Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Linda in Texas — Tue, 31 May 2011 15:04:10 GMT

ky vet - i challenge your disrespect of our great moderator and writer of this blog. Period.

You respond in such a blasphemous way toward anyone who makes a statement contrary to yours. I dare say Mr. Haskin has been around more horses, trainers, tracks and articles in the know than you will ever be. Seems you always project your way of thinking and there is nothing wrong with doing that, we all do it, but there is a way to do it without belittling folks especially when you are posting at Mr. Haskin's discretion.

I direct your attention to Keertana, a 5 year old mare. Check out her racing schedule for the past 2 or more years. Sure she got 3 months off in the dead of winter, but she was right back at it. You cannot predict the proclivity of any horse to break down because he/she races twice in a month. Sure and granted, some have inherited that trait. But those who haven't can run all day long. And then there is always a chance of mis-steps with those who haven't inherited traits to break down. This sport is one of immense chances and we all just hope they all turn out positively.

I say, expect a horse to run. Set the bar high and they will attain it eventually. Set the bar low and that is what you will get.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

sceptre — Tue, 31 May 2011 02:06:10 GMT

Coldfacts-

Who said that MOH ran in the Derby only with Lasix? Oh, it's the same guy who maintained that a Mr. P/Raise A Native-line son must win the Derby...Where are your "coldfacts" to support that MOH ran only on lasix? For that matter, no repatriated overseas runner is a "fine example" of drug-free racing; not MOH, nor any of the others. Do you really believe that MOH REQUIRES race-days meds any less than any of the others? Get real.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

KY VET — Mon, 30 May 2011 23:29:25 GMT

HASKIN.....I WILL BET A HORSE OF 1 WEEK...ITS STILL A HORRIBLE IDEA! YOU ARE SAYING WHAT? THAT A HORSE CAN WIN OFF 2 WEEKS? DUH! AGAIN, YOU ARE MISSING THE POINT....POINT IS..ITS BAD FOR THE HORSE! SURE A HORSE CAN RUN GOOD AFTER 2 WEEKS....BUT ITS THE COMBINED EFFECT THAT TAKES ITS TOLL LATER!!! JUST LOOK AT YOUR EXAMPLES!!MOST OF THOSE HORSES GOT HURT RIGHT? CHARISMATIC BROKE DOWN/BIG BROWN FLOPPED/BARBARO ALL OF THOSE HORSES DIDNT LAST.....CAN ANYOMN

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Coldfacts — Mon, 30 May 2011 15:47:46 GMT

RANAGULZION,

You clearly did not see the trip MOH had in the derby. If you can access to a video with an overhead view you will see how many times his rider had to change directions. How can you compare MOH and Santivo. MOH colt was the favorite in the Breeders’ Cup Juvenile Turf; was beaten by a World Class filly in the UAE Derby; had one race in 6 months and still finished ahead of 14 colts in the derby after his trips from across the pond and quarantine. It is exceedingly clear Santivo does not belong in the same race with MOH.

Sceptre,

Why I am not surprised that you have posed such a question. Master of MOH was only given Lasix so as not to be at a disadvantage to the US based horses who would be contesting the Derby on the performance enhancer. As far as I am concerned he did not need as it was administered when he was the favorite in the Breeders’ Cup Juvenile Turf and he did not make the board. MOH is a US bred horse that has made 8 starts to date in four different country i.e., Ireland, England, Dubai and the USA. With all his globetrotting, there have been no reported cases of bleeding. One of the chief reasons advance for the use of Laxis is to prevent bleeding. Of the four countries in which he has started, USA is the only one in which race day medication is allowed.

With proposed elimination of race day medication in the US in the next five years; MOH represents an example of a tough US bred globetrotting horse that required no race day medication Ireland, England and Dubai. His campaign is historic and demanding and for those who are either opposed to or have reservations about to the elimination of RM for US racing, he represents a fine example..

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Ruffian — Mon, 30 May 2011 05:45:52 GMT

Happy Memorial Day everyone!

Don't forget the proper way to fly your flag today is to have it half staff from midnight till noon time. Then it can be raised all the way.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

sceptre — Sun, 29 May 2011 15:56:41 GMT

Pedigree Ann- didn't realize you had a veterinary degree. Contrary to your remarks, racing them less often makes them less injury prone. You're likely misinterpreting the concept of re-modeling.

Coldfacts-if Master Of Hounds is such a poster boy for not requiring race day meds, how come he received them for the Derby?

