Horse of the Year Follies

re: Horse of the Year Follies

dbj8 — Tue, 30 Dec 2008 20:56:07 GMT

Draynay-

I know you probably won't see this because I am posting months after this blog was posted. That being said, you are wrong about Sham. He WAS a special horse, and he didn't run after the Belmont because he broke down during a workout and had to be retired.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

dbj8 — Tue, 30 Dec 2008 20:46:53 GMT

Thank You Steve for this blog article! I got into a similar argument on another website regarding Big Brown's accomplishments, and the fact that he has not been mentioned in the HOY argument. I keep reading "he didn't beat anybody"...Well, neither did Curlin or Zenyatta for that matter, she beat a great crop of fillies, but she didn't race the boys...Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying Curlin and Zenyatta aren't deserving of HOY. I am not saying they aren't amazing athletes, but they haven't beaten any tougher competition this year than BB. BB also won on dirt AND turf-and he beat graded stakes winning older horses in the Monmouth. A win that-despite its closeness-seemed easy for BB. He has some good arguments in his favor.

Cigar lost to Dare and Go (a good horse, but not great) of all horses to end his amazing winning streak, but that loss doesn't diminish his accomplishments. (and before you all freak out on me, NO, I am NOT comparing Big Brown-or any of these three for that matter-to the Greatness of Cigar) What I am saying is one race does not condemn a horse...If it did, perhaps the Classic should condemn Curlin as well. If perfection alone is what we are after then we should end this conversation by giving HOY to Zenyatta-an amazing racehorse in her own right and the only one who had an undefeated season and won with amazing ease-and won on both dirt and synthetic.

When it comes to the two big Boys, Why does it seem we have to be a fan of Big Brown OR Curlin, why is it so hard to be a fan of both? They are both amazing animals, and I for one am overjoyed that I got to watch them both run and I hope they both go on to have amazing stud careers.

The facts are these, people hate on Big Brown because they don't like his connections, or because of the Belmont craziness. Was it the hoof problem, was it getting stepped on, was it the heat...Personally I think it was a combination of the factors-I am sure for a horse so lightly raced and used to coming from the outside and around traffic, getting stepped on and having a loose shoe for a little while was a new experience. We don't know where he would have finished if he hadn't been pulled up, but he clearly wasn't going to win that day...

People hate on Curlin because all of his 3 year old competition retired after last season and there was no one of any real substance for him to race against. They also don't like that his greatness is-in some ways-credited to him being leading money earner in history-an unreliable statistic reagarding greatness because of the rise in purse money. Had Cigar been running with these purses, Curlin would still be trying to break that mark-and perhaps Cigar wouldn't have surpassed John Henry, or Citation from years ago ....and people knock Zenyatta because she never raced against the males....

All three have had amazing accomplishments, all three have negatives to their arguments, all three are deserving of the award, and all three should be involved in the conversation.

I know who I would tip my hat too, but I wouldn't have any heartache with any of these three getting the award.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

CURLINLOVER — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:21:07 GMT

Just an addition if anyone with a vote cares about what a horse may have done for someone. This was a very difficult year for me to get through; but because of CURLIN all year long giving me something to look forward to and someone to cheer for from spring into fall, I got through somehow because - thanks to CURLIN - I had a focus necessary for me to basically get through some very tough months. I even went from Michigan to Louisville in June to see this magnificent horse in person win the Stephen Foster big time! What a treat to carry me through! The added bonus was also seeing Pyro, Dreaming of Anna, and Hystericalady win their respective races.

I thank CURLIN for giving me a year and a half of excitement and beauty combined with incredible talent and athleticism. I especially thank him for this year of giving me focus. I may not be the only fan with a similar experience; for that reason and all his accomplishments, I think he deserves HOY. In my book, he already is and always will be for both 07 and 08!

GO CURLIN!!!!! FOREVER!

