Time For a Filly Triple Crown

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

merasmag — Fri, 04 Jul 2014 09:50:21 GMT

sumtimes coming late to the party is a good thing. I just read this article and all the comments, and have decided that a triple crown for the girls should be limited to FOUR year olds. that way, when they get rid of the points system (which can't happen soon enough), the girls can run in the "Triple Crown" races and the next year they can have their own series. THEN, when THAT becomes successful, there will be a hat trick triple crown series for 4 and 5 yos of both sexes. then we'll have us sum racing again.

You're welcome.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

mike g rutherford — Wed, 02 Jul 2014 02:26:31 GMT

Having a true Triple Crown for fillies should not be confined to NY. The best 3 year old filly race is the KY Oaks and then the Alabama. 1st race should be KY Oaks, 2nd race should be in California, 3rd The Alabama.That gives fillies plenty of time between races and is spread out all over the US. A winner gets a trophy and bonus.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

JoyJackson21 — Sun, 29 Jun 2014 17:10:01 GMT

Excellent article, Steve, as usual. It is always a pleasure to read your articles. Well done!

I love the idea of a filly (3 years old)or mare (4 years old and above) Triple Crown series. There is no reason why there shouldn't be one, although I also personally can't see any fair and equitable reason why fillies are not running in the current Triple Crown series under the existing points system. After all, Genuine Risk, Winning Colors and Regret have all won the Kentucky Derby; Rags To Riches and Rachel Alexandra have defeated the boys in the other two legs of the crown; and Zenyatta, Black Caviar and Gentldonna have been powerhouse winning machines against male competitors throughout the years;and the last two winners of the Prix de L'Arc de Triomphe have been female horses, winning against 13+ male horses in each of those races. The argument that female horses are vulnerable does not wash with me. And in the case of Eight Belles, that beautiful, brave filly clearly beat 18 of the best male horses of their generation that year (2008) in Kentucky that day, and was only a short distance behind Big Brown when they crossed the finish line of the Kentucky Derby, quite a feat in itself. She is still quite a wonderful inspiration, and heroine, today. Her death in that race that day was the exception for female horses racing against males, not the rule. RIP, great filly. I will love you always, Eight Belles.

Back to the female Triple Crown - it would be great to have one. The world should be as well versed about Untapable and her accomplishments as they are about California Chrome's accomplishments. If a female Triple Crown series is to succeed, the industry needs to make the series blend both tradition and excitement to garner interest in the series for the non-racing fan public to help the series catch on, especially among women (would would be intrigued by a Triple Crown series featuring female horses)and the young, where the growth of the industry truly lies. To add interest and a needed twist to the new series, TPTB could make a nod to tradition making the Kentucky Oaks the first leg of the Crown, the Black-Eyed Susan the second leg, and make either the Ashland or a highly-prestigious stakes race out in California at Santa Anita Race Track the third leg of the filly Triple Crown. It would create interest and word of mouth about the series. Excellent hype is what has been missing in the mix in the previous tries at launching this series.

Thanks again, Steve. Have a great week!

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Mary — Thu, 26 Jun 2014 02:37:30 GMT

Slee, don't forget that Chief's Crown's broodmare sire was Secretariat.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

JayJay — Tue, 24 Jun 2014 04:28:39 GMT

Coldfacts : The fact that Eight Belles broke down competing against the boys, Rags To Riches retired one race after the Belmont and Rachel Alexandra was never herself after that grueling campaign against the boys and older males I think justifies a Filly Triple crown. It doesn’t make sense for you to use Genuine Risk or even Winning Colors as examples. The fillies of the past decade were all bred from horses who won few Graded races and retired. They are not as durable as the horses before them like Geniuine Risk or even Winning Colors.

I'm still of the opinion that US fillies are not bred to be competitive against the boys, because they are not trained that way. Even Zenyatta is not bred to run against the boys but she is an exception because she wasn't run to the ground, she was handled carefully by Shireffs and she was trained with the "horse first, racing second" mentality regardless of the criticisms given to her connections. She ran as a 6 yr old and she did a lot for the racing industry regardless of how they raced her. If the sole purpose of the filly triple crown is to attract more fans into the game, then I don’t think it’s a good idea as that will just put pressure on the trainer to race the fillies much earlier than they should be (like the colts.)

