Beat 'em or Play 'em?

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Mr. P — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 19:38:32 GMT

Mike Relva,

As wrong as I believe Mr. Schmoe to be in his statement you are just as wrong. Now I won't go belittling you like you did him but I think you should be less draynay like in your responses to others.

This was your response to Mr. Schmoe,

JOE SCHMOE

Are you joking? BB HAD AN CAREER ENDING INJURY LAST YEAR! What planet are you on?

This is from the website of Regarding Horses prior to last years breeders Cup:

"Big Brown’s injury could take at least two months to heal, making it impossible for him to run in the Breeders’ Cup Classic on Oct. 25 at Santa Anita."

As you can see it was NOT a career ending injury, he could have raced again. For an injury to be career ending it has to be one that prevents you from competing again and the sole reason for retirement. His connections just decided to call it quits at that point and get him to the breeding shed where his value to them was so much more. It was a career ending decision not injury.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Mike Relva — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 20:28:13 GMT

GREG J

You aren't in the minority I agree with you.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

steve s — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 17:17:13 GMT

Precious Passion will get all the lead it wants and nobody can do anything about it-most likly the one to beat

no more silly talk

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Greg J. — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:51:57 GMT

I don't see why people are still debating the HOY honors. I guess its makes for good banter back and forth, but, It has been decided the moment Rachel won the Woodward. Both Rachel and Zenyatta are Champions in their own right, They will both be in the Hall of Fame down the road. I know I am in the minority, But, I still think Mr. Moss will put Zenyatta in the Classic against the boys. I will go a step farther and say she will win the Classic. With that said, If it comes to fruition and she does win, Rachel will still get HOY despite Zenyatta winning the Classic. It is a mute point to argue the point(IMO), But it still makes for an interesting argument, I guess ???

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Matthew W — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 05:11:05 GMT

I happen to like three horses tom at Santa Anita...race #4--normally I wouldn't play a Cal-Bred first time turfer vs horses bred in GB, France, Kentucky, but Young Joe #3 (10-1) is lone speed, will get an easy 1/2 and look out (if he turfs)...race #7 I like Talamo again, #4 Onefunsonofagun (5/2)....race #8 I LOVE #9 Dislitleliteomine (12-1) and bombs away!

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Footlick — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 03:42:05 GMT

Each synthetic surface in Cal is totally different from each other. So SA, HOL and DM are three totally different tracks- they are not the same synthetic track. The fact that Zenyatta just goes and wins on three different surfaces says alot. Just because you run well on one synthetic doesn't mean you run well on the others. I'm sorry you want to diminish what she does because she runs on synthetic tracks, but they aren't the same, they don't react the same, they don't play the same and Beyer doesn't know how to make accurate figures for them, nor does he for turf.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Matthew W — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 02:38:05 GMT

Arman you are right, I believe--PP got away with a slow (downhill) first 1/2 and there's no way he will get the 1 1/2 vs better--NO WAY! Just like there's no way Gio Ponti gets the 1 1/2, either! Europe's gonna clean house on the grass!

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

LDP — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 21:53:27 GMT

Slyder,

Why should RA have to split top honors with a horse that raced half as many times as she did, over roughly the same amount of time. Eight races in roughly 29 weeks averages out to 3.63. Basiclly she had a race a little over every three and a half weeks. Rachel also had three grade ones against males, one was within two weeks of her twenty length demolishion in the Oaks. Then after the Haskell she jumps on in and goes against older males, in a race FEMALE has ever won. Zenyatta has raced four times, compared to Rachel's eight, and none have been adventurous, all in her own division, all on synthetics in Cali. Zenyatta's average race is once ever 5.39 weeks, so a little bit under five and a half weeks. Rachel has five consectutive Grade ones this year three over males, racing over mud and dirt, over seven different tracks in six states. Zenyatta will have a max of five races and four graded ones by the time the year is out, and most likely all of her wins will be against fillies. She has run over only synthetics, on three tracks and in one state. She, unless beaten in the Ladies Classic, is a shoe in for older female, but a split HOTY award should not be done, when Rachel's resume holds so much more weight.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Householder — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:42:33 GMT

Life is Sweet looked pretty good rallying against older males like Rail Trip in the Hollywood Gold Cup. This means she's good right? After all this is the test (males at a classic distance) of a champion?

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Householder — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:37:09 GMT

Darn Yankees. RA's connections know she would loose to Zenyatta on that track. Then what happens to the HOY that she has already been given? Call it a synthetic bias. It is what it is. Tiago out finishing Curlin was enough for the connections.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

slyder — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:31:08 GMT

I say give RA First Half HOY and if Zenyatta remains undefeated at the Breeders Cup give her Second Half HOY. Both horses will have run only 6-7 months of the year so why not split the award to reflect 1/2 a years worth of effort.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Darn Yankees — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 16:32:38 GMT

I see alot of HOY talk. In my opinion If Zenyatta wins the Breeders Cup Classic she should win HOY. Rachael Alexandra had a great 6-7 months but will not have beaten as good of horses. I have no problem with Zenyatta's connections pointing her to the Breeders Cup all year and keeping her in California where it is held. It shows me that if they run her in the Classic they will have had the courage and confidence to race her against the best they could. can't say that for RA. Her connections want no part of Zenyatta and the rest at the Breeders Cup.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

RC Breeze — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:24:55 GMT

Bet against Regal Ransom. It's a wide open race, I expect an upset.