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Alysse — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 18:41:01 GMT

I think that if you want to say that Zenyatta ran all but one of her races on synthetics, you need to at least acknowledge that she ran over four different synthetic surfaces. We know that they're definitely not all the same.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Nobiz Like Shobiz — Sun, 09 Nov 2008 15:02:15 GMT

HOY should be given to the deceased BARBARO who in death has done more than any of the contenders above. While he physically is nothing but a box of ashes in the Jackson's closet, his legacy has done more for racing than any living horse. The voters should consider this before casting a vote for either of these 3 inferior (to BARBARO) horses. From beyond the long blue tunnel of the afterlife, BARBARO's influence will benefit racing and equines for many years to come.

I am even naming my firstborn child BARBARO. The eclipse voters should at least give BARBARO this award.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

EmilioP — Thu, 06 Nov 2008 04:13:04 GMT

Is this for the american horse of the year or for horse of the world? Horse of the year should go to Ravens Pass, Henrythenavigator or Zenyatta. The first two, just to remind everyone are american horses they are not european, they are european owned but arent all horses owned by Frank Stronach, or Invasor and Bernardini call themselves europeans since they are owned by Dubai Sheiks that are mainly referred in this country by their european connection. As i can recall, we give eclipse awards to horses like High Chaparral, Miesque, Fantastic Light, Ouija board, banks hill, the list goes on, of only one win in this country, why not give The american Ravens Pass, who was bred in stonerside in kentucky and was still owned by an american until 2 months ago the horse of the year. Now please do not say its because of synthetics, Curlin is a great horse, but he is not a legend like many of you put him out to be. The earnings record, is just a result of inflated purses. Can you imagine how much money affirmed would have made with the races he won during these times?, Curlin ran his best time ever for a mile and a quarter, he was just not good enough. Stop saying track favored the horses coming from Europe. Let me just say this, Phar Lap came to America, having never run on dirt and beat some of the best in the Caliente Handicap who was the richest race in the world back then, Round Table, Kelso, Dr. Fager, Secretariat, Exceller, Northern Dancer, Damascus. All these horses and many others more ran on all surfaces and destroyed their opposition, so stop it with the track bias. They were truly superior horses than anyone around them. Now, for the last 40 years we have been living a lie. We have been selling our best horses to foreigners, while we glorify what stays in this country, the lie has caught up to us. How many european champions have we really had here in the breeders cup, i can tell you not many. Some have and have conquered, others like Giants Causeway and Sakhee, wouldve done the same had it not been for Tiznow, who is proving his greatness as sire as well. Swain wouldve won had it not been for Dettori. What would had the likes of Sinndar, Montjeu, Zarkova, Dalakhani, perform in the Breeders Cup, when the likes of Daylami, High Chaparral, and Red Rocks have put on a show against our best. CAn anyone imagine how many triple crown winners we might have now, had our greed not gotten in they way. Ill give you a list: Sir Ivoe,Nijinsky,Mill Reef, Riverman, Roberto, The Minstrel, Storm Bird, El Gran Senor, Sadlers Wells, Alleged, Secreto, Shareef Dancer, Peintre Celebre, Seattle Dancer, Nashwan, suave dancer, Spinning World,Fantastic Light, all these are either canadian or american bred horses who were taken away from us, but conquered across the atlantic. Now just a reminder what wouldve happened had the likes of these horses had come to America and take on what we think were the best we had, i mean their influence is immensed in the american breed, all we see are pedigrees filled with the names mentioned above. I have my eyes open very wide and i will no longer live this lie. Our best american horse is called Ravens Pass, he went to europe and conquered, came back home and conquered. We have made our bed now we have to lay in it. And just a footnote, so it can really hurt and all ive said can really stick in all your minds. In the 1987 Breeders cup Turf, Theatrical was being overtaken by Arc conqueror Trempolino at the top of the stretch. The whole crowd started to boo, then the 5 year old Theatrical came back and overtook the 3 year old, and the cheers came roaring back. Durkin called Theatrical the American, Trempolino the European. Tom like many of you live in fantasy land. Theatrical was bred in Ireland, Trempolino was bred in Kentucky. America we booed our own horse, and cheered the invader. We booed a horse who conquered the best in europe and that was owned by american Bruce Mcnall. Stop living the lie.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

