Have a safe trip down there and enjoy the brothers!

Thanks for the update! It should be a HELL of a week for the BROS. May they both run like the wind!!!

GOD speed............

Awesome Greg!  So exciting!  Happy to hear you will be making it to both--have a blast!  Safe and strong races to both Lentenor and Nicanor!

Greg,

Hope you can make it to both races so you give a great discription on both races. You did such a great job on your last two blogs. Many of FOB's and TBB's fans would LOVE to hear from you cause many of us can't make it to the races.

Thanks!  Just hope they both get to go on the turf. If so, they should both do very well.  Ok, I neeed to get up early and try to beat the traffic in New York, if that is even possible?  

How great is this!!!  Both brothers racing on the same track just different days. Hope both boys come home safe and in the winners circle. We'll (FOB's) still love them no matter what they finish. They will have their angels watching over them, Big Bro and Little Sis.

Thanks Greg for keeping us in the know. Know you will have fun and get us lots of pics of our boys.

TVG will not be showing Lentenor's race tomorrow. They have "Television Games" on until 6:00 p.m.  I hope they will show races on Wednesday. Hopefully I'll get to see Nicanor run live.

Thanks again Greg and drive safely both ways.

It would be a nice birthday present to me if they both won or either one did. Run safe.

Please post this info for all the FOB's to see.  Thanks

UPDATE: Dr. Richardson's B-day gift w/donor horses and staff

Have spoken with Kennett Florist and they only have $150 for Dr. Richardson AND the donor horses.  Please give a little if you can - this is one of our cherished traditions.  They will be taking everything to NBC on the 30th.

Donations may be made online at the UPenn site - www.vet.upenn.edu/giving.  Please note that your donation is in honor of Dr. Richardson's birthday.  You may also call (215) 898 -1480 or send your gift to Office of Development and Alumni Relations, BW 125, University of Pennsylvania, School of Veterinary Medicine, MC-6047,  3160 Chestnut Street,  Ste 500,  Philadelphia, PA  19104-9959.  

Contributions for the yet-to-be-determined cake/goodies and donor horse basket at NBC may be made directly to Kennett Florist.  Snail mail is 405 W. State Street, Kennett Square, PA  19348.   Phone number:  610-444-6040 or online at KFInc@verizon.net.  

Please pass the information to your email lists and other threads you frequent.

Rats! Not only at work at both post times, but with boss - no sneaking a quick internet viewing either. Greg - you'll be our eyes and ears, but if you can do some karma chants and find some magic dust to sprinkle - - - . Safe race for all horses running. Safe race for the Bboyz. Cake if one or both in the money. The whole Sundae with whipped creme if one or both wins! Now I think that would be historic, yes?

I'm so sorry, Greg. I wanted to add - Please drive safe - before hitting send.

I will be watching both days. Have safe races Nicanor and Lentenor.  I love watching you guys.

Enjoy your time at the track Greg.  

Is there a 2-year old brother, too?

Old Warhorse,

Barbaro has a third full brother, Margano, foaled March 10, 2009.  Margano was breed by and is owned by Roy and Gretchen Jackson, same as Nicanor and Lentenor.  

Here is a link to read about and see great photos of Margano, enjoy:

cs.bloodhorse.com/.../Barbaros-yearling-full-brother.aspx

When I was in Lexington Kentucky we drove past the white fences and my driver who loved Barbaro said "You can just see Barbaro streaming past these fences, can't you! He left us too early." I agreed. But he left us his brothers to enjoy.  So take heart Barbaro fans- you're going to have a great day!  I only wish Afleet Alex and Barbaro had had a chance to race against one another-WoWie Wow!

If Afleet Again runs in the Travers and we have Admiral Alex and Afleet Express-can I interject my dream-THE BROTHER'S THREE WINNING SPOTS IN THE TRAVERS! Yeah!!  Go Alex and Alex Scott

Delaware Park's website has great on- line video coverage if all races. Look for the link on the right hand side of their website

Two wins in two days! Can't wait! Thanks for the tip Mj! I'll give it a shot...

Thanks for the update Greg!  Have a great time, sure wish I could be there.  Drive safe.

Rain rain go away!

Greg,

Have the best and safest trip!  Love your reports!  May St. Francis keep all the horses safe and healthy for these 2 races!  May Lentenor and Nicanor return to FH in good shape!  Oh, to be @ Delaware PK to see them!

BOTH!?

Oh my poor nerves. ROFL

Hoping for a win from both!

TVG if not showing the Brothers races will show a replay like they did the last time.  They are showing horse races from coast to coast...how could anyone exclude the Brothers!!

What does "coupled entry" mean?  It was under Nicanor's information of the race!

Run swift and run safely into the Winner's Circle beautiful brothers. You have so many fans joining you on your road to destiny. Lentenor and Nicanor, Godspeed.

How great is this! Two brothers, two races, in two days! I have my fingers and toes crossed for both of them that they have a safe, fun and winning race, mostly safe.  Greg, thank you for the updates and have a safe trip also.

Both brothers back at the track! Safe trip for all, including you Greg. Have fun and do your thing! By the way, TVG is televising Delaware Park today. Prerace #1 is on the screen right now.  Go brothers go and I can't wait until this blog says "The Barbaro Brothers Three".

here-is-where-you-can-watch-the-race-live-and-see-replays

www.delawarepark.com/race_day_audio.php

you-need-to-do-a-simple-registration

Good luck tomorrow Nic. I'll be watching you on the TV or computer big fella.

Can't understand why Ready Set, the other Lael horse in the 8th race at DP, was entered by Ronnie Warner when Nicanor was also entered. I like Ready Set, I want him to have a win but not at Nicanor's expense and vice versa. What were they thinking?  

Bring Nicanor home safely, Jose.

Lentenors race is a go on the turf, down to a field of eight.  Cloudy, but no rain, turf is rated firm.  Post time in thirty minutes.

Man, race 7 at Delaware..trying to get those maiden 2-year-old fillies loaded...one got away...

But, the GOOD news.. you can watch Lentenor's race on TVG...4:24 post time...

Ragsy,

A coupled entry is where two or more horses are "coupled" together as one entry for betting purposes.  The usual reason is the two horses have the same owners/part owners.

In Nicanor's race, when you bet on Ready Set, you also bet on Nicanor.  You get two horses for the price of one.  If you bet the Number 1 horse to win, which is EITHER Nicanor or Ready Set, it doesn't matter to the bettor which one wins as the two horses are considered to be one.

Horses are coupled to avoid deceiving the betting public.  The connections could chose to sacrifice one of their horses to set the race up for another without getting into trouble for not trying to win the race, which is against the rules.

Ready Set is owned by Lael, just as Nicanor is so they are coupled even though they have separate trainers.

Sometimes in stakes races horses like these two will run uncoupled, since the racing stewards believe that someone will not pay the entry fee and then not try to win the race.

It is all about keeping the sport honest and fair for the bettor.

BARBARO will watch over him like he always does.

Safe racing, that's all I ask for.

Not his day

That was a tough beat, getting squeezed like that...no fault of his. Almost got enough momentum back to keep second...next time.

Good race.

He got in tight quarters turning for home and backed out of it.  I thought there was room for him to go through between horses, but he didn't.  Maybe there wasn't room, but I think either he or the jockey backed out of it.  I thought he was flattening out coming from home when he got in tight, but as soon as he got clear, he seemed to re-break and run on.  I really liked to see that.

I don't think he was ever going to win the race today, but he ran really well. I would expect him to win that race next time out.

I thought the distance suited him.  My gut feeling is both brothers are best at from 7f to 8.5f.

I don't know JAJ. I think Lentenor needs a longer race.  The race was run 2/5th seconds off the track record.  Very fast for his first time out after a long layoff

Poor Lenny had a rough go of it today! He sure had alot of heart though! No shame in 3rd though. Good luck tomorrow for Nicanor. Hope they show the race with actual dialog instead of music (although music was good)!

Nice race after his layoff, glad they got this one in. Good job Lentenor!

Now, Go Nic!! Run fast and be Safe!

We still love you Lenny!!! You got 3rd, not bad after such a long layoff. Hope you get lots of peppermints.  Too bad Rosie and her horse ran in front of you down the home stretch. That makes 2 times she has been involved with one of our boys. Hope this isn't a pattern that continues.

Let's go Nicanor!!! You can do it.

