Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Lava'sStilltheMan — Thu, 04 Sep 2014 04:03:52 GMT

I am curious to see how Shared Belief will continue to progress. With his connections I expect that he will be well managed. I went to his romp on dirt at Los Al. He certainly passed the eye test that day although it was not exactly a stellar field. Candy Boy is a nice horse but he appears to be a cut below the top equines in this 3yo crop at this stage. Game on Dude fired in the Pacific Classic. His one dimensional way of going was compromised by pressure from an outsider from the get go. The race set up perfectly for Shared Belief. May SB have a long career like the Dude, who although he has fired some duds has danced all of the dances for several seasons.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Coldfacts — Tue, 02 Sep 2014 15:19:02 GMT

"If Shared Belief wins the Breder's Cup Classic this year, keeping his undefeated record intact, he could run up a Zenyatta-like streak in the future"

An interesting hypothesis. There are similarities between Zenyatta and SB. Both are dominant of synthetic and lightly races on dirt. However, the brilliant race mare ventured outside CA for her 4th start and 1st on dirt. Her racing career was meticulously managed. Her connections avoided big races on the East coast and she was unbeatable in CA.

The same scenario could work for SB. However there were no fillies/mares in CA that could match strides with Zenyatta. Certainly, California Chrome if he is worth his salt should provide meaningful competition for SB.

Candy boy has been defeated handily twice by CC and SB. This suggests they might just be on par with each other. Will the connections play the avoidance game? I hope not as racing needs rivalries.

CC has already made starts in four states and with his expected participation in the PA Derby that will make it five. He could have contested the Awesome Again on a track that he has decimated the opposition in his last 3 appearances. However, with the incentives and bigger purse the PA Derby is a no brainer.

The connections of SB could have opted for a $1M PA Derby and an out of state test. However, the $250K Awesome Again got the vote. Why run such a brilliant horse in a race with a $250K purse when it could easily win one with a purse of $1M?

Is this an indication of developing pattern? Bayern was sent to the Haskell, Candy Boy to the WV Derby and CC to the PA Derby. SB stays at home. Shipping and winning is never easy so keeping SB in CA might just be the best approach if Zenyatta like streak is the objective.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Jermon — Tue, 02 Sep 2014 04:15:21 GMT

Apparently my rebuttal to Sceptre was waste-canned. That's all well and good. Life goes on.

The posting I made on 28 Aug 2014 was from memory. The only thing I feel guilty of is that I should have taken the time to word it better. Because of the friction it created I contacted a sister who was executor of my mother's estate to ask if by chance she had come across any of my personal property when she prepared our former family residence for sale. Lo and behold, she had two large manila envelopes containing a number of publications and clippings relative to the thoroughbred horse and racing. Among them were some concerning Ribot, covering his entire history to that time. The info that is pertinent to my posting was in a column by Leon Rasmussen found in The Morning Telegraph dated May 17, 1965 entitled "Ribot's Offspring Have Won Classics In Four Nations Now." The paragraph from which I quoted follows;

Oddly enough, Ribot's offspring have never been too popular with buyers and some prominent breeders have been known to knock him. This is probably because Ribot's get have come in all shapes and sizes and colors. The hallmark of a good sire is that he stamped his get in his own image. Ribot has not. Yet look at what he has done standing in three different countries in a comparatively short span of time. They may not look like him, but a good many of them run like him.

In an accompanying article by Joe Hirsch, he opens a paragraph by saying "Galbreath has taken something of a beating since bringing Ribot to the U.S." He doesn't go on to say exactly what the beating was about. That long ago, its hard to remember everything. I don't think it was in reference to finances. It may have in reference to verbal flak.

Whether or not you post this is up to you.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Ranagulzion — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 21:23:17 GMT

Steve:

When a brilliant horse has Hyperion inbreeding as close up as Shared Belief does, chances are, that's a main source of his class. If Shared Belief wins the Breder's Cup Classic this year, keeping his undefeated record in tact, he could run up a Zenyatta-like streak in the future. He's an exciting horse but he still has a lot to prove on dirt against the like of California Chrome, Wicked Strong, Bayern and rising star, V E Day.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Ranagulzion — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 20:39:51 GMT

Coldfacts 27 Aug 2014 7:07 PM:

You response to Sceptre's disparging remarks was hilarious to say the least ...and you've pretty much done better than hold your own against his vitriol ...you've knocked him out with the cold facts in the Candy Ride/Candy Boy skirmish. Kudos to you buddy ...way to go!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Coldfacts — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 20:31:33 GMT

Scepter,

After reading your post directed to Jermon, I decided to read the one directed to me. I should have pointed out this fact. I was not being dishonest when I advised you that I bypassed it initially.