CURLINLOVER — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 17:38:20 GMT

We don't hate BB; how can you hate a horse who tries his best? His best just wasn't impressive put into perspective with better horses against better competition this and last year. It's quite simple! Let BB have his fun with the ladies! Go visit him! And let the rest of us ignore Dranay and his his idiotic, ludicrous nonsense doing nothing but annoy us. I guess the only way Dranay can feel good about his BB and himself is by trying to put other horses down while trying to annoy us by pushing our buttons. Let's not even lower ourselves to his level anymore. Maybe then the "Dranay nonsense" will stop! Do you guys really want this non-stop Dranay crap to continue? Aren't we horse racing fans? Shouldn't we admire our horses and their accomplishments instead of "fighting" in this increasingly stupid blog? I know I'm done. Hopefully, horse racing can continue despite the Dranays of the world! Let's enjoy our sport and its wonderful and magnificent athletes!

CURLIN for HOY!!!

GO CURLIN!!!

re: Horse of the Year Follies

HaleyB — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 03:20:37 GMT

For all you BB haters, $65,000 stud fee sounds pretty good. I guess Three Chimneys thinks he is a good horse. I love BB and will continue to say he is a great horse, who gave his best. Isn't that all you can ask of an animal or human?

re: Horse of the Year Follies

the_wiz — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 20:21:53 GMT

Melissa,

draynay just can't grasp reality. While Curlin has beaten true G1 caliber horses multiple times his Big Ole Browneye never ran against one. Not one time did he face a true G1 caliber Horse. The 3 yr olds who he faced have won G1 "classified" races. By that I mean they won G1's restricted to 3 yr olds only and this year they didn't beat much. None of the 3 yr olds this year outside of Brownie could match up against Curlin, Street Sense, Hard Spun, Any Given Saturday on his best, and others from just last year not to mention previous years. I doubt the Big Ole Browneye would win many against those either. Hard Spun would have run him into the ground and the others would have blown by. We'll really never know because he never attempted a race against anything near as good as those. Duck Duck Dutrow cowered from the competition.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

slyder — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 19:57:33 GMT

Big Brown Fan,

Sometimes the truth hurts and you can't spin the fact that Big Brown for all the races he won just didn't beat anybody that good. That's not hate for the animal that's fact.

It's not putting him down for what he did, it's putting into perspective who he beat. There have been many horses in the past who have not won the Derby or Preakness but would have surely beaten the ones Brownie did this year. Big Brown was born under a lucky star. The star of mediocrity that shines over the ones he beat.

No hate there, just fact.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

schabelli — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 19:50:56 GMT

Barb,

Don't let lil ole draynay bother you. He needs someone to lash out against and this time he chose you.

First of all you are correct in your analysis of Sham. nay nay says Col. John is more accomplished than Sham and he has won more races but Colonel John has only had the Big Ole Browneye and a slew of weak 3 yr olds to compete against. Sham had far better competition. Col. John hasn't faced anyone like Sham did. He may have won more but that doesn't make him better. If that was the case then nay nay's Browneye would be in obscurity since thousands of horses will end up with more wins than Brownie will. Literally hundreds will end up with more graded wins than the Big Ole Browneye but that won't make them better. Brownie was a flash in the pan who burned out after the Preakness and never faced top flight G1 competition in his life. Sham is more accomplished in that reapect.

Ignore the lil ole nay nay, he just lives to be contrary. You have more horse sense than him.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

jim — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 03:11:46 GMT

LDP....good points...for argument sake lets goto facts and figures:

Zenyatta ran 7 races this year of these 2 @ 1-1/8 and the rest at 1-1/16

all these races were Gr. 1 or Gr.2

1 race on dirt and the rest on artificial.

Her Dirt and artificial surface performance numbers do not differ much, so lets assume she like both surfaces.

of all these races she dominated on maybe 2 races.

Curlin: raced 7 times . Except for 2 races at 1-1/8 All the rest were 1-1/ or more.

he won all his races on dirt.

he lost 1 race on turf and 1 race on artificial.

All his dirt figures were good except for the 2 races he lost.

Most of the trainers including the euros have said that SA's surface makes the field even, meaning that turf horses can handle artificial well.

