Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Householder — Wed, 27 Jun 2012 19:56:36 GMT

Well now it looks like we have a "Kentucky Derby" playoff with heavy weight being assigned to preps that don't typically produce a Kentucky Derby winner (i.e., the Wood Memorial and the Santa Anita Derby). The Breeder's Cup Juv gets left out at 10 points assigned to the winner. Who cares, if "post postion" continues to be random. Draw post 1 as the Wood Memorial winner and continue to lose.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mike Relva — Sat, 23 Jun 2012 21:19:26 GMT

SLEW

Agreed! Enjoy reading your comments-at least you back yours up with FACTS.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Slew — Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:05:24 GMT

Racingfan and Mike...I have yet to see Mary post a correct fact, or admit she's wrong when confronted with an actual fact...she just keeps repeating the same nonsense.

I already pointed out earlier that researchers started questioning Unbridled's Song genetic soundness when Eight Bells broke down.

U's S has averaged 66% starters of racing age, compared to a national average of around 70%. However, it hasn't been proven, and he's had a heck of a lot of stakes winners who compete for years without injury...and that's the first of the RAN line I've seen questioned about soundness in progeny. Perhaps it's more of a fact that he tends to have very large colts and fillies who are more difficult to keep sound in a racing career.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mike Relva — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 02:06:17 GMT

Racingfan

Ditto! Problem is some don't think before they speak.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Racingfan — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 00:54:16 GMT

Mary:

Some of us are equally tired of the constant disrespect you give to Mr Prospector, Raise A Native and Native Dancer! You regularly make statements with no science to back it up. Ya Eight Belles and Barbaro may have had their blood, but so have the many THOUSANDS of others who have not had injuries, including your dear Union Rags. When your blood runs through almost every horse that is racing, there are bound to be some injuries! If you don't like them, just be sure to never buy a horse with their blood - if you can find one. And one last point about stating your OPINIONS as facts. The FACTS do NOT say that Native Dancer was an unsound horse. Since he is my all time favorite I have done EXTENSIVE research on him and his "unsoundness" that you keep harping on was nothing more than FOOT BRUISES which are unforseen injuries not an inherent unsoundness. He never had any physical problems and was nearly perfect in conformation. So get you facts straight or state that you are giving OPINIONS that are not based on fact!

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

CHIEF PICAWINNA — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 21:33:08 GMT

This is Bloodhorse.com so there will always be multiple characters on here posting about breeding.IMO if you want to use breeding to make your pari-mutual wagers,you are using a non-definitive manner of betting on one race.I would think you are actually involved in breeding,buying,consulting, owning or possibly even writing about bloodstock, for me to consider you an expert on this.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Slew — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 21:28:40 GMT

Robinm and Karen: ditto!

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

robinm — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 19:42:52 GMT

Mary, I am a fan of Union Rags as well. I don't happen to think that the 5 crosses to Native Dancer in his 5 generation pedigree make him "an accident waiting to happen" any more than I feel the 2 crosses in Barbaro's made him "an accident waiting to happen". I agree with Karenn in Texas that ND can't be a source of unsoundness only when you choose it to be.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Karen in Texas — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 15:47:34 GMT

Mary---A lack of logic is shown in your assertions as evidenced by robinm's attempt to point out to you at 3:03 and 3:08 A.M. on June 17 that Union Rags has 5 crosses to Native Dancer (2 close up) compared to 2 distant crosses for Barbaro. ND can't be a source of unsoundness only for the horses of your choice. Your statement on June 14 at 10:20 A.M. that UR, Barbaro, and IHA all have Mr. Prospector "close up on the tail side of their pedigrees" is simply false. Maybe you should recheck that. Throwing out glittering generalities doesn't work when others are more careful and can see specific errors in a given statement. As robinm and I both noted, checking and citing a source is always helpful and gives veracity and credibility to any assertion.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

ceil rock — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 14:57:29 GMT

Mary - you left out Frankel. By Galileo (Northern Dancer on top of Mr. Prospector) out of a Danehill mare (Danzig, Northern Dancer line). Do you think he is an accident waiting to happen?