If I had seeing your comments I would have addressed them in my initial response as I totally disagree with your views. I was surprised that your comments were not as offensive as they have been in the past.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

JayJay — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 19:59:23 GMT

I'm not a big fan of Durkin, not because I don't like him, I'm just not familiar with his calls (except the big races) and I've gotten so used to the aussie / south african race callers (Wrona at GG and Denman at SA). I find them more consistent and accurate with their calls...and they can be pretty funny as well.

Yesterday at GG, in the 6th race, the 4 horse was 0 for 26 trying to graduate and they're trying him on the turf for the first time and won easily. Wrona's comments were "I'm sure they (connections) were scratching their heads and thought " why didn't we try this sooner ?!?" " lol.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Racingfan — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 15:57:53 GMT

Another great article and beautiful photos! Thanks! In addition to the Ribot article, how about a Tom Durkin one? I would LOVE to know more about him as he certainly seems like a genuinely nice person as well as being a very talented race caller!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

American Pegasus — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 15:11:19 GMT

Thanks for the informative article.

I was fortunate to watch one of Shared Belief's workouts at GGF and I became an immediate fan.

I am happy for a former partner Kevin Nish of KMN Racing for being part of the connections. Who says you can't be struck by lighting twice? Well the connections here did so with Mizdirection and now with Shared Belief.

Congrats to all!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

futurefoal — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 19:56:02 GMT

Thank you sir, for bringing up Grenfall. I bred my older mare to him twice while he was at UC Davis, but neither breeding took, as he was having breeding issues then. I so wanted a filly from him exactly for as you brought up, for his dam and her dam, Banquet Bell, who was also Broodmare of the Year (as was Primonetta). Banquet Bell as you pointed out foaled Chateaugay, Ky Derby winner, and Luiana, the dam of Little Current, who would have won the triple crown if there hadn't been 24 in the 74 Derby, finishing fifth after making five runs through traffic. His his book "Shoe" (who I threw up on horses in the mid 60s as a groom for Charlie Comiskey)recalled Graustark while riding Port Wine in a stakes race in Chicago in 66. Port Wine had won four straight at Hollywood Park including the $100,000 Futurity easily. Shoe said he had a two length lead with a hand full of horse at the top of the turn when Graustark (making his first start and the 3-2 favorite) came up on Port Wine just long enough to say goodbye, and opened up 8 on the field. This is why we love these horses,we see great horses once again and favorites and they live again! The example I give to my friends is AP Indy; sired by Seattle Slew, still the only triple Crown winner, and out of a Secretariat mare!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

sceptre — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 19:51:34 GMT

Coldfacts:

I believe you stated that you bypassed my submission. What changed? On top of everything else, me thinks you're a dishonest sort.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Coldfacts — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 18:06:47 GMT

Tom Durkin's call in the last furlong and a half of the 2009 Kentucky Derby was one of his worst. It did not capture in any memorable way the acceleration, the needle treading move against the rails and the ridiculing gesture displayed by his rider.

His commentary was disjointed, lack smoothness and had moments of pause as he was very late in recognizing the horse that bolted through on the rails. To cap of his bad last 2F call was his call was his comments after the line “An impossible result here” With his experience in calling the KD, he should have known that there is nothing impossible in the Kentucky Derby.

Giacomoo the previous 50-1 winner had only a MSW victory to his credit. MTB was the Canadian champion 2YO with significantly more victories.

He was simply not prepared to call a race that covered every eventuality. Consequently he was not his usual creative self when MIB emerged with the lead and was left struggling for words. In short, he was dumb struck.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

FMagellan — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 16:21:52 GMT

It is extremely difficult to assess where a "freak" comes from. You may be right but it is just as likely that the random way Secretariat influences progeny of his grandsons (Storm Cat, Gone West, Dehere, and AP Indy as the best examples) that came shining through here. All have produced great ones and dogs.