As we see Curlin did not handle turf to e on top of the turf division and since artificial surface suits turfers better. Should we not rate Curlin on his dirt races only, where he ran and as did Zenyatta against the best in his division and dominated 1 race more than Zenyatta. And that most of his races were at 1-1/4 or more. If not for argument sake lets include Midnight Lute and Benny the bull

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Big Brown Fan — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 01:23:34 GMT

Seriously, of all the people who post on here, I am not the one with a lack of knowledge.

I can't read these posts anymore. I just can't stand all the Big Brown hating going on here. If you don't like him, fine. But you don't have to put down everything he did.

You call me blinded by my obsession...well maybe you're blinded by your hate.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

LDP — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 22:59:50 GMT

Dray, what do you mean? You repeat yourself so good on your own. O i'll give you more than three of Curlins stellar performances

1.) the Dubia World Cup, which was equal to Dubia Millenium's dominating win.

2.) His warm up befor Dubia, why because though he faced mediocer competition he did it while carring 132lbs, more than Brown ever carried.

3.) Though still facing mediocer competion he won the Steven Foster giving 10lbs to his nearest opponent and up to 18 to the farthest and still won by 41/2.

4.)last years Classic, this does show that he can run on more than one surface, since many horses only bring their A game when running on a fast track, and he won by again 41/2 beating a very talented field.

5.) Last years JCGC, because in his first time taking on older horses, he went and beat the head of the division, Lawyer Ron, who had been in his last two races been making a mockery of any others that raced him.

6.) Last years Preakness, because in the fifth race of his career and facing a stellar group of 3yr olds he re-rallied showing heart and courage to nip SS at the wire. This also shows curlins profesionalism, and SS lack, a true great stays focused and will keep on coming no matter if he's out in front.

7.) His AK Derby, which even though he ran against mediocer competion he showed his greatness by drawing off w/ ease to a 103/4 length win.

Curlin has dominated more than BB ever has, more than CJ ever has. Big deal if he got a little tired after dealing with all the travel, the races. This horse went way out of his comfort zone more than any horse this year, and because JJ decided to tried something new, and an experimen went wrong we'll penalize the horse. Curlin has done everything required of him, he has won on tracks all over the country, He's raced on the world's biggest stage, Dubai, not the BC, and until the BC gets more international attention it won't be bigger or more prestigous than Dubai. Why do you think it gets more international stars? In order to be considered better than the Champion you have to beat them, like Curlin took down SS and Lawyer Ron. This year it was BB's turn and he failed to do so.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

HS — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 21:54:54 GMT

Hey Golden Gate, I'm glad I wasn't the only one. I, like you, got emotional watching Curlin's defeat in the BCC. It really surprised me too since I'm not part of Curlin Nation. It was sad to see him run his heart out and come up short, and the love that Albarado was giving him. Another sad performance was that of Ginger Punch. I don't understand how she got so far back to be LAST in the stretch, but she was coming on late. I really have to question Frankel's decision to run an over the top horse (especially one that he loves so much).

And Barb, I'm with you on the blogs....they are the only place people like us can talk horseracing. I bore the heck out of people in my life with my fervor for the sport. As an aside, does anyone know what it was that people were seeing in Student Council that made his odds soar to 44-1? And of course it was validated by his performance. Maybe Asmussen does need to rethink his training style for synthetics.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

barb — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 21:18:13 GMT

Draynay, Sham won the SA derby in 1:47 flat (which i believe is still the fastest time for the race) Colonel John won in 1:48 and change(on pro-ride which will alter your opinion, I'm sure) and I do believe Col. J's prior race was a win in the SHAM stakes. I really like CJ and am not trying to belittle his accomplishments, just pointing out some facts.

And thanks Wanda I appreciate the support.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

MikeM — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 20:12:44 GMT

Curlin or Zenyatta are equally deserving of HOY but Curlin will get it due to his body of work. Also, the only thing they will talk about in ten years is how BB started his stud career in KY at $65m and now stands in NY for $5M.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Wanda — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 17:43:11 GMT

Barb it sounds to me like you do know what your talking about.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Draynay — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 16:22:28 GMT

LDP ... why do you make me repeat myself ? Colonel John is more accomplished than Sham. And he ran on a busted leg in the Belmont that is why he never ran again.

