT

AlexJH: You are right. The Eclipse Awards are voted for by writers. Joan is off base. Although, I also believe we need a point system or defined criteria, as some have suggested.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Alex JH — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 03:57:24 GMT

Jason, Please explain to Joan just WHO votes for the Eclipse winners.

The INDUSTRY, per se has little to do with it. Their representation is the NTRA and I don't think that includes those on the frontline, which in racings case is the backside so to speak.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Matthew W — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 01:56:03 GMT

I think Fatal Bullet was the best 2nd place finisher in BC History (well Dayjur might have a say in that!) But Midnight Lute! The best BC Sprint I've seen! And YES, because of that--he gets my "vote"!

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

Householder — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 00:16:04 GMT

Street Boss was on a 5 race winning streak entering the BC Sprint (Gr.I) which he finished 3rd in. Let's review. Won Bing Crosby (GR.I) in track record time (108.67). Won Triple Bend (Gr.I). Won Los Angeles Handicap (GR.III) in track record time (107.55). Finished second in Ancient Title (GR I). And set track record at Santa Anita for 5 1/2 furlongs (101.27). My argument is the same for those who say (mistakenly) that Zenyatta has never left California. The Eclipse award runs straight though California and Street Boss has one impressive resume. Horses that have not campained in California need to be looked at carefully.

re: Sprint Championship Could Be a Bunch of Bull

dave — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 00:12:33 GMT

At some point, we should have some interesting discussions about Forever Together vs. Goldikova and about somebody or other as best male turf horse.

Does Kip Deville get the Eclipse off a Gr. 1, a Gr. 3, and a second in the Mile? If so--and I'd say he does--then Midnight Lute is a defensible choice off a sensational win against a strong field.