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Ranagulzion — Sun, 29 May 2011 00:29:19 GMT

Coldfacts,

Master of Hounds will not finish in front of Santiva in the Belmont Stakes. He finished heads on with the latter in the Kentucky Derby but is likely to be at a disadvantage in the Belmont due to his globe-trotting across Europe, Dubai and North America. I think that he'd have a better shot at winning the Epsom Derby.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Linda in Texas — Sat, 28 May 2011 22:13:56 GMT

Correcting myself before someone does, Mucho Macho Man lost his first shoe in The Louisiana Derby not the Kentucky Derby. I am now reading that since he also lost his shoe in The Preakness, Kathy Ritvo has employed a new 'shoemaker' for Mucho Macho Man. The new ones will be synthetic glue on's by Curtis Burns who will be his new blacksmith. Now that makes me feel better as far as the shoes go. I wish him well if he does or does not run in The Belmont. I just want him happy and healthy if that is any business of mine. I mean no disrespect to his owners and trainer. He has a lot of racing ahead of his 3rd Birthday.

Just watched a super Race 10 at Churchill, The Louisville Grade III with the only female against the males. Looked like a 3 way finish but 5 year old Keertana got her nose in there first, just like a woman, don't ya'll think that is poetic justice! And the first time a female has won it! Yee ha! :) Exciting race.

Karen in Texas - it is 5:06 cst as i post this, it is 104 in my little town and headed to 109 and 97 in Dallas. That is hot and a wind to match in both places and has to be tough on the horses. But if i were at Lone Star i would like Game on Dude to win. Love the Dudes, that is a Texas Thang' which you would understand.

Be safe. And Thanks Steve

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

The Deacon — Sat, 28 May 2011 20:48:31 GMT

Bravo Steve, I just rose from my chair to give you a standing ovation. Truer words never spoken.

A thoughtful, well written blog that hopefully could change the way trainers and owners think and prepare their horses, and perhaps change horse racing back to the glory days.............we gotta start someone. This is my opinion only but I think horse racing needs a commissioner, a governing body. All other sports have that..........Happy Memorial Day to all.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Karen in Texas — Sat, 28 May 2011 16:19:58 GMT

Yes, everyone have a safe and fun Memorial Day weekend! My husband and I usually visit the national cemetery near Dallas where his father (a Korean War vet) is buried. Lots of flowers and flags to be seen!

It looks as though Bob Baffert will have several horses running at Lone Star Park this weekend, including Game On Dude, the high-weight for the Lone Star Handicap. I'm going to try to make it out there to watch...

Alex'sBigFan---Definitely do the ear thing for us--glad Linda suggested it! Thanks, can't wait to see your original designer creation!

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

zarvona — Sat, 28 May 2011 15:37:56 GMT

It's a 'weak field' now, that being that we lost 10-15 reasonable top contenders to injury! ...or did we forget about those left behind!???!

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Coldfacts — Sat, 28 May 2011 15:00:14 GMT

Danny UK,

Master of Hounds was my Derby horse. I was not pleased at all with the pace judgment of Mr. Gomez that led to him being given too much to do. It is the first time in the last 11 years that The Raise A Native sire line did not make the board in either the Derby or Preakness. I expect the sire line to come back with a vengeance in the Belmont. I too believe MOH is ideally bred for 12F. I committed to him early and keyed him on top in all my Derby bets. I was prepared like a true captain to go down with my ship. I hope Mr. Obrien uses one of the British Jockey’s as Mr. Gomez has a strained relationship with the winners circle in TC races.

Steve,

I know you have in the past blessed us with some intriguing stories. I do believe the one associated with Master OF Hounds merits being told. Not all stories should be about winners. There can be some that about those that have created unthinkable history. MOH ran his last 2YO race on Nov. 6th 2010. Four and half months later he was shipped from Ireland thousands of miles to Dubai to make is seasonal debut at the grueling distance of 9.5F on a synthetic track. (New surface). He lost by the narrowest of margins. He was returned to Ireland and 5-6 weeks later he was shipped thousands of miles to the USA to contest the country’s premier 3YO race on a dirt track. (New Surface). He finished a creditable 5th. I think I can safely state that no other horse in history has ever taken this journey. What journey? He contested two derbies on two different continents while being trained on a third continent. This horse was bred in the US and was only given race day medication when he contested the USA Derby. He must be as tough as nails. His sire and dam raced in Europe where the usage of race day medication is not allowed. He could certainly be used as an example to finally eliminate race day medication from US racing.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Cris — Sat, 28 May 2011 09:56:57 GMT

Happy Memorial Day everyone.

Growing up watching some great claimers, most of the good trainers raced their horses every ten to fourteen days, and some every three weeks, depending on the horse. The difference is they did not work as often. They jogged or if they were working up to a big race they drilled. Horses can do this if they are handled by someone who knows what they are doing and does not train by needle.