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mike Relva — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 14:12:26 GMT

Mary

Unless you're Mary Z wasn't referring to you. BTW I'm a fan of UR. Perhaps you should re check.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mary — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 02:07:06 GMT

Karen In Texas, the saturation of the Northern Dancer/Raise a Native line in horse pedigrees is a fact. If you look at the pedigrees of Eight Belles, I'll Have Another, Big Brown, etc. you will find that they were accidents waiting to happen. The inbreeding of these lovely horses is absolutely immoral, and that is a fact. If you have no problem with such reckless and unconscionable activity, then so be it. We don't do this with other animals, including humans, for a good reason; it creates all kinds of genetic malformations.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mary — Tue, 19 Jun 2012 01:43:14 GMT

Mike Relva, you have ruined a few sights yourself. I'm not living in fairy tale land. There are many people out there that did not like the Dynaformer/LaVille Rouge breeding. Look it up. All of Barbaro's brothers have gone several months without racing, and Nicanor more than a year. They have issues. I loved Barbaro, but I don't like the location of Mr. Prospector in his pedigree, so whatever.

Simply don't read my posts, problem solved. I love Union Rags, and am getting a little tired of the disrespect he is receiving from some of you.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Karen in Texas — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 15:08:31 GMT

I totally agree, robinm, with providing a basis or citing a source for information, especially if it is offered as a concrete "fact". When other(s) are able to refute those "facts" with a reliable source, then credibility is lost. The "fact" is exposed as a very subjective opinion only.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

CHIEF PICAWINNA — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 14:15:03 GMT

Mike Relva Opinions is what this is all about.I have opinions about medication issues,and a reduction in the number of races, but do you think the business people that make a living on this game give a hoot.They will say anything to keep status quo, which is IMO a problem here as well as the country in general.All they want from me is my pari-mutual dollar.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Slew — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 14:13:52 GMT

Chief: And Secreatariat would have smoked everyone...what's the point? Rags won...fairly. Accept it.

Mike..2 different Mary's.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

robinm — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 08:29:58 GMT

I love to see all of the different points of views, I love a good, well-founded argument and I love the opportunity to learn more about race horses and horse racing. But when people spout off misinformation I go a little nuts. I don't mean to offend anyone, but when you make an opinion or more importantly, state something as fact, please provide the basis of your opinion or proof of fact.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mary Zinke — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 04:53:37 GMT

Other Mary, do you have a last initial that hopefully is not Z? Maybe it's R for Rags?

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mary Zinke — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 01:02:37 GMT

M.R., She's not me. (LOL)

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mike Relva — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 00:08:04 GMT

CHIEF PICAWINNA

That's only an opinion when the fact is Curlin is retired and there's no way of truly knowing the outcome.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Mike Relva — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 00:05:35 GMT

SLEW

Exactly! She ruined one racing site, now she's intent of ruining another.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

CHIEF PICAWINNA — Sun, 17 Jun 2012 23:02:44 GMT

On the subject of RAGS the newest Rags is not as good as the previous RAGS that won the Belmont.Sorry chums but Curlin would smoke BOTH at EQUAL weights,and laugh about it in his stall after the race.

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

ceil rock — Sun, 17 Jun 2012 17:02:04 GMT

When I was comparing Union Rags to Quality Road, I meant that both of them have been overhyped - neither lived up to the hype. Quality Road was a brilliantly fast horse. Too bad he wasn't campaigned as a sprinter/miler instead of trying to get 10 furlongs. Union Rags has basically been a slow horse who loves Belmont Park. I don't think Beyer speed figures are perfect but they are a measuring stick. Union Rags is going to have to get a higher Beyer than 96 to get any respect. (As a comparison, Quality Road's highest Beyer was 121.)

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Karen in Texas — Sun, 17 Jun 2012 14:57:29 GMT

If Union Rags' broodmare sire's female line "cured" soundness issues, then what happened with Awesome Feather? She was out in early 2011 for tendon problems. Gone West is her broodmare sire as well, and her DI is even lower than Rags' (stamina.) Gone West is close up in the pedigrees (top or bottom) of numerous unsound horses. It is foolhardy to declare that any horse cannot or will not ever injure a leg, regardless of pedigree. Really, it's almost tempting fate.

www.equineline.com/Free-5X-Pedigree.cfm

re: Haskin's Belmont Recap: Rag Time

Slew — Sun, 17 Jun 2012 12:43:14 GMT

robinm: It is a shame but Mary seems to have no concept of logic or fact. Misinformation is her favorite mode of travel...and I'm beginning to feel that real life will never intrude on her imaginary kingdom, as myopic as it might be.