And, once in a while a true freak shows up with very little explanation. The best example here is Dr. Fager. He was definitely one of the greats of all time but a look at his pedigree leaves you bewildered as to where he came from, unless you accept the premise that he was ALL TEDDY (4x5x5)!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Dr Drunkinbum — Sat, 30 Aug 2014 15:52:20 GMT

This is the way I see it on Tom Durkin's call of the 2009 Kentucky Derby with Mine That Bird. It just accentuated how extraordinary and astonishing Mine That Bird's race and achievement was. It was like he came out of nowhere so fast, it was difficult for the eye to see and the mind to decipher what was happening. Tom Durkin is the greatest, and I hope he enjoys his well deserved retirement, with no regrets. So many magical moments including his 2009 Kentucky Derby call. I like the call. It really corresponds well with a 50-1 shot. This isn't happening, how could it be happening, what just happened !!!!!!!

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Ribot — Sat, 30 Aug 2014 13:36:01 GMT

Hope your not teasing us Steve, can't wait for the Ribot blog. Sounds like the perfect project for you when the Breeders Cup races conclude and the winter doldrums set in.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Coldfacts — Fri, 29 Aug 2014 15:21:50 GMT

Sceptre

“Candy Ride is approaching elite sire status, and for good reason”

Do the cold facts reflect that Candy Ride is approaching elite sire status?

Between 2005 and 2010 Candy Ride bred 887 mares that represent his 6 crops that have raced. There were 628 named foals and 396 runners resulting in a 63% of runners to name foals.

Of his six 3YO crops to race he has produced 8 G1 winners and 7 were in his first 3 crops. Eight G1 winners from 396 runners represents 2%. He has a grand total of three Derby starters from those 6 3YO crops:

2009 - Chocolate Candy 5th

2010 - Sidney’s Candy 17th

2014 – Candy Boy 13th

He was bred to 182, 172, 182, 139 and 138 between 2009 and 2013. I consider him overbred between 2009 and 2011.

His best runners before Shared belief were Twirling Candy, Sidney’s Candy and Misremembered.

There are several stallions that have far superior record to Candy Ride and merit being cited as approaching elite status. Hard Spun was a nose away from being the sire of the Arlington Million and the Travers in the same year. These are two prestigious G1 races contested on two different surfaces.

If this stallion with 2%, G1 winners from runners and 3 unplaced Derby starters is approaching elite sire status, there is hope for me to secure my GED and thus be removed from my stuck on stupid status.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Coldfacts — Fri, 29 Aug 2014 13:51:18 GMT

“Candy Boy is a superior talent to any that competed in the Travers”

I am the dish washer and you are the college grad and academic. It therefore stands to reason that you should be far superior in analyzing data and performances in arriving at reasonable conclusions that present no possibility of being labeled ‘utter nonsense.’

Unlike you, I will not be unkind and attach a dismissive label to your above conclusion. However, I will allow the cold facts to speak for themselves.

Candy Boy: (10 Starts, 2-4-1; Earnings: $675K)

He broke his maiden in his 4th start and has 1, G2 stakes victory. Finished 13th in KD!

Wicked Strong: (10 Starts, 3-2-1; Earnings: $1.5M)

He broke his maiden in his 2nd start and has victories in G1&G2 stakes. Finished 4th in KD & BEL; 1st Wood & Jim Dandy!

Tonalist: ( 7 Starts, 3-2-1; Earnings: $1,2M)

He broke his maiden in his 2nd start and has victories in G1&G2 stakes. Won – BEL & Peter Pan!

V E Day: (6 Starts, 4-1- 0; Earnings: $829K)

He broke his maiden in his 3rd start and has not lost 3 sun sequent starts. Has a G1 stakes victory. Won - Travers!

List above are the records for Candy Boy and the top 3 finishers from the Travers. I do not profess to be as bright as you are but it appears that the 3 from the Travers have more wins; have G1 wins and more earnings.