Zenyatta is HOY if she wins the Classic. No Filly has ever won the biggest and toughest race of the year. Summer Bird is HOY if he wins the Classic. He's much better now than when he was beat by RA and he's not ducking better like she is. RA get penalized for not racing on Championship Day. Outside of SB, MTB, and Macho Again she's really not beaten much. All 3 are in the Classic plus the Euoropeans who are better than any of the rest she faced buy a mile.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Matthew W — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:52:48 GMT

Dray I'll bet ya Life Is Sweet beats Music Note in the 1 1/8, two turn Ladies Classic---LIS LOVES the track! Was coming strong late in Lady's Secret---this is a real nice horse, with a good kick--it's all about the kick on pro-ride....we already know Music Note can't outkick Big Z....is she better??..Cuz she was real good last year but got posterized by Zenyatta....I'm sayin she's good, but she gets 3rd again, or 2nd, to Life Is Sweet, cuz she can't outkick her, either....

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

LDP — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:44:46 GMT

Arman,

The track in the Arlington Million was like a freaking spounge! PP hates anything less than good, and that track was about as wet as a turf track can be before it is taken off the turf. If you actually paid attention you'd notice on fast firm track he runs his best, and when that happens it is extremely hard to get by him, that is why he romped in his last two over firm tracks, where he set a course record in one mind you. SA is a very, VERY fast track, and the fact that it has a downhill stretch makes it more likely to help horses run a bit farther than they normally would. PP loves the track, he's won at 11 furlongs this year, and with the help of SA he could hang on that extra furlong. The fact that you discount him off his one bad race, where he had an excuse amazes me.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Matthew W — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:25:49 GMT

BB had an ugly quarter---COULDDA raced again! C'mon, he rerired, thats all, end copy---he couldda/shouldda raced at four cuz he did NOT do it long enough for my tastes....what Phantom means is this: HOY is for the BEST at 1 1/4---ONLY if there's no big horse at 1 1/4 do you give it to ANY OTHER---this is Thoroughbred racing--- 1 1/4 is the classic distance--case closed!

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Mike Relva — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 00:37:28 GMT

THE PHANTOM

Regarding RA and Zenyatta you display little knowledge. Case and point,RA DID NOT HAVE AN EASY YR. as you indicated. I support her connections for bypassing next month. Your priority is running your mouth by slamming horses all the time!

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Arman — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 00:31:38 GMT

Precious passion has no chance. Their is absolutely no way he can go wire to wire against the best turf horses in the world.He may have won in that fashion at monmouth and at sant anita but he finished last in the Arlington million when came across Sligthtly tougher competition.With horses like Cavalryman, Conduit, Da re Mi, Fame and Glory, Spanish Moon all of whom have been running Against best horse in the world, Sea the stars, he has no chance.Trust be he is not gonna open upa 10 length lead by going 22 and change with that kind of field.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Mike Relva — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 23:31:34 GMT

JOE SCHMOE

Are you joking? BB HAD AN CAREER ENDING INJURY LAST YEAR! What planet are you on? He was lucky to win the races he did with a history of bad feetfor his entire career. As for RA I totally respect her connections to skip the Breeders. Don't you think she's done enough this year? She deserves HOY. As for Zenyatta,her connections did what they wanted and don't care period what you or anyone else thinks. They don't sweat it! I totally support their decisions.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

tcc — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 22:33:40 GMT

Jason;

Out of Breeder's Cup Rail Trip (foot bruise).

Gitano Hernando (skipping the B.C)

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

Householder — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 22:01:30 GMT

I'll watch Col John in the paddock. If the assistant trainer shoots cooking spray on his shoes I'll bet him.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

tcc — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 20:22:22 GMT

Jason;

Subject: Breeder's Cup Challenge.

Beginning date 10-28, after the pre-entries are out,then 11-2 for the

last day to submitt you're choices.

choose 3 horses for each B.C. race.

Scoring: win only,place only,show only for each horse chosen.

Based off of point system,10 pts. for win, 7 pts. for place, 5 pts. for show.,or it could be done the

same using the parimutal payoffs for win only, place only, show only. (No Caps.)

Any horses that are entered in more

than one race can be used in both races if they want to.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

joe schmoe — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 19:55:53 GMT

I hate duckers. RA reminds me of Big Brown last year who they were afraid to bring to SA so they blamed it on his feet. Duckers don't deserve to win HOY. The Classic will be full of horses much better than RA has beaten and will include the best she has faced. Should Zenyatta go in the race and take them all down she's HOY. She's not ducking the best field assembled all year if she goes. She's meeting them straight up. I'm tired of the Zenyatta'a only a west coast horse crap. RA's an east coast only horse in my book. She's only raced this year on the right hand side of the map. Champions race on Championship Day and that's the Breeders Cup where it's the biggest day in racing every year. No RA and a win in the Classic gives Zenyatta HOY. Will it happen? Only time will tell.

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

steve s — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 19:46:54 GMT

Can we throw out any horse who raced at Keenland spring and fall meeting for the win end only-that would make things alot easier

re: Beat 'em or Play 'em?

steve s — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 18:52:54 GMT

At Least the good trainers at Sanita anita know what shoes to put on their horses.

that"s one of reasons why it best to bet each local based horse in breeders cup