Lentenor was 4th in the Florida Derby, Matz had momentum to keep him moving in Stakes races, but he kept him out 4 months, and now Lentenor ran like a claimer. Have we become so desperate that we excuse this nonsense? The horses are fine, but I don't know what planet the trainer is on. I've always said that both Nicanor are not the problem. Funny, Matz said that Lentenor got alot out of The Florida Derby, after waffling prior to the race, then waited 4 months, ran him in a race he would have won 4 months ago and then says Lentenor got a lot out of a lowly 36,000 race, too. Huh? Ok, I'll read a 20 page comic book and say I got as much out of that as I did War and Peace.

Had Matz kept going with Lentenor, who clearly belonged in stakes company, we wouldn't be back to square one with him. I think at this point, the question should be, who else should be training these horses? Instead, people keep making excuses for the trainer. Why??? Let's find these noble horses someone who will take logical steps with them. I am just frustrated, and really, I'd get ready for the same charade with Margano. I feel like we have been cheated with these 2, who show clear talent, and the path is clear to the top, so what's the problem? Lentenor was out too long, and this is just ridiculous. Next race he'll be racing pack mules, which I am sure he'll get a lot of experience from....I'm sure someone on this board can buy him. Let Lentenor run, please?

Jon,

His owners are not moving them from Michael.  They have said they will NEVER sell them.

Jon, you're a know nothing idiot! Why haven't you tried to educate yourself about these colts and their training, since you insist on commenting about them. How many times do you have to be told Lentenor was going through a growth spurt and needed time to catch up with himself. It's like puberty for a young boy in case you don't understand the termonology. These colts aren't the only horses to go through that kind of ordeal. Zenyatta didn't race untill the end of her third year for just that same reason. Don't you get it? A lot of Dynaformers are like this. Big horse and late developing horses have to be handled carefully or you risk ruining them forever. Is that what you want? When did you becomea trainer? If you are, you should spend more time with your barn and if you're not, if you're just a fan like most of us, then maybe you should find other horses to follow and perhaps you can gain some kind of credibility. The Jacksons are the owners and Mr Matz is the trainer, get it?  

Jon,

There is always a reason when a horse takes a break of 4 months.  Always.

It might be as simple as the horse was getting tired and needed a break.  Matz might have had a fall campaign planned.

Horses are not machines.  They cannot run 12 months a year.

I think I've been over this very point many times before with you, but I haven't changed your mind.  What am I not explaining?

JON

Give me a break! It's always a slam on Matz. Here's an idea, why don't you call connections' and give your "expert" comments?

JON

BTW your silly slams reflect how little you must really know. Matz is a Derby winner. Again,it's not your call to make,obviously the owners' are happy with him. Don't think you have any say in the matter! Sorry! lol

JON

Sherry has it right,you're an idiot,at best!

Folks, let's not be so hostile!

Sherry, I doubt Lentenor took four months off as a 3-year old because of a growth spurt.

Horses grow in their 3-year old year.  Often when you take a horse out of hard training and give them a bit of down time they will have a bit of a growth spurt.  The removal of the stress of training gives the body a chance to catch up a bit.  A growing 3-year old isn't growing enough to stop them training the way a 2-year old might have to be stopped on.  Generally, a growth spurt in the middle of a horse's 3-year old year means they just got bigger, not taller.  They bulk up a bit and put on weight.

Growth spurts that interfere with training are when a horse becomes unbalanced--their back and front grow at different rates.  This isn't going to be happening at 3.

I don't know why he took off 4 months.  It could have been a little nagging soundness issue.  It could be that he was very tired and run down.  It could be that they didn't want to keep him in hard training for more than a year stretching from 2 to the late fall of 3.

Here are some photos of Len's race.

www.flickr.com/.../sets

HEY NIC, Have a good day today. Watched your brother yesterday.Have a grand and most of all a safe race. And god bless you and the ones with you.

Jon,

I was going to respond to your comments, but, really NO need, since everyone else is doing a very good job! Sherry, JAJ and Mike, Thank You :)

Weather looks good here, cloudy with the sun trying to come out.  Still a chance of rain, but, Nicanor's race should go off on the turf.

On Lentenor's facebook page, several months ago Alex Brown stated that Lentenor was extremely tired and needed the time off..

You always give clear and concise information.

thank you for that...

Sherry and Mike Relva,

 Shame on both of you for calling Jon an idiot. Name calling is for children. He has a right to his opinion.

 If I owned these horses, my trainer would be the [TURF MASTER] J.E. Sheppard and be ridden by

R.B. Homeister.

 And Matz was not the Derby winner, Barbaro was. This horse could have won the Derby with just about any trainer, he was that good.

Good luck today Nic!

Sorry, I said the wrong jockey for ridding Nicanor and Lentenor. It should have been A.R. Napravnik. She is already 2 for 2 ridding Nicanor.

Well Jon, you have put your foot in it again! I think the reason Michael is taking his time with these horses is that he doesn't want another Barbaro tragedy to happen!!! You just can't rush horses when training, they all go at their own speed. Michael has his methods and they work for him. Of course these are MY opinions and since I have been following horse racing for 45 years, I may know alittle about what I am talking about! Your rant sounds like you have a personal problem with this trainer. If you think you can do a better job without hurting these horses, by all means, contact the owners and apply for the job!

Elaine...thank you for the wonderful pics of Lentenor. He is absolutely beautiful.

Greg thanks for the weather update and will look forward to your new articles on both races.

Have fun and s safe trip home.

The weather is fine at the track, 75 degrees and mostly cloudy.  A Lael exacta would be nice, Nicanor and Ready Set to finish first and second.

Linda,

I have never seen such anger in you before, you have always allowed others their points of view with humor, even when you disagreed.  What happened that changed you?

Mr. Matz told us what he was going to do with Lentenor in an interview after the Florida Derby. He did, and Lentenor grew -- taller and bigger and then had to get in racing fit shape.  Takes time, folks.  Whatever the case, he is back.  After being squeezed back yesterday, he did great to finish in the money in 3rd.  He'll win his next one, I'd bet!

JAJ, thanks for your civilized input...I can't stand the constant vitriol.

Jon, you are entitled to your opinion just like everyone else expresses theirs. Thanks for not returning venom for venom.

Ouch, 6 scratches in Nicanor's race...

Elaine

beautiful pictures of Lentenor, do you sell them? Just heard Nicanor being talked about on HRTV sure sounds good...Good Luck sweety...

Phew, Nicanor backed up fast in this one, he did not look happy & I'm a little PO'd at the whip used on a horse obviously not running...looks like Ready Set set a new track record...

What happened to Nicanor???? Fifth??  Well at least his stall mate won for the Lael stables. At first I thought it was Nicanor.

Greg..what's your take on what happened. Hope he's o.k. and didn't get hurt.

BARRY

Look,all I can see is the obvious fact that JON has a personal issue w/Matz. He CAN'T EXPECT to continually tee off on him without an answer back.

Tough racing luck for Lentenor.  He may have looked a bit tired.  Everytime I see either brother run - I can't help but remember Barbaro, and what might have been.  God Bless all the connections for allowing us (FOB) into their life.  

Ok don't bash me but I have to agree with Jon. These horses have talent but I think Lentenor shouldn't have had such a long layoff. Sometimes it gets them off their A game. If he was a growth spurt or something I understand. But this is just my opinion.

Congratulations to the Jacksons for their win with Ready Set.  It was a very close race. Our Nicky ran his heart out and deserves an "A" for effort.  He gave his all and hung in there until the very end.  

Dang it, I thought after a minute that Nicanor was Ready Set. I dont know what happened to Nicky but being 6th was awful when I thought 1-2-3rd.  BUT, its ok...

somebody needs to tell the powers

that be..that nicky and lenny need

to run MORE races... running every

now and then is just not cutting it

these horses have a great history

behind them and they are not living

up to it... they need to work more

and have a FREQUENT racing plan

i think jon is absolutely right..

barbaro was great and the possiblities with his brothers was

endless... but nicky ran today and

did even worse than lenny.. 6th

out of 7 and he would have been

last if the race had been 20 feet

more... he ran great and faded even faster...something isn't right

in that barn... its a shame these

horses are being wasted on such

indifferent connections.

Better luck next time Nicanor.  We all have a bad day every once in a while.  Lord knows I do.