Tonalist defeated top rated California Chrome in the Belmont a colt that left Candy Boy toiling in his wake in the SA & KD Derby. Wicked Strong that finished 4th in the Belmont has since defeated Tonalist twice. V E Day defied both in the G1 Travers.

If the careers of the above 4 colts should end today, where do you believe Candy Boy would be ranked amongst the four?

If a stud farm was considering one of the four for duties, do you believe Candy Boy would be first choice?

I am aware that you are a very brig individual. But I am also acutely aware that too much learning maketh thee mad.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Harrison — Fri, 29 Aug 2014 03:00:14 GMT

Always enjoy reading your pedigree articles. However, what I see in Shared Belief's background is a distressing list of short careers due to ankle/foot weaknesses (thru Mr. Prospector line). Fortunately Shared Belief will never pass on these tendencies, but since he's already had foot issues, I wonder how long he will be able to compete. Perhaps his future is on turf not dirt.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Paula Higgins — Fri, 29 Aug 2014 02:30:25 GMT

Steve, sounds like a Ribot piece might be coming soon. He was probably the greatest European horse of all time. Nice of you to donate his bridle to Old Friends(museum).

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Daniel Jividen — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:01:38 GMT

Great old photos. Pleasant memories of a better world. Grenfall is one of the best looking yearlings I've ever seen.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Steve Haskin — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 18:44:25 GMT

Funny, you hear about the look of Graustark and how he looked very little like Ribot, there was speculation by some for years that Graustark was really by Swaps, not Ribot, but obviously that was never substantiated or proven. Many of the Graustarks do have that Swaps look. The suggestions to do a blog on Ribot is very appealing. I have a lot of Ribot stories, having spent so much time near him and being so close to his groom, Floyd, who gave me Ribot's specially made bridle, which I have since donated to Old Friends for their future museum.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

The Deacon — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 18:31:09 GMT

The remarkable Ribot, arguably the greatest European runner ever. Certainly in the conversation with Sea Bird, Sea the Stars, Frankel and Dubai Millenium.

Ribot was 16 for 16 in his racing career. Bred in Great Britain by Federico Tesio. Two time Arc de Triomphe winner, 1955 & 1956.

Sired oter Arc winners including Prince Royal. Brilliant race horse as well as sire. His progeny include Tom Rolfe, 1965 Preakness winner, Arts & Letters 1969 Belmont winner, Graustark (as mentioned) and His Majesty among so many others.

Grand sire to Pleasant Colony and Hoist the Flag as well. Ribot was mentioned as one of the top race horses in the 20th Century as well as having one of the best and influential bloodlines.

I do not recall his 1959 breeding with darby Dan as perhaps Steve would but I can say with confidence that Ribot's presence on the farm help stamp who Darby Dan is today.......brilliant race horse and sire, class personified.

Brilliantly written piece here Steve, the mention of Graustark stirred some old memories. Everyone wanted to see the Graustark-Buckpasser match-up, much like Rachel-Zenyatta, but it wasn't meant to be.

Horse racing is so strange, these fragile equine beauties have short careers but leave a life time of memories for us too cherish. I think sometimes we are all lamenting about the "what ifs" of racing more then the actual races. Oh my, what coulda been........

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Linda in Texas — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:54:37 GMT

Mr. Nerud, with sincere apologies and please forgive me for adding an 'h' to your name in my late night post. Linda

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

Ribot — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:46:28 GMT

Thanks for the insight on a little known member of the Ribot family. For some reason when I first became interested in racing I became enamored of Ribot and his history. I'm continually surprised that this great sire doesn't seem to get his due compared to other great sire's who, in my humble opinion rank below him. Thanks for giving me another name to watch for in pedigree's when I'm looking for reasons to like a horse and I feel they need a dose of Ribot's stamina and speed to be successful.

re: Shared Belief's Hidden Key to Greatness

sceptre — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:03:35 GMT

jermon:

Must disagree with some of the statements you offer. Ribot did tend to stamp his get; Graustark was one of the exceptions. If you don't believe me, perhaps find a copy of John Aiscan's book on Ribot...One of the worst byproducts of the internet/blogging is the RE-writing of history. Yes, there's that, and also the massive spewing of utter nonsense; example in point-Coldfacts.