Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Mary — Thu, 03 Jan 2013 17:27:19 GMT

I enjoyed looking back at the comments made before the derby. I will say some of you agreed with my comments about Union Rags, but many did not.

I got the last laugh though, as my horse traveled farther than any other three year old in the country, to win the Belmont Stakes.

Many of you, including Mr. Haskin, questioned Union Rags' ability to get the distance, based soley on his sire's pedigree, without any regard for the female line of his pedigree. I'm still dumbfounded by some of the remarks that were made. Good day all.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Deltalady — Mon, 27 Feb 2012 05:36:01 GMT

I'm coming a little late to the party, but couldn't resist throwing in a quote. Now, I'm not sure about the number of progeny Mrs. Sullivan had, but, I think it goes: "Mrs. Sullivan had 8 sons, but only 1 John L." You get the gist! As a huge fan of both Zenyatta and Rachel, I can wish all day long that their offspring will be special, but I know and understand that it is highly unlikely. It is interesting, though, that the two farms that are rather cool towards each other (as reported) got together last year to breed Vertigineux (Z's dam) and Street Cry (her sire), to produce a full sibling to Zenyatta!Due sometime this spring, I think, but haven't heard a due date. If the odds are against another Zenyatta, why would they do it anyway? Because, even they HOPE they hit the jackpot. That's good enough for me and I will continue to dream of more Rachels and Zenyattas. Abigail Anderson did a nice piece looking at the heritage of Zenyatta, Rachel, and Rags to Riches at her blog, The Vault: Horseracing Past and Present.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Karen in Texas — Fri, 03 Feb 2012 23:31:42 GMT

Hansen not only had never seen another horse sweep up to him forcefully in a race, he was carrying 6lbs. more than the winner, I believe. I read on another site that his blinkers will be removed for the next outing.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Karen in Texas — Fri, 03 Feb 2012 23:19:55 GMT

Byron Rogers----It is my understanding that Dr. Matthew Binns and (possibly) Dr. Gus Cothran as well, believe that the large heart associated with elite performance in thoroughbreds exists, but not due to the existence of one single mutated gene. I have read that Dr. Binns believes the heart size in question is attributed to polygenic influences and expression. That would not necessarily exclude the location(s) from residing on the X chromosome. Dr. Binns apparently formed this idea after his work on the equine genome map, which was only completed a few years ago. Do you have knowledge of the specific studies or information that guided his opinion? I am not "challenging" you, but am honestly looking for facts. I noticed that your Jan. 31 comment to Zarvona was worded very carefully and this caught my attention. Can you cite sources or direct quotes for your statement?

Thank you for the link to Performance Genetics. It seems to me that their test and the Equinome test are both based on myostatin gene research and its application as far as possibly understanding distance ability/limitations in race horses. These tests must be fairly new in their availability. As owners/trainers subscribe to and use these tests, their validity should be confirmed or denied based on results.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Slew — Fri, 03 Feb 2012 15:44:46 GMT

Byron Rogers: What you call a "myth" is actually scientific genetic research that, through DNA, traced the Xfactor back to the dam of Eclipse. Not a myth!

Coldfacts: Yes, Steve set the parameters of this article, but you widely strayed when you declared RA and Zen would never sire a champion...based soley on your reseach of bloodlines only in the Kentucky Derby winners. Fervent discussion then followed.

AS to Hansen, after scorching the track early, I don't think he's ever seen another horse creep up on him. Instead of fighting back, he calmly stood at the rail and watched as Algorithms swept past. It was a race for learning. I haven't lost faith in his ability.

A Bernardini filly, Gamalati, ran off with the UAE 1,000 Guineas this morning at Meydan. It is such a pleasure to watch those races with the horses all groomed to perfection.

And while I enjoy my Bernardini babies, I'm rooting for Swag Daddy in the Withers tomorrow. After what I've seen him do before, I think he's an awesome colt.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

zarvona — Thu, 02 Feb 2012 03:20:23 GMT

Speaking of interesting bloodlines, here is a foreigner I came across while checking a filly’s from-off-of-the turf’s dam line:

My Babu (Fr.)