Someone made a comment that I stuck my foot in "it" again yesterday. Well, what excuses do we have today? I understand the Barbaro worship, but at what cost? I feel like I am watching Tiger Woods when I watch Michael Matz and his vaunted horses out there. Yes, Nicanor's stablemate won, but whoopdedoo, Nic didn't. I also am reminded of the Emperor's New Clothes when I read about these colts, and Barbaro. Last I looked, these horses were inches from greatness, but...but...but? Well...how much longer are people going to tolerate this nonsense and not ask for a new trainer. I wonder.

In Lentenor's race, right at the end he was making a comeback.  I just don't think Lentenor is a turf horse, and he needs more distance.  After a five month layoff, he did great.  I know that the Florida Derby took a lot out of him, but this race did not.  I don't think Lentenor was tired in this race, he just got bumped around a bit.  Also, the fractions were very fast.

Love Nicanor, but I think that Lentenor is a better horse.

I am not a trainer so any opinion I would have would be just that, an opinion. I am just glad they both are Safe and Unhurt.

I would love to see them WIN, but if they don't, so be it.

I could just take both of them and put them in my barn and admire them every day for the rest of my life.

They both are beautiful.

Well, starting my five hour drive home from Delaware Park.  Just two points I would like to make at this time.  First, seems like both brothers came out of their respective races fine physically.  Second,  while I respect everyone's opinion, to the ones that are questioning Mr. Matz, honestly, unless you work with him or his horses, you could not be farther from the truth!  Speculation is fun, but, when I post some of these comments, I am left shaking my head!  So, now I have to drive five hours with a sore neck!  I do appreciate everyone's feedback though.  Have a goodnight, and I hope to have my thoughts up on the last two days before this weekend.  Thanks again everyone.

Thanks Greg for letting us know the brothers are ok. We did have some question about Nicanor so it is good to put those concerns to rest

I look forward to your next post. Have a safe trip home

Ragsy:

No one has asked about buying them before! I suppose I can, if someone wants them.

I will have more of Len posted tomorrow as well as Nic's from today.

Nic lost the race today as soon as Hugo put a nose in front. His head went right up when Jose would not let him go with the leader. Nic only wants to run a race HIS way, and that is from the front. He is a very stubborn boy.

Hey there Greg--drive home safely please.  Looking forward to hearing about it from your angle.  Two incredibly fast races--glad to hear they both came out okay.  Now the regrouping and going forward.  Nic's race was freakish to me!!

personally i love the brothers regardless but nic's race was a long sprint and he should have tried to rate him the fractions were to fast for him right now

lenny was rank and also should have been rated even losing these turf races the class ones usually will be won from off the pace!! wrong jockey needs a strong one like v espinosa,or john v

Jon

You may think you're right about the boys needing another trainer BUT it isn't going to happen. Could you please just move on. We are tired of hearing the same old thing from you. Thanks in advance!!

I didn't see where Roy and Gretchen Jackson owned Ready Set. I thought he was just out of their stable. I'm probably wrong but could someone tell me if I'm am.

Be careful on that long drive home Greg and we'll wait for your articles with baited breath.

Glad you made it through this race safe Nicanor. Here's to you and your many successes in the future.

If all you FOB"s want something to be mad about ...read this Paulick Report about our boys!  

www.paulickreport.com/.../comment-page-1

You can leave a comment if you wish.  Makes my blood boil to tell ya the truth.

ekdeutsch said:

"Nic lost the race today as soon as Hugo put a nose in front. His head went right up when Jose would not let him go with the leader. Nic only wants to run a race HIS way, and that is from the front. He is a very stubborn boy."

You know, you said what I was thinking when I finally got to see the race. I do think he needs to learn to accept rating but I think something happened in his head at that point.  Then in the stretch-  don't know if he was tired or sulking from the above but the jockey did have to try and get him going again.

Will be very interested in JAJ's analysis.

Oh, and thanks for the pictures!

We are all, most of us, Monday morning quarterbacks on this forum.

Jon

  If there are 100 sheep in a field and 99 decide to go to the other side of the field to graze it does not mean that the one sheep is wrong staying were it is to graze.You brought up a lot of good points so keep on grazing on the right side of the field because it does not mean the majority is right.

tc01, Nicanor's race was a long sprint, too fast.

I don't think that Lentenor is a turf horse and he needs a longer race.  Johnny Velazquez was aboard Lentenor in his maiden win and second place finish in an allowance race.  After watching these two races many times, I concluded that JV and Lentenor would make a good pair. Regardless, Lentenor needs a regular rider, and I mean right now.  He looked like a different horse yesterday.  

Just want to point out that Ready Set and Nicanor are not stablemates.  Horses are coupled together and will wear the same silks when the same owner owns both horses.  The Jackson's do own both Ready Set and Nicanor, but this does not necessarily mean they are trained by the same trainer.  In this case Ready Set is trained by Ronny Werner and not Mr. Matz.  

Horsefirst,

I don't know what to think of Nicanor's race.  I would like to hear what the jockey had to say to the trainer after the race.

When he went past the grandstand the first time I was surprised that he was rating as kindly as he was.  He was relaxed around the first turn and up the backstretch.  

HorseFirst, go back and look at the replay--I only saw the race on a tiny screen--but I'm sure he is on the wrong lead going around the first turn.  Have a look, tell me if you think so as well.

He just seemed a little flat to me.  Maybe it was the fast pace.  Maybe he's learned to rate.  If he were my horse I would be pulling blood in a couple of days.

HSLewis  Thanks for making that clear. I really didn't think the Jacksons owned Ready Set. Now I've got it straight.

Did you read the Paulick report? Did it make you mad? Hopefully he'll read some of the comments and have a different attitude toward the FOB's.

JON/MM

Lou is correct,no matter how many times you run it into the ground,Michael is the and will remain the trainer,period! JON,two words:GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Such vitriol!  Are people not entitled to an opinion on this blog without being subjected to insults?  IMHO as soon as you resort to such low tactics you've lost the 'argument'; there should be some apologies and a little more tolerance.  It's getting to the point where I don't want to read anymore, too darned ugly :(.

I think the Paulick Report article was dead on!  And to say that these 2 colts were inches from greatness is delusional at best!  When run at the right level, they do well but when they are over their head, it really shows.  The idea is to run where you can win...

I love Nicanor with all my heart but he ran an awful race yesterday.  I think Nicanor is sho wing signs that is does not want to race anymore.  I believe they need to retire him to stud farm.  Before he gets hurt.  Lentenor did well and we have Margano in the wind.  If any of these horses are going to grow they need a new trainer.

After watching yesterdays race I was a bit puzzled.  Go back and look at the replay a few times.  Am I crazy but when the whip came out and he got struck I don't think he liked it that well and sort of backed up saying o.k. you think you are smart in hitting me, well lets see who will go slower.  I don't think that Nic likes to get hit with a whip and think he will retaliate to it.  Just check it out and see if you see what I saw.  Would like to see Garrett Gomez ride Nic, he is one that very seldom uses a whip and will ride without one if necessary.  You get more candy with kindness.  I know that Garrett has ridden a couple of times for Michael at Saratoga, one win and one loss but hey, if it were me I might give it a try.

First I'd like to make it a point and say I have been an owner/trainer for many years so my comment is from the heart/experience. I have watched and loved these brother's since Barbaro, admire the Jackson's and Mr. Matz but we all know in racing not all horse's are suited to one trainer's way's of training. Mr. Matz needs to find out what really makes Nic' and Lent' want to win before he breaks their spirit to win. Nic looks to want to be a front runner, a leader of the pack. There are many horse's out there that like this style of running and most times they win, from gate to finish line ...in front. Nicanor was rank at the start again as soon as the jockey held him back, he tossed his head in anger, watch the reply and see, he spends to much time fighting the tight rein and has nothing left, strength or will at the end to win. This must change or like I said they could ruin this horse. The Jacksons have Nic and Lent' with Matz because of Barbaro, like it or not Matz's win record is not very impressive as far as training goes. I will not be surprised if they choose another trainer for Margano. Most of you on here have followed their lives since Barbaro and are letting Barbaro's memory cloud what is really happening here. I just hope Mr. Matz figures these boy's out before it's to late to undue the damage, once a horse loses the will to win then you better start looking for a new career for them. It cost's ALOT of money to keep horse's in training and for what Nic and Lent has won to date you can be sure the Jacksons have spent double that amount on their upkeep/training bills thus far. I wish them all well in the future.