For all of you that want to vote Curlin HOY please tell me his 3 great performances this year that you would base it on. I assume everyone will say Dubai...give me two more brilliant performances.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Whatever — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 15:55:01 GMT

Curlin, hands down for HOY. He has clearly done more than any other horse this year; raced on three different surfaces in two countries and has won over $10 million dollars, do they even need to have a vote, how ridiculous. What is more ridiculous is the NTRA stating in there news brief about the breeders cup wrap up, that Curlin ran a surprising fourth in the classic. So, his fourth place finish in the classic WAS A SURPRISE; really, considering that the horse has never run on a synthetic surface before and the NTRA is surprised, that is hilarious. What would be a surprise is if " horse of the moment" Raven's Pass, had run in the Jockey Club Gold Cup on Belmont's main track, and won; now that would be a huge surprise, but Curlin not liking the synthetic surface, that is not a surprise. Zenyetta is wonderful, she really is, but has she raced on any other surfaces this year besides synthetic or has she traveled abroad to face an international field???????? Calling the synthetic surfaces leveling the playing field for the europeans is comical. When an american goes over to europe to run, what do they race on? a nice dirt surface to level the playing field for the americans, OH NO, they HAVE TO run on the grass; there are no surface choices for them to get their best edge. This sport has finally succeeded in making me want to vomit!

re: Horse of the Year Follies

MIKE RELVA — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 12:57:21 GMT

TO DANYLSON:

I WOULD FIRE ANYONE ON THE SPOT IF HIM OR HER EVER SUGGESTED RUNNING MY HORSES A DOZEN TIMES A YEAR! LIKE I SAID,I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM OFFENDING SOMEONE EMPLOYED BY ME IF I FEEL THEY AREN'T TAKING CARE OF MY HORSES,PERIOD!

re: Horse of the Year Follies

LDP — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 10:55:23 GMT

Dray,

Sham was pretty accomplished, and i'll bet he didn't race after the Belmont, after practicaly collapsing after trying to keep up with our "temendous machine". How can you race a horse after something like that, there's no way. Heres and idea why don't you go and look up why he didn't race afterwards, i'll bet theres a darn good reason for it.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

KatintheHat — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 05:13:28 GMT

Sham was 19 5 5 1

Oddly enough, although Secretariat has the largest heart ever measured, Sham has the second (yet again!) largest heart measured.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

Draynay — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 04:04:00 GMT

Barb you don't know what you are talking about. Sham was nothing special and did not even race after

Belmont. The fact that he was nothing special tells you how fast the track was running that day at

Churchill. Colonel John is more accomplished than Sham.

re: Horse of the Year Follies

margi — Mon, 03 Nov 2008 04:02:24 GMT

I think what Curlin has done in his 2 seasons on the track is just unthinkable! To go from breaking his maiden in his first start by 10 lengths, or whatever it was, in February, to running a troubled third in the Kentucky Derby and winning the Preakness in May, running second in a race for the ages in the Belmont in June, to dusting the top older horse in Lawyer Ron twice in the JCGC and Breeder Cup....it was just sensational! Then, he goes to Dubai in March this year and turns in the most sensational performance I've ever seen in that race. Only Dubai Millenium's DWC comes even close. Then, he wins the Stephen Foster in an absolutely sick performance that makes the rest of the field look like $40K claimers.

They tried him on the turf...why not? Smart Strike is one of the best "hidden turf" sires on the planet, and he finishes 2nd in a GI, splitting two BC Turf winners.

I guess he tailed off after that......excuse me? He won 2 GI races on the dirt with the Woodward and the JCGC (for the second time). Yes, he didn't win them impressively, and the horses he beat in both those races weren't supposed to warm him up. He won them anyway, just like he was supposed to do.

After he did all that, his connections were bombarded with demands that he run in the Breeders Cup.....he was supposed to be the savior of the event after Big Brown retired. His connections didn't want to run him on a surface that they weren't sure about, but they did the right thing. He finished off the board for the first time in his career.

Curlin probably had HOTY locked up before the Breeders Cup. His people started him, against their own judgement, for the good of the Breeders Cup and for the good of the game.

They were pressured into running him bigtime.....should he be punished for it?

My vote is for Curlin for Horse Of The Year.