I think if the powers that be starts creating more 10F races, things might change. Pedigree Ann mentioned so many races that used to be classic distances but have all been shortened. If we have more 10 or 12F races, breeders and trainers will change their ways, we can rebuild and see the return of durable horses who can run and still be dominant at 5 or even 6. I would also get rid of the “day trader” type investors who wants a quick return on their investment which changes the trainers mindset…they all have to answer to their bosses and if they want their money and profit, the trainer is forced to run their horse before they are ready. I would prefer to see horses start running at 3 and continue running at 5 than see them run at 2 and retire at 3. You can’t keep fans if the horses that got their attention is retired 4 races after they started showing brilliance which is what happen to most 3 yr olds now.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Frank Angst — Mon, 23 Jun 2014 18:33:16 GMT

It's such an obvious idea and I'm partial to the Ky., N.Y., Cal. idea. (California should have a classic!). It would be of great interest to racing and on the breeding side it would give us that many more classic winners (and relatives of classic winners).

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Slewguru — Mon, 23 Jun 2014 03:00:08 GMT

Steel Dragon,

The great Davona Dale had two colts by Seattle Slew, Macau, Le Voyageur and a filly, Mistletoe Time. Most notably was Le Voyageur, who finished third in the Belmont Stakes behind Easy Goer and Sunday Silence.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Coldfacts — Sun, 22 Jun 2014 15:24:26 GMT

Interesting suggestion! Is there a Triple Crown for Fillies in the other major racing jurisdictions?

Despite the appeal for a TC for fillies, I cannot lend my supports to same if it will be given the same status as the existing TC. I recognize that I will be again viewed as being on the opposing side of yet another issue but I think negatives supersede the positives.

Let’s assume a colt won two legs of the traditional TC and finish runner up in the other. Let’s also assume that the Filly TC is completed in the same year. Let’s further assume that there is no dominant older horse. Would the TC winning filly be assured of the Eclipse for HOY awards? It is highly unlikely that a winner of the traditional TC would not be voted HOY irrespective of what occurs in the older horses division. If the ward is not made to the filly it would diminish significance of the Filly TC.

The existing TC is opened to fillies. Genuine Risk won the Derby and was runner up in the Preakness and Belmont. With her achievements, it cannot be either specified or inferred that fillies are incapable of winning the traditional TC.

While the participation of fillies in the Triple Crown series has declined significantly over the years, three have combined to complete the TC in the last 26 years i.e., Winning Colors, Rags To Riches and Rachel Alexandra. A prestigious TC for fillies would likely deter participation in the traditional TC and thus robbing the public of the battle of the genders in the most celebrated series of races for 3YOs.

In every 3YOs crop there is likely to be a dominant male and a dominant female. In most instances the dominant female towers over her fellow females and occasionally over her male counterparts. The likes of Eight Belles, Rags To Riches and Rachel Alexandra would have easily completed a Filly TC barring injury. Would it be a stretch to speculate, that a dominant female is more likely to complete a gender specific TC, than a dominant male completing the traditional TC. The frequency of a Filly TC winner would make it less impactful and deemed to lack the difficulties of the traditional TC.

In the last 10 years, three female were awarded the Eclipse for HOY. All the recipients defeated males en route to securing their HOY awards. Why should there be a special TC for fillies when they have proven they are quite capable of defeating their male counterparts.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Arthur Wellesley — Sun, 22 Jun 2014 14:05:01 GMT

In England there is a Filly Triple Crown composing of the 1000 Guineas at Newmarket (May), The Oaks at Epsom (June) and the St Leger at Doncaster (September). This was last achieved by the Sir Henry Cecil trained Oh So Sharp in 1985. The 1000 Guineas is the filly's version of the 2000 Guineas, run a day earlier and the Oaks the filly's version of The Derby, run the day after. However, the St Leger is open to both sexes and is the final leg of the Triple Crown for both colts and fillies trying to win the Triple Crown. I wonder if this is an option to be looked at whereby the Belmont Stakes is the the final leg for the fillies' as well as the colts, it would certainly build more interest when the the Triple Crown isn't on the line for a colt but is for a filly. Furthermore, it would diminish any idea that it is easier for a filly to win a Triple Crown than a colt. Also, I would love the idea of the first leg being over a mile, as you mentioned. In England, the Triple Crown for both sexes starts of at a mile, then a mile and a half before the 14 furlong stamina test of The St Leger, the idea being that as a 3 year old progresses through their season they should naturally need further as they mature. Once upon a time it was considered that a Triple Crown winner would then go on to contest the Gold Cup at Royal Ascot over 2 and a half miles the following year.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Arts and Letters — Sat, 21 Jun 2014 03:42:29 GMT

Once upon a time, the Breeders Cup was actually pretty good. One day of racing only, 7 races that often forced the best colts and fillies to run together, located at various tracks around the country (+ Canada once)... And then it got watered down. How many races are there now? 52? 93? The great fillies/mares don't have any reason to take on the colts now. Races come and go. It's almost always at Santa Anita.