Here are photos from Nics race and I have added more from Lens race.

www.flickr.com/.../sets

I think I know what the problem is - it's the pony during the post parade. It's been the same one for the last 3 races (Len and Nic). He's bad luck. They need someone else!

I finally got to see the replay of Nic's race.  That was annoying!  Nic throwing his head up like that. You could tell he was mad. I think their jockeys should let the boys go to the lead and let them do their thing. The rest of the field will have to catch them.  

I think Nicanor did great he ran out of gas.Maybe the Zenyatta approach should be tried where they hang back till the last turn,it seems to work and I have noticed alot of race favorites use it successfully.But it is ultimately up to the mood the horse is in in that particular day.I love Nic and Lentenor and love every chance I get to see them!

I read where Michael Matz had decided to give Nicanor the lead  in a compromise to learn to rate, if wanted.

why did the jockey not allow that, to me, he lost the race for Nic and this fella is like the father ..

Paulick Report was rather condescending.

Jon, you are soooo right.  I get so tired of watching these horses lose.  The owners don't have to sell them, just try them with a new trainer, Something!  I know there is sentimental value to these horses, but their races are ridiculous.  They are not getting anything out of each prior race or they would show it.  All they are getting is that there are horses in front of them winning.  I hope Margano is a better runner, but unless they get a new trainer, nobody will know.  

Sherry, be nice.  They are sentimental favorites, but tons of horses go through growth spurts, and there are always excuses for these two and why they can't win. What is Nicanor's excuse?  He is not going through a growth spurt.  The trainer got lucky with one horse, Barbaro because the horse was good despite the trainer.  All Jon is saying is at least give them a shot with someone else.  Wouldn't you like to at least see them win for once instead of making excuses for all their losses?  Lastly, just because you don't like a comment doesn't mean you need to be rude.  Jon didn't say anything but the truth.  

Like I said, we are most all just Monday morning quarterbacks on this forum and have little on the ground experience.

JAJ, I looked again and sure wish the quality of the video was better.  He did break out of the gate on the wrong lead and was on the wrong lead in the first run up the stretch.  In retrospect, when he threw his head up it may have been the jockey trying to get him to switch and Nicanor getting peevy about it, especially with the other horse barreling by him.  At first I thought it was because they came out of the chute and there was a slight, going left involved. But most of the others broke on the right lead.  Take a look at the break a couple times.  Nicanor is really focused on looking to his left and leaning to the right.  You see the gate assistant trying to get him to straighten up.  Just before the break, he has pushed him over again.  That might have had something to do with the wrong lead out of the gate.  Before anyone gets on the assistant, better he get Nicanor straight then let him be crooked in the gate.

I think Nic must have switched going into the first turn- or he's one athletic horse taking that turn at that clip on the wrong lead. I saw a smooth lead change coming out of the far turn. While he looked like he relaxed on the backstretch, I don't know if he did or if he just got indifferent.  Like you said, would be interesting to hear what the jockey had to say because IMHO, what we saw in the stretch was not normal Nicanor.

I'll echo what a couple of others have said.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion and all opinions should be respected.  Much as everyone adores Matz, he may not be the best trainer for the brothers.  Please do keep in mind that any trainer would be put on the spot with these brothers- unless they were Barbaro reincarnated, and that they never will be.  

What I'd really like to see is Matz get out his jumping saddle and work with Nicanor as a jumper.  But that's unreality dream #1007....  

Does anyone know how tall the brothers are now?

And if the growth spurt is big, is it a good idea to let a horse such as Lentenor chill on the trails for a couple of months?

I said this in error:

"I think Nic must have switched going into the first turn- or he's one athletic horse taking that turn at that clip on the wrong lead."

If he was on the left lead coming out of the gate and didn't switch, he would have been on the correct lead into first turn....oh, duh...

I would like to blame the above on not having coffee in the morning any more but by this time, I should be used to it.

AngelaFromAbilene,

While I agree with some of Ray Paulick's Report, I have to say he just doesn't get it.

The Fans of Barbaro are fans of these two horses for reasons other than their ability on the race track.

I think it is wonderful that these two horses have fans.  Just because a horse isn't one of the "greats"--and neither Lentenor nor Nicanor have shown anything approaching brilliance--doesn't mean that their fans can't follow and enjoy these two horses.  Fan base shouldn't be dependent on the inherent "greatness" of the horse.

Cat, don't you think that Nicanor and Lentenor's biggest problem is that they have been over faced?  Don't you think class relief would get them to the winners' circle?

Jon just took his trainer's test....but when it came to which end the oats go in he seemed stumped and gave up.

Wendy G,

dont you think its a little late in the game to drum roll a trainer change??      Why not change your tactics then/or replace the trainer....

The veil of Barbaro has not clouded my eyes folks, its just flat "Love of his brothers"

I believe most all people here understand these boys are not #1, but that sure as hell dont stop the loving..

um, been a fan of both boys since this all began.... but our boy Nicanor has always been a bit of a lad, as they say across the pond in the UK... he seems to resent being rated etc. Just a thought, maybe a brief surgery would straighten him out a bit? Without a good race record he is really not worth much as a stallion.... pedigree or not... especially since he has two full (INTACT) brothers.

Don't everyone scream at once. John Henry and a few others I could mention had long and fruitful careers as geldings, and didn't come into their potential until AFTER their surgery...

longtimeraceingfan,

I was wondering about that myself.

WENDYG

If you agree w/ Jon that say's it all. It's not up to you to decide if Matz stays or not. You have no control over that!

SAM NOT SPAM

Then don't read them anymore. Jon is a broken record w/ constant slamming of Matz,in case you haven't noticed!

Greg and Elaine...was Nic's mouth bleeding at the end of the race? In your last two head shots of him it sure looked like there was blood in his mouth. Maybe he was fighting with the jockey a lot harder than it looked. He sure has a mind of his own!! Wonder if after this race MM will let him run his own race???

Greg hope you made it home safe and sound. Look forward to your article or articles.

Methinks that if Nicanor were given the choice, he'd say "I'd rather be losing my races."

Gelding him is as severe an option as changing trainers and, hopefully, also not an option.

Why not just let him run on the lead. No fighting, a happier horse, and he'll win some and lose some.  The struggle is self-defeating. First he has to fight and told to NOT go to the front, then he is whipped and urged TO go to the front.  Must be really confusing for the animal...it sure would be for me.

Mike,

It's all too easy to post things anonymously on the internet.  Would people here really say such things in real life, to someone's face?  I somehow doubt it, at least not using the kind of language they do on here.  There's nothing wrong with reminding everyone we're all human behind the screen names, and deserving of respect.  I'm sure everyone here would rather people read and considered their opinions rather than just dismissing this blog as a flamewar.

But then that's just my opinion ;)

Lou in TX,

Yes, it looks like he cut himself in the mouth.  He probably bit his tongue.

Before a race (and probably any breeze), his tongue is pulled forward and a soft tie is wrapped tightly around his tongue and knotted under his chin.  This keeps the tongue forward.  Without a tongue tie, many horses' tongues will fall back and cut off their air supply.  Surprisingly, a tongue tie doesn't seem to bother them.  I suspect with the tongue pulled so far forward in an unnatural position that they might be more likely to bite it without realizing it.

I don't agree with many posters who say he was fighting the jockey.  As he passed the grandstand the first time he did toss his head a bit when the horse went by him and the jockey restrained him but it was only for a few strides.  After that, I think he rated really kindly the rest of the race which was very uncharacteristic for him.  My gut feeling is that something is not right with the horse and I would be pulling blood on him in the next day or two.

I also didn't like that he was on the wrong lead on the first turn.  I looked again, and grainy video or not, I am pretty sure he was on the wrong lead.

Why is it that on this blog that if someone says anything against the "Brothers" or Matz that it puts everyone in a tizzy.  Each person has the right to his or her opinion regardless if you or I like it or not.  It comes down to this blog is not really about "The Brothers" it is about who can fuel the most hate and get everyone going.  Please disregard bloggers who make you angry.  Relish the good in our boys and keep it that way. The more you fuel someone who does the bashing than it gives them the opportunity to press even harder.  Let this blog be the good stuff that pretains to our boys and don't let the hotheads take a good thing and push you to bad.  Just my opinion.  

Lobieb,

Thank You!  I couldn't agree with you more.  