The Belmont can be won without waiting forever to get there. Conquistador Cielo won the Belmont five days after setting the track record for a mile in the Metropolitan. The horse was going away and won by a dozen lengths or more.

In the movie, they go over the training for Secretariat, who was drilled going into the Belmont. Everyone thought he was crazy, but the trainer knew he was fit, he just wanted him sharp. Horses don't need to win every race, older trainers would use a race to work them towards another race. Why work if you can run and pick up a check? Pays better than a morning work and a horse gets more out of it.

I like MMM and want his success from any effort he puts forth, but running a two year old so hard when the body is telling you to stop him makes for a next effort I will watch while saying my prayers. I love this sport, but hate the risks that a triple crown purse causes normally sensible people to take on animals they spend their life with and love.

How great could a two year old Mucho Macho Man be in the late summer events if he could just quit training a little while. A Breeder's Cup win would look good. Saratoga's races are impressive on paper too. Let those feet grow out, check the diet what goes in grows out the feet.

Lets all take some time to spend this weekend with our families and put flowers on our relatives graves, they gave so much for us. A few minutes is not too much to spend.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Alex'sBigFan — Fri, 27 May 2011 22:48:02 GMT

Linda in Texas & MZ, Karen in Texas, Katherine, Dr. D out in CA, Slew, Fran, and many others,

Thanks and I'll give you that ear sign if near a camera at the Belmont. I know I will carry all of you guys with me that day in heart for sure, I know how much you all love these great animals.

You will all be with me in spirit.

Pedigree Ann,

Thanks for that history on High Hat, wow, that was great and I appreciate it.

Forbidden Apple, RedandBlackSilks,

Coldfacts,

Where are you guys, miss your posts! C'mon back with Belmont stuff!

Everyone have a wonderful Memorial Day holiday.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Linda in Texas — Fri, 27 May 2011 18:36:56 GMT

Have a wonderful Memorial Day Week end Steve. And thanks to all who have or had relatives who served their country, our country.

Sometimes i forget why the banks are closed and why my friends get a day off. This particular day/ 'holiday' is hard to forget though and it never should be.

Be safe everyone and spend a day at the races if you have a track nearby. Racing is a sport the entire family can enjoy.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Oldie — Fri, 27 May 2011 17:47:48 GMT

Abigail, I think Aluminaut makes an excellent point in attributing an overall improvement in the breed to the recession's influence on how a breeder's money is spent as well as which horses and mares are actually used in a breeding program. I agree with your opinion that many horses, males in particular, are retired from racing far too soon, and are used at stud with little proof of the traits they may or may not be able to pass down. As in dogs, since you are familiar with canine breeding programs, certain traits can be bred for to the exclusion of others, resulting in a physically or mentally inferior breed. Since the Thoroughbred's main purpose is to run fast and hopefully try to beat all competitors to the finish line, and since the recession has generated greater interest on the part of owners to create higher value in breeding programs, I am hopeful we find the breed improved, and only hope the physical traits are not improved at the expense of mental stability, which can separate a talented failure from a superstar.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

mz — Fri, 27 May 2011 16:19:22 GMT

Groovy, Smoking Baby! He does look like I remember Master Derby looked!

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Linda in Texas — Fri, 27 May 2011 15:01:04 GMT

Alex'sBigFan - I will be looking for your chapeau as i watch the pre race entertainment. If you see a T.V. cameraman, sidle up and pull on your ear lobe as Carol Burnett used to do when signing off her T.V. programs. Then we will know it is you!

Fran- You are so right, Nick Zito truly adores Dialed In. And it is a beautiful thing to observe. I like Dialed In also, his dirt covered stern image as he came flying in behind Animal Kingdom behind Mr. Shackleford first to the wire in The Preakness was inspiring. He doesn't quit and that is admirable.

Steve - the most mind penetrating statement in your article to me, at least, is:

"How about if we wait for these

kids to grow up before putting the stamp of disapproval on them?"

So true. Purchased at a sale at the young age of 2, sent off to training and their bones have not even solidified, their cartilage is still forming. They are still gaining in height. And before they

reach 3 they are already either doomed, disgarded or considered race worthy. I like the 3 and 4 year olds, those are the years they begin to come into their own.

Thanks Steve, i always reread your articles because i sometimes read them so fast that i go back to make sure i haven't missed something and usually in my haste i have.

And Mucho Macho Man, i thought i was reading about The Kentucky Derby again when i read buried in one article, that MMM lost another shoe and was cut up in The Preakness? What is that

about? The Emperor has no shoes?

Does he have issues with his hooves or what seems to be the the answer, the problem is evident.