I wish they would bring back the original 7 races.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

FlyingJ — Fri, 20 Jun 2014 11:26:37 GMT

The Breeders cup has done more damage to the sport (as well as to the horses) than good. The reshuffling of important races to accommodate it is one example.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Ta Wee — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 04:44:24 GMT

Dark Mirage had the great misfortune of being in the same year year as the immortal Dr. Fager who was having his season for the ages. She would've been horse of the year in probably half the years since. She seems somewhat forgotten especially in your top 100. With the exception of the incomparable Ruffian, and maybe Rachel Alexandra she was as dominant a 3yo filly as I've seen in the last 46 years.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Racingfan — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 03:14:39 GMT

Ksweatman9 - I am not sure how much "we" the racing fans can accomplish but I don't think it can hurt to try. The day after the Belmont, I sent an email to Mr Panza at NYRA commending him on the Belmont card and suggesting he bring back the triple tiara or get with the other tracks about a filly TC. I also suggested he work to bring back the "handicap triple crown" which is a series that has had only 3 or 4 winners. So, if we ALL were to let those in charge know what we would like to see, just maybe something would happen. Someone on here also mentioned a "handicap triple" for older females too which is another great idea. That way the 3 year old colts and fillies each have their crowns and the older colts and fillies have theirs as well.... The thing is, will people actually take the time to try and make their interest known?

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Paula Higgins — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 02:41:50 GMT

A truly GREAT idea Steve and one that should be pursued. If you look at many of the people blogging about horses you will notice they are women. Women are supporting great female horses in numbers not seen before. It is time for the powers that be, to take advantage of women supporting women(fillies). I wonder if a Filly Triple Crown series of races shouldn't include 4 year olds as well. I worry that the push to get horses on the track at 3 can be too much too soon for certain horses. For example, Zenyatta would never have competed in Triple Crown filly races because she wasn't ready. If they want to restrict them to 3 year olds, make the races later in the season. I also think they need to spread them out more, not just for females but for males as well. For those of us who don't want to tamper with tradition, all I can say is that tradition is getting us nowhere fast and it is better for the horses to have more time between races. Even the British get that. Lets do what is humane for the horses. The video of California Chrome walking back to the barn after the Belmont said it all. Lets do it right the first time if a Filly Triple Crown is started.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

TrueChampion — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 22:56:47 GMT

Opening up myself to ridicule - but worth it. The next Triple Crown Winner (Kentucky Derby-Preakness-Belmont) will be a filly.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

livewire — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 20:09:59 GMT

Warlaine

The reason filly and fillies and mares races are less lucrative is they are restricted to their sex. If a filly or mare wants to earn more money (and respect) she must run against the open races which are what most think of as races for the colts. This is only because fillies and mares rarely race against colts in this country which is why when they succeed i.e. Zenyatta, Rachel Alexandra, Rags to Riches, Winning Colors, Lady's Secret, and Genuine Risk, they are immediately vaulted into the public limelight.

Our history with racing is one of the most intriguing and rich amongst sports competition. Although, I can't agree with the Ladies Handicap as a race with much historical significance. It was usually the last grade 1 of the year, held at Aqueduct and won by a deserving, hard knocking mare as more of a consolation prize when the best had been retired or their campaigns were completed for the year. Really, a better race to lament is the Ruffian which was at one time the middle race in the fall handicap triple comprised of the Maskette (now Go for Wand), Ruffian, and Beldame. This series had a logical progression of distances, mile, mile and one-eighth, and mile and one-quarter. As a series of races open to 3 years old and as a handicap series. This series provided some of the best racing. I still remember the finish with Bold N Determined and Genuine Risk gutting it out to the wire in that series.

There is no reason why the Maskette could not be scheduled for Saratoga enabling the Ruffian and Beldame to occur with the timing required to fit in with the Distaff. Or is it shelved because the Distaff is now a mile and one-eighth. A race well within the scope of most milers with class.

If there was any logic to a triple for fillies, there should be a similar succession of distance progressions such as Kentucky Oaks would be a mile, then a mile and one eighth on memorial weekend, followed by a mile and one-quarter.

Personally, I would love to see more mile and one-half races scheduled. I think the betting public would be receptive and from what I have been hearing on the Steve Byk show, there has been interest from horseman in filling races with such distances. I believe an allowance race with a long distance just filled with 14 horses.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

RacingFan1992 — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 17:39:39 GMT

Here is my proposal: Why not have a "Filly Grand Slam"?