I will post a recap of my two days at Delaware Park as soon as I can, along with some pictures of the brothers.  I am going to Saratoga for the weekend, so, I will try to have it up before I leave.

Please don't make Nicanor a gelding,I want to see some grandhorses(kids) from the boys.

lobieb,

So right you are, nothing wrong with kindness and respect..

I was begining to wonder when I see  people are praised for doing ugly.  Shoot, it reminds me of how our Govt is doing..Oh, well perhaps things will change.  

SAM NOT SPAM

Since you've raised that issue,never been anything that I've ever posted that I would hesitate to say directly to someone in person and many instances wish I had the chance to.

Greg, you are going to Saratoga this weekend?!  Awesome.  I'll wear my blue "Running with Barbaro" wristband on Travers day as well as Sunday to watch Rachel.  It would be great to meet you!

GREG

I've ALWAYS enjoyed your superb writing and respect you for your obvious concern for animals. BTW I may have aldready thanked you(don't remember) months ago for giving the location for Dancing IN My Dreams. That was of a great help. I did visit her in April.

Nicanor is 4 years old, he is not going to change enough to satisfy his trainer, just give him the lead and let him run his race.

Why will they ( owners/trainer ) not allow this.

This old argument is SOSDD and nothing ever changes..

Based on those pics (ekdeutsch 26 Aug 2010 9:45 AM ) it sure looks like he bled.  That would be a pretty good explanation for why he faded so badly.

Thanks JAJ for the explaination about the tongue tie. Poor boy, bit his tongue. That hurts as I'm sure all of you have done that at least once in your life. I know I have.   What do you think about letting Nic run his own race? He may not win them all but at least  hopefully he would be a happy horse.

KTKOL,

When a horse bleeds in the lungs, which is where a horse bleeds when they have a bleeding episode, it MIGHT come out of their nose but usually not.  Blood coming out of the nose of a horse is usually from a bleed in the nose or sinuses, not the lungs.  They don't bleed from their mouth after a bleeding episode, either.

Bleeding's proper name is Exercise Induced Pulmonary Hemorrhage (EIPH) and it is ruptured blood vessels in the lungs.  Horses who are seen to have bled by the commission vet after a race are put on the vet's list.  They can be barred from racing.

Lou in Tx, as I said in my previous posts, I don't think he fought the jockey at all.  I thought he rated quite kindly.  You know, the pace was pretty quick--it might have been too fast for him and he just flattened out.  We are not privy to a lot of the information that would fill in the blanks on why he finished where he did.  I gave a bunch of reasons on why he might have run the way he did, but it is all just guesses.  I didn't mention bleeding as a possibility because I didn't want to get everyone upset.  Bleeding is always a possibility when a horse doesn't perform up to expectations.  

JAJ...Really appreciate all you information. Guess we'll have to wait until we get some kind of information or quote from MM or the jockey. I think we are some what impatient on waiting for such info.  Hopefully it will come soon from some article with an interview with Matz. Just glad both boys came home safely.

JAJ, I am fully aware that many bleeders never show any outward sign. I have however, seen horses bleed from both the mouth and the nose following a bad pulmonary hemorrhage (verified by scoping).  Like or not, blood in the nostril and mouth is a symptom of bleeding.  Could be he bit his tongue, could be he bled.  You can't deny those are pretty textbook signs - especially considering the horse ran out of run.

HorseFirst,

Here is an interesting blog for training horses.

I found the first article on the Blood-Horse blog section, but went to the actual web site it was taken from.  The second article is very interesting to your questions of racing a horse into condition.

The first article will be interesting to anyone who still believes that long, slow gallops are what protects babies from getting bucked shins.

horsetrainingscience.blogspot.com

Mike,

Thanks, and glad you were able to visit Dancing in My Dreams!

Deby,

Yes, I will be leaving in the morning for Saratoga.  Looking forward to alot of competitive races, and it would be nice if Super Saver and Ice Box could go one,two in the very tough Travers.  I haven't seen Rachel race since the Woodward last year, can't wait to see her and Life at Ten.  It should make for an exciting weekend of racing and the weather looks perfect for a change!

Thanks for the site JAJ, bookmarked and ready to read.

I wondered about the "pink" in the foam in Nicanor's mouth, too.  However, it's all guessing where it came from on our part. He could have hit himself in the starting gate and gotten a little scratch for all we know.  Wouldn't take all that much for what little color was there.

I find the information from sources like JAJ very helpful.  Question:  If they bleed, is that one of the times they scope a horse?  Or is that more related to the flap issue?

Thanks!

Greg, I would love for my Super Saver to win this, but I'm going with Miner's Reserve.  As you know Super Saver was my boy in the Kentucky Derby.  My bet is on Mner's Reserve to win and Super Saver will be right behind him.  These two boys have wonderful pedigrees, and their jockeys, what can I say, love them both.  Zito is high on Miner's Reserve.  

HorseFirst,

If one of my horses runs a sub par race, my trainer always scopes looking for either evidence of bleeding or mucus.  (For those who don't know what scoping is, it is an endoscopic examination of their throat.  The vet sticks an endoscope down their nose deep into their throat.)  Sometimes you go into a race with a horse that looks the picture of health who runs below expectations and when you scope you find s/he is full of mucus.  I've even had a horse that came back from a race just full of mucus that didn't even cough when cooling out.  A horse that bled doesn't cool out well--you usually have a pretty good idea that they either bled or might have mucus in their lungs by how they cool out, but not always.

I think the frothy foam is from bleeding inside the mouth. I can ask my trainer if they can ever bleed from the lungs out into their mouth.  I don't believe they can but I could be wrong.  If it is possible, I don't think it is usual.  I do remember reading a scientific report that said that when they actually looked at horses that were exhibiting signs of bleeding from their nose that it wasn't originating from their lungs but their sinuses and nose.  Sometimes when they are grazing after cooling out and they put their head down, they can gush blood.  I've never had a bad bleeder, so I'm not up on the details of bleeders.

Bleeding is an insidious problem.  It can ruin horses.  You want to do everything possible to prevent them from ever bleeding in the first place because it can become a real self-perpetuating cycle.  Silver Charm was a bad bleeder.

Greg, I live in New Orleans, so I saw Rachael in the New Orleans Lady's Classic in March.  She is such an extraordinary horse; love the Rachael.  

A question to the horse owners and trainers here that has been bugging me for some time: I do not see tongue ties in most of the pictures of Euro horses running, and yet their races are frequently nearly 2-miles long. So what gives with always using ties on NA horses?

Diatsu,

As an owner and a wanna-be trainer, I questioned that as well.

A tongue tie pulls the tongue and the root of the tongue forward.  If the tongue is allowed to pull back in the mouth, the root of the tongue will ball up near the soft palate and that can cause the soft palate to displace, effectively shutting off the air supply, sometimes completely.

Diatsu,

One other thing, I don't think races in Eurpoe are frequently nearly 2-miles long.  I think that is very rare.

Most races are the same distances as North American races.  I agree with you that there is less emphasis on the short sprints, but believe me, they have big sprint races in Europe.

Hi Greg!  It was fun hanging out with you on Wednesday for Nic's race.  We're all hoping you are/were able to get some insight on what happened to Nicanor (jockey, trainer comments) and where the blood came from in his mouth.  I've watched the replay a few times and I'll bet he's confused why he's made to slow down at first, then hit to go faster at the end of his races, when all he wants to do is go fast all the time!  I agree with a lot of people in saying he should just be let go and run his race, winning or not.  I don't know if he'll ever learn to rate, it's just not his style and he's too headstrong to understand or cooperate.

Anyway, have a great time this weekend, and as always, drive safely!

maybe jon is right... something isn't right in mudville... barbaro

was a great horse/ matz probably had

little to do with his success..he

would have run great for chicken

little...but lenny/nicky need more

track time... imagine running one

of them in a claiming race.. how

the mighty have fallen...through

no fault of their own..

Thanks JAJ.  I would think it would be odd for any lung bleeding to show up in the mouth.  

People, watch the race again.  Nicanor had something going on in the run to the first turn and it might have been the jockey trying to get him to switch leads- NOT the same as trying to rate him.  And folks, you HAVE to have some control of the horse or he's a danger to all.  Look at the reins in the backstretch.  See the loopy/soft reins?  That is not a jockey fighting the horse. When JAJ says he looked like he relaxed, he's right.  Whether he actually relaxed or something else is going on is up to debate.  But there was no fight between jockey and horse going on.  What we saw in the run to the first turn could have been caused by many things besides the jockey trying to get him to rate.  The fact that that is the only instance does not equate with the "fight" scenario.