(16- 11-2-0)- by

Djebel (Fr.)

(22- 15-2-1)- by

Tourbillion (Fr.)-

(12- 6-1-1)- by

Kasar (Fr.)

(15- 11-3-0)- by

Bruleur (Fr.)

(5- 3-2-0)- by

Chouberski (Fr.)- by

Gardefue (Fr.)-

(15- 7-x-x)-

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Pedigree Ann — Wed, 01 Feb 2012 17:39:58 GMT

Racingfan -

Tesio may have written that "over-raced" mares were less likely to produce well than others, but his definition of "over-raced" may be different from the modern definition.

The dam of Nearco was Nogara, winner of 14 of 18 starts, including both the Italian 1000 and 2000 Guineas - she beat colts on many occasions. I would hardly call her a 'modest' racemare. And she foaled a further 6 SWs, including another Italian Derby winner and an Italian Oaks winner.

Donatello II (a very important sire in Britain) was out of Delleana, who won the same classic races as Nogara did as well as the then important Premio Principe Amadeo and Gran Premio d'Italia, over colts. She also foaled Dossa Dossi, Italian Oaks and 1000 Guineas winner.

The dam of Ribot was Romanella, champion 2yo filly in Italy, winner of several races over colts, including the Criterium Nazionale.

None of these mares could be considered 'modest' IMHO. They were tested for class, something Tesio was adamant about. Since he (part-)owned the horses he trained, he could and did train them hard to expose any weaknesses; modern trainers would probably react to his training regime with horror. But the survivors were as fit as they could be and as I understand it, he never had a fatal break-down during a race.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Pedigree Ann — Wed, 01 Feb 2012 17:17:05 GMT

"The likes of Regret, Chris Evert, Genuine Risk, Winning Colors, Personal Ensign, Lady Secret (sic), Dream Supreme [why is she on this list?] etc., were considered flops as broodmares..."

Where do I start with this statement? Personal Ensign a flop? The dam of 3 G1 winners (1 champion) and 3 graded-placed (one multiple G1-placed) winners? What do you demand for a success? All G1 winners?

Genuine Risk contracted a low-grade uterine infection early on in her breeding career and produced only 2 foals, late in her teens, neither of which raced. Her lack of success as a broodmare was not due to her racing career, which comprised only 15 races, after all.

Chris Evert produced 2 SWs and one SP from 5 foals, better than average to be sure. Winning Colors and Lady's Secret were definitely flops; IMHO these two Lukas trainees had their breeding careers wasted trying for the perfect sales yearling.

Even if she didn't belong in the same category with those mentioned, Dream Supreme has been far from a flop. First 4 foals, 4 winners, 3 SWs, 1 G1 winner Majestic Warrior. What more do you want from her?

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

JerseyBoy — Wed, 01 Feb 2012 13:31:16 GMT

Zarvona:

Can’t you recognize a sales pitch when you see one?

If someone representing that he is pushing science places horses into three groups-sprinters,milers and routers, without defining each group, what do you call that?

Nice fun this.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

KY VET — Wed, 01 Feb 2012 04:14:32 GMT

Funny how you breeding people are....HANSEN loses and now he cant route....i thought his breeding was good for distance? TRUTH is, alot of you on here just dont like close to the pace horses...because every time they lose, you think it is because they cant go a distance......I whipped hansen on saturday.... but let me tell you, that that is a perfect race if you want him in the derby...its called a prep! you dont want to run too good! when will you people get it?

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

zarvona — Wed, 01 Feb 2012 02:58:30 GMT

“Bunk” huh??? Here’s to your “BUNK”…. O.K ., let’s look at most of the DERBY WINNERS since let’s say “Secretartiat”,--(she personally autopsied to reveal the 2nd biggest heart ever among those looked into dead race horses).--You really want your next Derby winner pick to NOT have been a carrier of a “BHXFG” strain line? --Gee, I wonder if the likes of: “Giacomo”; “Thunder Gulch”: “Lil E Tee”; & “Sunday Silence”, were “Odds” Derby “favorites”??? …Oh yeah, that’s right. “Giacomo” was 50-1 ?? or 99-1 or something… If you bet on a Derby winner that does NOT carrying a link to the “BHXFG”, you would be bucking the odds!!!! …MR. ROGERS!!…