Wish i could say in fewer words what i try and project, but i think my admiration for this topic is just in my bones and i could talk horses, racing and all that goes with it all day long.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

KenfromRI — Fri, 27 May 2011 14:43:31 GMT

Steve,

thanks for all the info in this article. You backed up the points you made very solidly. I surely does seem that every year for quite a while at this point in the racing year we are badmouthing the current crop of 3 year olds. AK and Shack as well as MMM and others such as Astrology and Nehro may prove to be quite formidable horses when all the ashes have settled at year end.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Abigail Anderson — Fri, 27 May 2011 14:17:44 GMT

Aluminaut: Thanks for your compliment about THE VAULT and what I'm trying to do there. And your analysis of the industry was pretty much what I was getting at, in a less polished way! I do know that trainers are not the decision-makers on when a horse retires per se but, as a fan, it seems clear that many are obliged to tow the line in terms of the owners' agendas. I do wonder, however, what the long-term effect of lightly-raced thoroughbreds who retire so young on the quality of the breed, although I know that everything about horse racing remains deliciously unpredictable in the sense that even moderate performers can be good stallions. But as is true for many dog breeds where breeding has been indiscriminate, could we not end up with inferior individuals because we're relying on stallions that may carry nothing to sing about in their genes? I keep thinking that when all the AP Indys are long-gone, will we be looking at an indifferent stallion pool, or individual's like Unbridled Song who are noted for certain poor characteristics?

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Smoking Baby — Fri, 27 May 2011 14:16:34 GMT

I think Shackleford benefited in the Preakness when Flashpoint caved as early as he did. As Flashpoint tired Shackleford was able to slow down and take a breather before taking the lead which paid big dividends later in the race. Speaking of which, I do love how he dug in at the eighth pole with determination. Something just occurred to me this morning. If you look back at pictures of Master Derby (winner of the 1975 Preakness) you will see that Shackleford bears a strking resemblance to him. Just my opinion though...I could be tripping.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Danny UK — Fri, 27 May 2011 13:40:21 GMT

I said it before and I'll say it again, Master of Hounds has been waiting for this distance all his life. I seriously expect him to destroy this Belmont field, on route to the St Ledger.

Carlton House looks head and shoulders above all the British colts, and his odds have been shrinking for some time now. I expect him to win the Epsom Derby, however, a stablemate of Master of Hounds named Recital has been impressive in all his races in Ireland, and it's very hard to draw form-lines between the two. If any horse beats Carlton House it will be this one.

Can't stress enough how much better Master of Hounds will be over this extended trip. He could easily make mincemeat of the rest. Seriously.

One last thought- It's been a long, long time since a decent American horse contested the Arc de Triomphe. Could Animal Kingdom go that route with his turf pedigree?

I'd really love to see it.

Cheers for reading

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Slew — Fri, 27 May 2011 13:24:56 GMT

I'm going off point here (sort of). It was claimed that AK had the 2nd fastest closing time in the KY Derby to only Secretariat, (at 23 seconds flat) at 23 4/5ths. It seems to me that Sham was closing on Secretariat in 23 3/5ths, the same time that Whirlaway closed the Derby..23 3/5ths. So perhaps that's the time when split seconds count; when someone chooses to split hairs. Otherwise, I, personally was thrilled just to see these colts run. They are truly magnificent creatures who, when unequaled, do become legends. And shame on those who aren't going to Belmont simply because there's no TC on the line. It's really such an awesome test of stamina and courage that we should never become so lax in our appreciation that we falter in supporting a sport we all love.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

Fran Loszynski — Fri, 27 May 2011 11:44:39 GMT

I just have one more thought on the races this year that I have to get off my chest. I love seeing the love Nick Zito has for Dialed In, watching him wipe him down, he loves this horse so much and Nick-Dialed In is a champ just like you. You are one of my all time favorite trainers you even purchased last year an Afleet Alex colt to make me love you more. I secretly wish Dialed In wins the Breeder's Cup for you a most coveted award for the end of a season. I can tell Dialed In loves you too. God Bless take care and Go Dialed In for Nick Zito.

re: Haskin's Derby/Preakness Wrap-up: Fortnight Follies

mz — Fri, 27 May 2011 01:54:56 GMT

Alex'sBigFan: I am sorry I will not be there to see the creation. I will just have to hope that you end up somewhere in the telecast -- maybe singing "The Sidewalks of New York" and not that gawdawful whatevertheheck thing they chose last year.

Put a couple of bucks on Master of Hounds for me -- and an AK / MOH exacta box, OK? Although I love Shackleford, I am uncertain whether the beautiful Clydesdale can make it 1 1/2 miles in front of the other two.

(Maybe not such a bad crop after all; I agree with Steve about this)