Kentucky Oaks-1 1/8-Churchill Downs

Black-Eyed Susan Stakes-1 1/8- Pimlico

Acorn Stakes-1 Mile-Belmont Park

Mother Goose Stakes-1 1/8-Aqueduct

Coaching Club American Oaks-1/ 1/2-Belmont Park

Alabama Stakes-1 1/4-Saratoga

Space the series from the first Friday in May to the first Saturday in August.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Warlaine — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 17:27:04 GMT

Could not agree more. Something about the girls racing seems to endear to the racing public some thing more. Which is why I ask the question, why are the graded filly and mare stakes worth less money than the colts? purses?

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Terri Drennen — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 13:08:30 GMT

Some of you may not remember the TRUE greats (RUFFIAN) of the Filly Triple Crown, who won it without an effort. And Dark Mirage, Chris Evert. Of course, my number one is the Greatest, Ruffian, she could sprint, get the long distance of 1.5 miles without breaking a sweat. The bottom line, we do NOT have the horses of the past winners quality anymore. If a colt wins a few races that make the owners a million bucks, they are immediately whisked away to "stand" somewhere! Just how many stallions do we really need?! This is the watering down of the industry, why we do not have the quality of horses we had in the 70's, and the true blue fans that witnessed all the REAL greatness remember how it was, and how it still should be. Every year, I get solicited by tons of stallion owners saying their stud is the next best thing to sliced bread. No, if the fillies cannot do the real, REAL TC as it was originally established, then they do not need to lower the rules/races of the sport because the quality of the breed has been lowered. The almighty buck. Horses now are not at their best until at least four or five years old, if they have not already had their bones compromised by pounding two year olds' legs into the ground. I think that some other issues need to be addressed prior to creating a new named series of races that are not equivalent to the ORIGINAL filly Triple Crown. Same reason why we do not have a colt TC now. What's going on here? Also, while I enjoyed Zenyatta and Rachel, if anyone thinks either one of them could have caught Ruffian (again, a sprinter and a long distance horse wrapped up in a show horse's body) they are incredibly wrong. Ruffian could not, nor would have been caught. She was not whipped..and broke track records on her own, going all distances, with the SAME short amount of time inbetween those TC races. Don't water down the meaning of the races because the breed is now inferior. It is up to the assembly line money hungry breeders out there to be responsible and create quality, not quantity. Until someone can control this out of control industry, it is just going to continue to have less fans, less interest, and the continued ongoing negative thoughts by most that used to love the sport for what it once was. Just my opinion. Thank you..

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Pedigree Ann — Tue, 17 Jun 2014 08:20:56 GMT

The NYRA has tarnished the names of so many historic races it is not funny. Look at the Ladies' H, G1 10f at Aqueduct in early November. Yes, its spot on the calendar was taken over by the BC Distaff. So after Saratoga saved the Delaware H (G1) from disappearing when its track closed for a few years, why not put the Ladies' H name on the replacement when Delaware Park took its own race back? No, that would have been too logical; have to degrade the Ladies' name by running it on the inner track year after year. Then shorten it, then bury it in the middle of winter until nobody remembers what a great race it once was.

Just one example. There are dozens. Do you know that in the Bobinski-Zamoyski Tables which race was honored with the symbol UO, meaning the Oaks race for the entire USA? Yep, the CCA Oaks. The Fillies' Belmont. Exalt its prep race, the Acorn (from tiny acorns grow mighty oaks), demean the Oaks. The NYRA trashes another bit of US racing history. Ho-hum.

Oh, and the Grading committee doesn't get a bye, either. A race that is substantially changed is supposed to lose its grade until re-established at its new conditions, but the rules apparently don't apply to the NYRA (or Gulfstream, for that matter.) Changing the track where a race is contested, the time of year (has to do with the kind of field attracted), AND the distance by a furlong or more don't count as substantial changes? Crazy!

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

honor code — Mon, 16 Jun 2014 22:12:40 GMT

A filly TC would be AWESOME!

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

Soldier Course — Mon, 16 Jun 2014 20:34:45 GMT

"Imagine a Triple Crown last year that pitted Beholder, Princess of Sylmar, and Close Hatches in all three races and the marketing possibilities that would have existed."

Steve: Are you suggesting here that the filly TC series should be structured to require a cumulative effect, meaning that those running in the second leg had to have run in the first leg, and those running in the third leg had to have run in the first two legs?