From the Modern Era…

2011: “Animal Kingdom”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2010: “Super Saver”: 10x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2009: “Mine That Bird”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2008: “Big Brown”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2007: “Street Sense”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2006: “Barbaro”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2005: “Giacomo”: 0x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2004: “Smarty Jones”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2003: “Funny Cide”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2002: “War Emblem”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2001: “Monarhos”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

2000: “Fusiachi Pegasus”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1999: “Charismatic”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1998: “Real Quiet”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1997: “Silver Charm”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1996: “Grindstone”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1995: “Thunder Gulch”: 0x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1994: “Go For Gin”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1993: “Sea Hero”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1992: “Lil E Tee”: 0x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1991: “Strike the Gold”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1990: “Unbridled”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1989: “Sunday Silence”: 0x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1988: “Winning Colors”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1987: “Alysheba”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1983: “Sunny’s Halo”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1982: “Gato Del Sol”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1981: “Pleasant Colony”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1980: “Genuine Risk”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1979: “Spectacular Bid”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1978: “Affirmed”: 2x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1977: “Seattle Slew”: 3x’s Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

1973: “Secretariat”: 1x Bred to the “BHZFG” strain;

via “Cosquilla” (G.B.);

P.S.: For fun if board, find Blood-Horse’s ‘Top 10 Race Horses of All Time” and look up such links. Try looking up the last 25 years, or so, of let’s say Belmont Winners, etc., and link such to those lines as a BETTING percentage consideration regarding breeding and stamina for DISTANCE regarding modern race horses, thusly in seeking out a KENTUCKY DERBY WINNER, which this blog is most usually geared toward discussions of. Again, mine was just some free information, not the word of “GOD”.

P.P.S.: Only one runner in this year’s recent HOLY BULL did NOT carry a link to the “BHXFG” lines, and that would have been the horse in a 6 horse race that finished 5th or 2nd TO LAST !!!!, …and, that at only a distance of a Mile and thusly, we aren’t talking yet about HEART for a 1 ¼ , or such as looking into Belmont 1 ½ runners and winners, yet. But, I surely want my NEXT Derby pick linked to at least one “BHXFG” strain line myself, being my point. You can stick to your own beliefs… these are just some of mine. And, I never told anyone to take my advice, I was just throwing out some percentage statistical keys of my own that I consider important TO RACE HORSES going Lonngggggg regarding modern breeding lines. Take from it what you will, its just free information and over the years I have taken plenty of negative responses in regards to my posts. No biggie, just like water off a duck’s back…

Zarvona

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

JorgeG — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 16:40:38 GMT

Mary, I ´m sure Castellano was having a nice party…. when he said those things about Ghostzapper and Bernardini!!!

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Byron Rogers — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 16:10:56 GMT

Zarvona

The X Factor, in terms of a single mutated gene carried on the X Chromosome that expresses a large heart that in turn is a cause for elite racehorse performance, is a myth. It was a great story, well told, but in terms of science it is bunk.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

JerseyBoy — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 14:37:03 GMT

Coldfacts:

I am ending this exchange. This is nothing but a distraction. Sorry I even got into it.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

AngelaInAbilene — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 14:15:25 GMT

Slightly off topic but still "in the blood."

I was so saddened to read of the passing of Mike Tammaro. He was a helluva man and a true horseman. Those traits run in the Tammaro family. My condolences to the family and all who were close to him.

Mr. Haskin, perhaps you could write one of your fantastic pieces on the Tammaro's. Lots of history there.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

JR — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 12:41:49 GMT

I agree with your comment about Borel, I was wondering the same thing when I was watching it.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

JerseyBoy — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 11:27:00 GMT

Ranagulzion:

Remember, I judge horses by their performance. Not winning a specific race will never be an issue with me. What matters is whether a sire or dam produces top class runners. In the case of the sire this is reflected in the stud fees. This is the reason AP Indy and his descendants command the fees they do.