As for hitting him in the stretch- common, the jockey has to make him try.  I didn't see lots of hitting and I believe the jockey quit when it was apparent they weren't going anywhere.  Either Nicanor tired, got peevy, or something else caused him to fade.  The splits were pretty fast for a horse not really back into racing, seems to me.

Also keep in mind, you simply CANNOT let a horse run his own race.  Nicanor, quite frankly, has my heart in my throat every time he has to run to the front, crossing over rapidly in front of other accelerating horses.  Makes me wonder if he needs a bit change to control that or would a half-cup blinker just on his left eye help stop him from doing that?

See, I have lots of questions, lots of learning to do.  But I attempt to not make assumptions about what's going on.  With horses, it's very often NOT what you think you're seeing that's the issue.  They are very complex, complicated animals.

Bonjour Nicanor,

Sorry to hear that you came in 6th on August 25th. I missed the race on TVG.

Give it time, Nicanor, and you will eventually make it to the stakes.

Take care!

Lots of love to you, Lentenor, Margano, Mr. Matz, and Mr and Mrs. Jackson.

Barbaro's Revenge just won the 4th race at Calder.  Was this horse named after Barbaro?  Somebody explain, please, Greg.

Mary I have seen Barbaro's Revenge race many times before and am always taken back at his name..I looked him up on tbpedigree  

His daddy is "Snuck In" mom is "Jades Ace" out of a Mr. Prospector mare....but, just love when he wins... he has 1 win and 1 show earning $16,310 before the win.....

Now, I was rightly smarted when Calvin took the whip to a fatigued Rachel Alexandra..seems like it affected her attitude to me...Man, do I love Rachel.........Hugs and Kisses to Rachel....

HorseFirst

Are horses that race complicated because of human interference?  

nm lentenor and Nicanor have not fallen perhaps the trainer failed them...

Ragsy,

No, the trainer hasn't "failed them".  

I think "failing" an animal is when we stop caring and when we stop taking care of them, when we fail to care about their well-being and best interests.  It is not at all fair to say MM has "failed" them.  He is an exceptional horseman with an exceptional team behind him.  I guarantee every decision being made with these brothers is with utmost care and thought and absolutely with their best interests at heart.  They are loved and taken care of and their training is aimed to help them succeed.  Just because they didn't win last week does in no way, shape, or form imply that he has failed them--that is way too harsh....

What is it then GregJ?

Ragsy, using the whip on Rachael has never worked.  I wish Calvin will stop it, because I've seen all of her races, and she does not respond at all to the whip.

I like Barbaro's Revenge, good win for him.

Ragsy,

My answer would be exactly what HsLewis wrote!  The sport of horse racing is not an exact science, and everyone involved with Nicanor and Lentenor are doing what is best for the two of them.  I promise you that the people suggesting a change in trainers have never stepped a foot in Mr. Matz's barn.  While I respect differing opinions,  I still know what the truth is, and these opinions couldn't be more off base.

hSLewis

Thanks for that answer it really helps me.  Yes, I think Highly of MMatz, and the Brothers....

Thanks Gregj

I agree with you too...

Was going to say that if Greg has that absolute answer than his days here are numbered and he'll be working in the MM barn soon lol!  They are animals--on any given day there are a hundred things that can have an effect on their performance and attitude--some known and some not.  Would two trainers do it differently?  Probably.  Would one be better than the other--not necessarily.  I believe they are in good hands.

Mary

how did your betting go?

Guess, I did poor only one winner and that was the Travers...just knew that Afleet son would win...

Afleet Express was darn good...I was holding my breath..

What is the best thing that has happened in horse racing this year?

Hi Greg.  I hope you had fun at Saratoga. I was checking out everyone with huge cameras and their name tags to see if I could find you! The place was packed!!  I stopped and watched some of the press conference with Jimmy Jerkins after the Travers.  What a race!  Everyone was sorry to watch Rachel lose yesterday. I love her anyway, no matter what.  I hope she shows up for the Ladies Classic at Churchill in November.  I am heading to the Woodward Stakes Saturday, are you going up Greg?  I am hoping Mine That Bird does better with blinkers.  Anyone know if they are entering Quality Road? I felt really bad for Super Saver.  Pletcher said they are going to do some tests on him.  I hope he is ok. I finally hit on a race yesterday.  I bet on MaryLou Whitney's WowWowWow and Zapster!

Ragsy,

Any human/animal interactions are complicated.  You are trying to understand an animal where you don't understand their language or even their body language, at times.  

You interrupt what an animal would do in nature. You might say that the more you ask, the more complicated it can be.

Like others, you wonder what the answer is- and let's keep in mind that we are all just Monday morning quarterbacks here.  Does Nicanor have an attitude?  Is it time to consider gelding him? (If it's the studdy part coming out or the fact that both parents, from what I've read, were a handful on the track) Or is he bored with it all?  (Why I think this horse needs to jump, would give him something else to figure out and I'm so not thinking just hunter courses...)

It could be a gazzillion things.  But all relationships are complicated!

Ragsy, no I didn't bet this weekend.  I was shopping in New Orleans with my daughter.  If I had stayed home I would have bet on Super Saver to win the Travers.  I really believe that something is not quite right with him.  I hope his connections figure it out, because in my mind he is really a spectacular horse.  Glad you won a race.  I got lucky last week with Debussy.  I just knew he was going to win and he did in spectacular fashion.

HorseFirst

I would love to see Nicanor doing dressage and jumps since both are so beautiful to watch.  As far, as gelding Nic,  I say no but I dont matter so...

Mary

I talked myself out of going to New Orleans to see Rachel run because she was going to the Apple Blosson and I could see her and Zen at the same time...what a bummer....

Ragsy,

I saw Rachael race in New Orleans back in March.  She is one beautiful horse.  So sorry that she lost that race.

Ragsy, in my opinion the best thing that has happened in racing this year is that both of Barbaro's brothers are on the racetrack and actually have won one or more races.  That's amazing to me.  

I highly doubt the Jacksons would have Nicanor gelded.  I see him as their stallion after his racing career is over.

Mary

I dont know what happened to me but when the Brothers run I cry, I cant stop, I just love them so much. Yes, I like your thoughts on the Brothers racing still..

I will never forgive myself for missing Rachel in New Orleans,I will catch her in Kentucky ( I Hope )  I tried to trade Zenyatta Pictures with a blogger that had Rachel pictures but he would not...

Derby

What about Lentenor?  Nic is one handsome dude....Both are stunning..

Ragsy, they are stunning. The fact that Barbaro's two full brothers actually made it to the racetrack is just a miracle in itself.  Of all the thousands and thousands of foals that are born each year, only a few get there and win.

I don't know about Nicanor, hopefully they are running tests to see if there is a problem; IMO I think that there is a problem.  As far as Lentenor is concerned, I suspect that he will race again very soon.

longtimeracingfan said, from above:

"um, been a fan of both boys since this all began.... but our boy Nicanor has always been a bit of a lad, as they say across the pond in the UK... he seems to resent being rated etc. Just a thought, maybe a brief surgery would straighten him out a bit? Without a good race record he is really not worth much as a stallion.... pedigree or not... especially since he has two full (INTACT) brothers.

Don't everyone scream at once. John Henry and a few others I could mention had long and fruitful careers as geldings, and didn't come into their potential until AFTER their surgery..."

I just love the way LTRF put that.  "Bit of a lad," huh?  Well, he's right, it could be what it takes and it would not be the crime of the century.  You have three full brothers and as of yet, not enough of a race record for the first two to qualify them for the shed.  Of course, you don't know unless you try and there's no going back.  But IF that was the magic cure and suddenly Nicanor became the race horse we'd like to believe he is, he'd do more for the legacy of the family than if he ended up in some obscure situation covering mares for $500 just because he was Barbaro's brother.

Nicanor's owners might be able to afford to keep a couple stallions, but would the big farms take one of them without a wee bit more racing record?

That said, there's still time but I've said the above because that's closer to reality.  I love them and I'd like to see them all carry on the legacy but at three brothers and maybe more....there's kind of a glut.  There's a reason they want a filly and I think they'd have been happy if Nicanor, Lentenor, and Margano had been fillies.