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

livewire — Mon, 16 Jun 2014 20:26:36 GMT

Absolutely agree with Steve. There was a time when the decision makers at the NYRA were about making wise decisions with scheduling and establishing a stakes program. The problem is the NYRA has obliterated many of the "triples" which were under its control. The filly version, handicap triple, fall triples for both handicap divisions, male and female. Very few of the stakes races that made up these traditions still exist today, and those that do are not held in the same regard as their past renditions.

Suffice it to say, should any triples ever be resurrected or established again it will take the cooperation and commitment of other racetracks to succeed. Possibly even corporate sponsorship similar to the type we had in the 80s when it became necessary to motivate Preakness entrants after Spend a Buck skipped the Preakness to pursue a bonus with the Jersey Derby.

I agree with John Veitch, one of the unintended consequences of the Breeders Cup has been the removal of the fall championship races from the New York calendar and the alteration of the races that still exist. Also, other racetracks have seen fit to mirror the packaging of major races on the same day as opposed to having these races stand on their own or highlighted/advertised with their own particular weekend.

Having the Metropolitan Handicap moved from Memorial Day Weekend was unnecessary, and the Acorn was given the same consideration as any Grade 3 event. Untappable skipped the race, if it held it's old importance she would not have. Frankly, what needs to happen is a coordination between the three racetracks that constitute the Triple Crown to allow Pimlico a chance to showcase racing on the weekend of the Preakness. If Churchill Downs has the 3 year olds, mile turf horses, and sprinters, then allow Pimlico to card races for the 3 year old grass horses, handicap turf horses and dirt horses, then Belmont Park, with it's 3 week gap could card whichever division it chooses. Pimlico has become the middle child and does deserve some respect and consideration if us as horse racing fans can expect the Triple Crown to continue.

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

sceptre — Mon, 16 Jun 2014 20:04:19 GMT

Not what anyone (here) wants to hear, but:

Any series of races that is designed (through prestige and/or bonuses) to entice owners into participating in the entirety is detrimental to the horse. Yes, it may benefit the sport, but tends to have the horse perform at a timing less than optimum (no matter what the spacing may be).

re: Time For a Filly Triple Crown

livewire — Mon, 16 Jun 2014 19:52:41 GMT

Steel Dragon-Here is your answer regarding Six Crowns, below. She was the first broodmare sired by Secretariat to provide evidence of the broodmare sire he would become. After Six Crowns, followed Terlingua-dam of Storm Cat, Weekend Surprise-dam of Summer Squall and A P Indy, Secretame-dam of Gone West and others in addition to these 3. There was a Blood Horse magazine article not too long ago which talked about these mares who have provided some of the most influential stallions of this modern era.

Six Crowns, the stakes winning dam of champion Chief's Crown and multiple grade I winner Classic Crown, was euthanized due to the infirmities of old age on Thursday, February 14 at the age of 26. The daughter of Secretariat will be buried at Robert N. Clay's Three Chimneys Farm next to her dam, Filly Triple Crown winner Chris Evert.

Produced from the mating of two members of racing's Hall of Fame, Six Crowns was bred by Carl Rosen and owned her entire life by Rosen, and then his family. She won the Meadow Queen Stakes and placed in six more stakes races, including the Ladies Handicap (gr. I) at age three. Retired to the breeding shed with earnings of $136,274, as a broodmare Six Crowns exceeded her racetrack accomplishments.

Her second foal was champion 2-year-old Chief's Crown, winner of the inaugural Breeders' Cup Juvenile (gr. I) in 1984, as well as the Norfolk, Hopeful, and Cowdin Stakes, all grade I. His grade I wins as a 3-year-old came in the Marlboro Cup Invitational Handicap, Flamingo, Travers, and Blue Grass. Chief's Crown also ran second that in the Preakness and third in both the Kentucky Derby and Belmont Stakes. Chief's Crown stood at Three Chimneys near Midway, Ky. until his death in 1997,following a paddock accident.

The fourth foal produced from Six Crowns was Classic Crown, winner of the Frizette Stakes Gazelle Handicap, both grade I. Classic Crown, who earned $535,919, also placed in the Beldame, Ruffian, and Test, all grade I stakes.

Six Crowns is also the second dam of Japanese stakes winner and near-millionaire Silk Phoenix and is the third dam of 2002 Triple Crown nominee French Assault, winner of the El Joven S. and second in the Kentucky Cup Juvenile S (gr. III) as a 2-year-old last year. She produced a 2001 filly by El Prado.