On another note. To all.

In an illustration, I stated that 80% of foals become starters. That was an error. While up to 89% of the foals of a few sires become starters, the national average is not 80%. It is around 70%.

I am sorry if I misled anyone. See URL below.

www.bloodhorse.com/.../new-sire-lists-rank-stallions-by-durability

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

zarvona — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 07:12:09 GMT

For the Derby Run, where is it that you actually want to see your stamina influences for distance to come from? These are some of my preferences outside of the dam line and the “BHXFG” strain influences. And, of course being whereby some of these are related.

Affirmed- (29 22-5-1);

Ajax (Fr.)- (5 5-0-0);

Alleged- (10 9-1-0);

Alydar- (26 14-9-1);

Afleet Alex- (12 8-2-1);

Arch- (7 5-1-0);

Bernardini- (8 6-1-0);

Big Brown- (8 7-0-0);

Blushing Groom(Fr.)-(10 7-1-2)

Boldnesian- (5 4-0-0);

Bold Ruler- (33 23-4-2);

Boundary- (8 6-1-1-);

Buckpasser- (31 25-4-1);

Candy Ride (Arg.)(6 6-0-0);

Commando- (9- 7-2-0);

Court Marshall(G.B.)(8- 6-1-1);

Citation (45- 32-10-2);

Danzig- (3 3-0-0);

Deputy Minister(Can.(22 12-2-2)

Dr. Fager- (22- 18-2-1);

Easy Goer- (20 14-5-1-);

Empire Maker- (8- 4-4-0-);

Fappiano- (17 10-3-1-);

Forty Niner- (19- 11-5-0);

Free For All- (7- 6-0-0);

Giant’s Causeway-(13- 9-4-0);

Graustark- (8 7-1-0) ;

Hoist the Flag-(6 5-0-0-);

Kitten’s Joy- (14 9-4-0);

Le Fabuleux(Fr.)- (11 8-1-0);

Man O’ War- (21 20-1-0);

Native Dancer- (22 21-1-0);

Nearco (Ity.)- (16 16-0-0)-

Nijinsky (Can.) (13 11-2-0);

Nureyev- (3 2-0-0);

Prince Rose (G.B.)-(17 16-0-1)-

Pulpit- (6 4-1-0);

Raise a Cup- (6- 4-0-1);

Raise a Native- (4 4-0-0);

Real Court- (21- 16-4-1);

Ribot (G.B.)- (16 16-0-0);

Sadler’s Wells (11 6-4-0);

Seattle Slew- (17 14-2-0);

Secretariat- (21 16-3-1);

Smarty Jones- (9 8-1-0);

Storm Bird (Can). (6 5-0-0);

Swaps- (25- 19–2-2);

Teddy (Fr.) (8 6-0-1);

The Minstrel (Can.)(9 7-1-1);

Turn-To- (8 6-1-1); ...&

War Admiral- (26 21-3-1)-

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Coldfacts — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 06:14:43 GMT

JerseyBoy,

I humbly ascribe to you dominion in pedigree analysis and the English language. I have declared in previous posts that I have limitation with the language consequently you must forgive me if I occasionally misplace my adjectives, verbs and nouns. My quest to achieve better command continues and I hope one day to attain your level.

“If you make the criterion narrow enough you can produce any statistic you want”

Would the opposite be true? Did Mr. Haskin narrow his criterion in the opening sentence of his blog? A fact check can easily answer the question. Below is the aforementioned opening sentence.

“How big a role does pedigree play nowadays in determining the Kentucky Derby winner?”

My limited command of the language suggests that he was referring to pedigree in relation to a particular race i.e., The Kentucky Derby. It appears that his criterion was even narrower than mine as I focused on the Triple Crown, HOY and other Champions. If my criterion is narrowed to that of Mr. Haskin’s, the COLD FACTS do not change. Superstar mares have not been the ones producing Derby winners. Mr. Haskin is at liberty to narrow his criterion but in my quest for self-justification I have narrowed mine to make the cold fact fit my conclusion. It must be obvious to you by now that in posting the statement above, you failed to recognize that Mr. Haskin was the one that set the criterion for the subject and I merely followed. If you are going to scold someone do not leave room to in turn be scolded.