Flame suit on....

Ragsy...I'm with you on the crying thing.  I can't read anything about Barbaro without busting into tears. Just love him sooo much!

My heart is in my throat when either of the brothers run. I can't relax until the race is over and it looks like they made it home safely.  Don't think my heart could take another Barbaro accident. Or Eight Bells as far as that goes.

Can't wait to read Greg's articles about both races. Know he is busy with work and writing his stories. Gives us something to look forward to these days. By the way, Queen Z races on Oct. 2nd in the Zenyatta Stakes at Hollywood Park. That's my youngest grandson's birthday so will probably have to tape it. Can't wait though.

Ragsy...

I have an extra Z trading card for you. Have Greg send me your email address if you'd rather not post it here. I wouldn't post my here but that's just me.

Many on this blog will not have heard of Enticing,but she also is owned by the Lael Stables.As a 2 year old filly she won the very important Molecomb Stakes over 5 furlongs at Goodwood in England and

at four won another big race at the same track and distance.

Enticing is retired now and because of her natural speed,I am looking forward to her offspring.

Lou In Texas

Thanks on Zenyatta's next race date, I didnt know..  

I sure would like to get a picture of Enticing and see what she is like...

send the card to sonyferrarixano@yahoo.com

named after my 3 German Shepherd dogs...

Horsefirst really cracks me up with her flame suit on, cant you picture that one.....

It would be interesting to know how many racehorses Lael owns -- none of our business for sure, but interesting nonetheless.  Always hearing new names.

Nicanor and Lentenor make me cry -- can't explain it.  Perhaps because they are Barbaro's younger brothers but more than likely, just because they are who they are and are so impossibly beautiful and such sweet animals (well, MOST of the time).   I agree a little bit with everyone posting  here since Last Wednesday -- there is value in every perspective.  And I am frustrated, too, with the efforts to force Nicanor to run races in a way that he does not want to run them. AND he clearly does not like the whip -- we first noticed that in the Dixie.

But, I am not his trainer nor am I his owner, so my opinion must take its place in the pecking order...Dead Last!

I am amazed that we have gone from racing horses to "hey guys it's time to geld Nicanor". He is not your horse nor mine and though headstrong he is Nicanor and should not see that knife until he goes to claimers or the Jackson's pull him to retire him and his record is not good enough to become a stallion...then they might consider it but it is not for us to speculate and it is not our business. End of converssation.

Well...I wouldn't change one hair nor one breath of personality on the beautiful and delightful Nicanor. If I were sitting in an recliner at Fair Hill on a Monday morning watching TV with a remote in hand remote and someone asked me my opinion...hey weirder things have happened. I would say, "Lets try to get Nicanor to get a couple of grade II or III races wins before he is say six and then retire him to stud." Then I would be happy. If Nicanor wants to win a grade I or two along the line, I would be tickled pink. That is a around a year and or so from now. I think it is doable.

I can only see through the eyes of the individuals who have seen Nicanor as I have not had the opportunity to do so. So in terms of personality only, I think Nicanor maybe a Dynaformer without the brass knuckles, thanks in part to special loving handling and a special Mom. How he does on the racetrack remains to be seen. So if it isn't broken, let's refrain from trying to fix it. Michael Matz will figure him out.

And pretty please Greg, when you can, and if you can let us know how Nicanor is doing. Nicanor ever present tongue has been a constant in many pictures over the past four years and I would hate to hear Nicanor has hurt it.

I know nothing about training or racing horses, but I have been watching and watching... I see Nicanor wanting to GOooooooooo~!!!

He looks like he Does NOT want to be held back. He does not want to pace himself. He just wants to Go.

Is it that you cannot let them just go???

Let me tell it like it is with Nicanor, and I said this after his first race, using the whip on him AIN'T GONNA WORK.  Also, rating him AIN'T GONNA WORK.  I also was the first to suggest the blinkers before he won his first race, which in my opinion should go back on.  Excuse my language, but the whipping and rating scenario simply PISSES HIM OFF.  Hopefully this most beautiful and no doubt about it stubborn horse is okay.  

Geld Nicanor, come on.  You are right lobieb, crazy talk.  

Hey lobieb...you go girl!! Right on. Althought I can't see the Jackson's ever selling either brother because they are Barbaro's brothers and we all know how much Mrs Jackson loved him. Just my opinion.

Mary, your post makes the most sense -- the quiet from MM since Nic's race last week has been apparent.  Let's see what Michael decides to do with Nicanor.

Lobieb....

Get a grip!! Everyone understands who own's the Brothers, what's your beef???

There's a reason I said, "Flame suit on."  That's when you know you've put forth an idea that will be unpopular.

I put forth that idea because it had been said before and deserves some respectful consideration.  I am fully aware Nicanor is not "our" horse and the Jackson's will do whatever they want and what they think is best for him.

People on this board put forth all sorts of ideas and you don't ban one and allow others.  If you're going to ban all ideas, then blinkers, whip/no whip, Matz or not Matz, cannot be allowed.

Almost everyone on this board speculates.  I did it in a respectful manner and while you don't have to agree with any of my ideas, you don't have the right to tell anyone what will or won't be done, "end of conversation."

One of the reasons I broached this subject was to teach- longtimeracingfan is right, many a good gelding has gone on to fame and glory that would not have done so as a stallion.  Also, if the Jackson's were to consider it as an option, it would not come as a shock, just as part of the racing game.

First and foremost, the owners and trainer would have to decide IF it would make a difference or not.  In that vein, there are two maybe three more brothers available so their options are considerably broadened by that fact.

The reality is though, if Nicanor remains a stallion and his race record does not improve, he would not attract many mares.  There are other Dynaformer's out there, like Purim.

Like I've said before, we are all Monday morning quarterbacks on this forum.  Gelding a horse is no more out of line than putting blinkers on one, if the situation merits. No more out of line than my suggestion they try him in the jump races.  Or put him in the jumpers' arena.  Man in Havana is doing well in the hunters.

Nicanor's racing days are not close to ending yet and I do hope he turns things around.  He is certainly  a puzzle and as such, has provided much entertainment and head scratching for all on this forum.

Hey Ragsy...check your spam. I sent you an email so I could get your physical address and your real name. I found my extra Zenyatta trading card. I assume you still want it.

Horsefirst....you are definitely entitled to your opinion and I find your comments very interesting. I have learned alot on this blog from a lot of different people. It's really a mute point on gelding Nicanor because as you pointed out, it's not our decision. So why are people making such a big deal of this?  Who knows they may geld him. They certainly don't need our approval to do so. There is Mind That Bird that was gelded also. He has done a lot better since according to his use to be trainer Chip Woolley. It wouldn't be the end of the world !! I'm sorry some can't respect your opinion whether they agree with you or not. You just have to let it go. Put on that "Flame Suit" and go forward.

Horsefirst, you are certainly correct. All opinions should and as far as I am concerned welcome. I think that now I will just wait until Gregg can give us an update on Nicanor and Lentenor and maybe even Matz will give a statement so all of us can stop wondering and guessing. I hope that Nic is physically alright out of his last race and after that what ever his owners decide, we will have to accept. We won't love him any less for sure ~!!

There is a big difference between gelding a horse and putting blinkers on him.  

By the way, there have been many horses that did nothing on the track and still left a great legacy.  Bull Dog comes to mind.  He was a full brother to Sir Gallahad  In 8 starts, he won 2 races and 1 place.  He went on to be the leading broodmare sire of more than 85 stakes winners, and he was the leading broodmare sire in 1954, 55, and 56.  Obviously he had something that he passed on to his daughters.  So please no more talk about gelding this lovely horse, Nicanor.

Horsefirst, you are right, Nicanor is a puzzle.  I did learn somthing about him in this race though; he is not a sprinter, but more importantly, something is not quite right with Nicanor.    

Here is an article on Nearco and Nasrullah which explains the temperment issues with the Roberto side of Dynaformer.

www.sporthorse-breeder.com/.../000541.htm

Question:

When fillies race with colts does it matter or does it exacerbate things? In other words, would a filly in the race spur Nicanor on or would Nicanor treat her like one of the boys?

And I hope Horsefirst that you didn't take what I said personally. I like to be a Monday morning quarterback as well, but I am always afraid someone is going to grumble at me.

Loved catching up on all this...these brothers are so very lucky to have so many fans and a training team that really cares for their best interest.