“My criterion is the production of top-class graded stakes winners, the primary criterion for judging broodmares.”

Your criterion is admirable but obviously irrelevant to the Derby and Triple Crown.

“The problem is you have reached a conclusion based of the narrow criterion you chose.”

The criterion was determined by Mr. Haskin. The problem lies in the fact that you failed to recognize this.

“There is only one HOY per year and it is not a horse race, it is an election.”

No doubt the majority of those achieving the award were products of champion G1 winning mares.

“You are engaged in an exercise in self-justification to the extent you are saying that your criterion has a rational basis. It does not.”

You haves lost me with the above. How does being syndical about the prospect of two HOYs producing champions equates to self-justification? The truth is I am curious as why G1 winning mares have such a dismal record in the Triple Crown. I am aware that they are outnumbered by the other category and consequently I do not expect them to produce large quantities of these winners. However, if in 80 year only one winner of the Oak has produced a Derby winner it cannot be a case of simply being outnumbered.

“I did not realize you felt you were being “demonized”. That word is usually used in connection with people in authority. You are not in that position”

As previously mentioned I occasionally misplace my adjectives, nouns and verbs. It appear that I have used demonized” in the wrong context. I was unaware that the word is reserved for use against figures in authority which I am clearly not. If it appears that this was inferred, kindly forgive for getting ahead of myself. Mr. Haskin is the only authority. He set the stage; he determines what will be displayed on his blog and who warrants reprimand. I have researched the meaning of demonized to verify its miss use. The numerous definitions found made to reference to usage in association with persons in authority. You have probably compiled you own dictionary and consequently you are the sole authority on definition and word usage. I do not professed to be as knowledgeable and brilliant as most of Mr. Haskin’s supporter. However, I do know my limitations. The big question is, do you know your? One love!

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

zarvona — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 05:29:19 GMT

I see that your article was just a glimpse at a few of this year’s likely “potatoes” and some of your earlier picks under consideration. But according to your ‘by line’, I was actually looking forward to a real article on breeding, as related to the current American racing horses and those three year-olds traditionally pointed to the Kentucky Derby and then the elusive quest for the Triple Crown. Although I agree that half of your early “potato” selection are also near my ‘top ten’ of the near about 200 of mine researched and looked over thus far re-breeding, of course excluding the ever-possible cross over from the fillies’ side, which I personally also keep track of.

To myself, my way of thinking, there are keys to the breeding, but you yourself once stated that “the winner can come from anywhere”, breeding wise,--although no such Derby winner yet has oddly enough ever come out of the highly bred “Storm Cat” line,--yet, as a testimonial of last years winner, “Animal Kingdom”, on the dam side about 6 generation back was bred to the 2nd ever most German bred sire. And yet, ‘who really ever looked back at the breeding that deeply to discover such information pre-Derby?’, only maybe I post-Derby who after I was upset in my betting on Derby Day went back and did some research on this horse ‘that had never run on dirt’ prior to last year’s Derby win, thusly breaking a tradition in that category I might add.--

But as to ‘keys’ in current breeding strains, I certainly look for those descended from the greatest racehorses: “Free for All”; “Le Fabuluex (Fr.); ”Blushing Groom” (Fr.); “Teddy” (Fr.)-Ajax (Fr.); “Man O’War”; “Prince Rose” (G.B.); “Ribot” (G.B.); and of course, the great “Nearco” of (Ity.) to which most all of the moderns are multiply inbred to. Surely we in the modern era also appreciate breeding lines like those of: “Secretariat”-“Bold Ruler”; “Northern Dancer”-(Nearco); “Nashua”-(Nearco); “Rahy”-“Blushing Groom” (Fr.); “A.P. Indy”-“Seattle Slew”; “Raise a Native”-“Native Dancer”; Princequillo (Ire.)-“Prince Rose” (G.B.); “Hoist the Flag” and “Graustark” the descendants of the Ribot (G.B.); “Dr. Fager” to “Free For All”; and “Buckpasser” to Tom Fool; and, etc., and etc.

You mentioned the filly side of the breeding when searching for increased distance stamina, but you failed to mention any insight into the “Big Heart “X” Factor Gene” strains,--“BHXFG”--specific to the colts through only the dam side,--although some such lines can of course be traced through the sire lines of the fillies,--and that of the connections to: “Blossom Time” (f); “Brushup” (f); “Cosquilla” (G.B.) (f); and “Mah Mahal” (G.B.) (f) and their links as carriers of the “Big Heart “X” Factor Gene”, which I have never seen an article on regarding racing success wise as such at 1 ¼, or at any distance or that matter, but to which I have personally traced all such Kentucky Derby winning horses with those lines back through the 1951 Kentucky Derby.

And yet. it appears, that most all Derby winners were of course all most simply percentage wise multiply inbred to “Nearco” (Ity.), more so than any other line, but then again, “that is why they play the game”, “that’s why the run the race”, “that is why this is the Sport of Kings”, and why the Kentucky Derby is “the Greatest Two Minutes in Sports”, Yes, the winner can come from anywhere, breeding wise, but there are keys to some greater percentage of being winners through those lines so mentioned above.

Just a few added insights and thoughts. Good luck to all in 2012 in your quest in finding those winners. And thank you Steve for opening another year of the blog on Bloodhorse, may you rein here a long time.

Zarvona

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Melanie — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 03:46:09 GMT

Still love my Hansen! Even Man o'War lost once. Secretariat lost one of his Derby preps and still won the Triple Crown. Just goes to prove anything's possible...However, I was wondering - does anyone know why Victor Lebron was replaced on Hansen after his first 2 races? Experience maybe? Seemed like a good fit though...

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Mary — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 03:43:27 GMT

I know a lot of you will disagree with me, but Hansen is a sprinter. He can't be rated; he set some pretty fast fractions, but in the end he's not going to win a whole lot of races on the lead. IMO. Union Rags had a bad day in the breeder's cup, but I do believe he was robbed in not getting the 2 year old champ award, really, what were the voters thinking.

I just think that Union Rags has the pedigree to go all the way. Michael Matz knows that Union Rags can take long breaks and ship out to different tracks and show up in the end. Union Rags is a special horse.

Castellano said that he had ridden some great horses, Bernardini and Ghostzapper come to mind, but he had never had a horse beneath him like Union Rags. Now, Castellano may give up Union Rags for a Pletcher horse, but I don't think so. He is a smart jockey, and he knows he is sitting on a gold mine with Union Rags.

Union Rags IMO, because he appears to be a very intelligent and easy going horse, could be the one. We will see another triple crown winner; perfection comes along every 40 or 50 years. It's all about pedigree, trainer, jockey, and luck. Amen, I have had a couple of cocktails down here in New Orleans and can't wait for the FOY. Oh by the way, just my opinion.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Melanie — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 03:30:28 GMT

Still love my Hansen! Even Man o'War lost once. Was wondering, though, if anyone knows why Victor Lebron was replaced after his first 2 wins on Hansen? Experience maybe? Secretariat lost before taking the Triple Crown, so IMO, anything is still possible...

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Mary — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 03:12:23 GMT

KR, I agree, but Risen Star was his best son. In the Belmont, Risen Star ran the 2nd fast Belmont, his sire being first. Secretariat has produced some great daughters. Somethingroyal, his dam, is a blue hen mare, as is his daughters, Weekend Surprise, Terlinqua, Secrettame, and others. If you are smart, and I know that you are, you are going to look for Secretariat mares in the tail side of a colt's pedigree, and the sire-female and tail side of a filly's pedigree.

re: Haskin's Derby Trail: It's All in the Blood

Mary — Tue, 31 Jan 2012 02:22:02 GMT

Ranagulzion, I sure hope so. Union Rags is a Kentucky Derby kind of horse. I agree, he really was the best horse as a two year old. I think most people feel the same way. Hansen is a wonderful horse, but derby material, I don't know. I will always feel that Union Rags got robbed. He did not get the respect that he deserved. He's the better horse.