Well Nasrullah was the sire of Bold Ruler, sire of Secretariat.  Bold Ruler, great line.

What I am getting at with the article is Nicanor probably has his own mind about things and although I am guessing he is not as difficult as his old man, it is probably easier to get Nicanor to do things if you apply a spoonful of sugar as oppose to something less sweet. I think Nicanor is capable of winning races, they just need to figure out Nicanor's 4 year old self.

Kathy,

Thank you for that link to the article.  It helps educate those who are just learning the back history of these bloodlines.  Keep in mind that Dynaformer also has Ribot, another stallion with a reputation. (Although I believe he was found, after dying, to have a tumor)  And perhaps you're seeing why the Jackson's have these horses with Matz.  He may have the patience to deal with the temperments.  

Mary,

I know about horses like Bull Dog.  Then there's Alibhai, who never raced, sire of Your Host who went on to sire Kelso.

However, that was a different era.  Fewer horses being bred and a system of farms owned by generations of racing families who were breeding to race and for themselves, not for the market.  A stallion who had the bloodlines might be given a chance.  And that chance might be a good one because the farm had good mares.  A good stallion will improve anything but might never get a chance to make his mark without good mares.  It was a different time and place.  I believe there is a recent article on Blood Horse that kind of alludes to that.  These farms would also cull what didn't work.

The Jackson's may certainly give Nicanor a chance in the shed.  But do they have all the quality mares that they'd need?

I brought up the option of gelding for education.  Just as people believed that ONLY Edgar could ride the brothers, then ONLY Rosie could ride them, then....

I'd love nothing more than to see Nicanor burn up the track.  Because you know what?  I really like this brother. I love them all but I'm fascinated by Nicanor.  He seems a bit different and I like that.  If it took gelding to bring out that potential, then so be it.  Somewhere under that bay hide of his is an athlete.  Just what venue he's an athlete in, I'm not sure any one knows.      

Kathy

Very interesting article on the Roberto Side Of Dynaformer.  E for Excellent... Gives great insight into the temperament and character of those horses...

Lou In Texas

There are no emails I will check again..

I dont allow hunting on my property so yesterday, I watched a small young deer and she would not leave a certain area, after watching for an hour, I went over to her and found behind a bush a dying baby deer about 1 foot in height he/she had been shot. Why would anyone do that?  Just discusted me.  

First,

I wanted everyone to know that Nicanor did not bleed at all in his race and that both brothers are doing great.

Second,

I wanted to apologize for not getting a blog entry up sooner, I have just had a very crazy week.  Before I head up to Saratoga tomorrow, I should have it posted with some photos.  Thanks

Take your time Greg....we're a patient bunch.....HA, HA, HA!!  Seriously--looking forward to it and glad to hear all is well...with you AND them!

Greg, are you going to have a press ID tag on?  I will look for you.  I am hoping Mine that Bird at least hits the board tomorrow.  I feel bad about him not winning since the 09 Derby.  I'm really glad to hear that Nic did not bleed.

Thanks Greg for the info on Nicanor. Really releived that he was not bleeding and both brothers are safe and healthy.

Have fun this weekend and a safe trip to and from Saratoga.

Hope everyone has a happy and safe Labor Day weekend. And that includes all the jockeys and horses running everwhere. Don't need another day like yesterday.

Ragsy:  With reply to what is "my beef".  I think that you have to reread what I said, there is no "beef" there but just stating a fact that I did not understand where all the "gelding" was coming from.  Don't put words in my mouth if you don't understand what I was trying to say. I love the brothers but Nic has a minor temperment like his daddy, he is not gelded and was a great runner once he was figured out, so let it be with Nic, otherwise there wouldn't be any little Dynaformers running around,  figure out what makes him tick and he will win and that has nothing to do with gelding him.  To me he will probably make one great stallion in his own way and time.  Remember Dynaformers perform better with age. Lentenor wants to please, Nic wants to be his own man.

Hey Lobieb

Thanks for your answer, it makes great sense...I do not want him gelded either, I am for Nicanor..

Why is it so difficult to answer his personality problems since many others are from the same bloodlines?

many thanks

First of all, gelding a horse is an option.  It is an option that has helped many a horse reach his full potential.  Is it under consideration?  Who knows?  I brought it back up because it's ONE of the tools in the box. I thought that people might want to know and should understand that it can be an option.

Second, gelding is not a "for or against" issue.  Not in the least.  For those that don't know, geldings generally live far happier and useful lives than stallions.  Even the blue bloods on the Kentucky farms, who get the best of care, don't always do well in that environment when kept apart from other horses.  They are around them but never with them.  To a horse, that's a big difference.

Third, with two brothers coming up and another potentially on the way, (Don't know what LVR is carrying) there won't exactly be a deficit of Dynaformer/LVR crosses to breed to.  On most other posts I visit, Lentenor is considered more talented than Nicanor and just between those two, Lentenor is most likely to head to the shed after his career.  Time will tell. And so far, Margano looks the most like Dynaformer of them all.

So please, don't twist what I'm saying around to a "for or against" issue regarding Nicanor.  Whatever is in the best interest of the horse, I am for.  IF (Please respect the fact that I said IF) that were something that happened, I'd want people to not be shocked by it.

The reality is, Nicanor is very, very fortunate that the Jackson's own him and have the money to keep him at the track in training.  Just because they can has no relationship to his potential value in the shed.

Hey FOB's....if you will go to Mill Ridge Farm and look under Barbaro's Family you will see some beautiful pictures of Margano. He is absolutely georgous and soo big. It doesn't say when the pics were taken but from his size I would guess not to long ago.  

The photos are here:

www.millridge.com/barbaros-family.aspx

Enjoy!!!

Lou,I saw an old video of baby Margano. Is this what you are talking about?

He just gets more and more GORGEOUS -- with the dropping of his winter coat he's lightened a little (but only a little).  We need some more information about this young fella -- what his personality is like now, etc  He is a gorgeous boy!

The Mill ridge photo page disappeared the other day and that is when they must have been adding these new photos of Margano -- Man, is he stunning!  PERFECTION!

Thanks Lou In TX for the heads up. Margano is certainly a baby no more.  He is very handsome.  His legs have turned so dark compared to when he was younger. I guess they will be shipping him out soon for training.

My boy, Here Comes Ben, ran a courageous race in the Forego.  After splitting horses, he just took off.  He is 4 for 4 this year.  A big step up in class for him.  The pictures of Margano are just lovely; he is a real beauty.

daisymae...if you will click on the very first one listed at the top of the page, I believe it says "LaVille Rouge 2009 Barabro's Full Brother". It shows the newest pics of Margano plus some of when he was younger. It also shows some of Lentenor older and younger and the same with Nicanor. Those of Nicanor when he was older were taken right before he shipped to Fla. Click on Barbaro's Family or the site I listed on here. They were taken by the Mill Ridge photographer. Hope that helps.

Penny in TX....Margano will ship this month to Ocala, Fla for his training with the Stephens. Don't know the exact date but maybe Greg can find out for us. I know Lentenor was shipped aroung the 15th. Hopefully we'll get some news soon about our youngest brother.

Hope everyone had a fun and safe Labor Day weekend. You to Greg!! Hope you won lots of $$$$ at Saratoga.

Poor Mind That Bird. Feel so sorry for him. Don't think he's got the right trainer. He's a closer not one to run up front. Send him back to Chip he knows that horse better than anyone.

Howdy Lou

Margano pictures are wonderful, he looks so much like Dynaformer its mazing...but his color is not as dark as I was thinking.  one hunk of a fella...

I found a fella on a blog that is taking Rachel pictures for me, I cant wait to see her beautiful face...cant wait to get them....

Actually, Daisymae, just go to Mill Ridge Farm and click on Barbaro's Family and then scroll down -- the first 4 pictures are of Margano (LVR 2009).

Thanks Marigold, your instructions were a lot simpler. Hope she gets to see them.

Ragsy, he wasn't as dark as he was in the pics earlier. But you can't miss him with that little white spot on his shoulder. He still has Mom's soft eyes. Have you gotten your card yet? I have an extra one of RA if you need one. Hope you get your pics soon. I have several of Zenyatta. They hang on a different wall than the Barbaro family.

Greg, we're all trying to be calm waiting on your articles.  Have any idea when they might be up?

Just a reminder, Barbaro had a big engine.  In the Kentucky Derby, he ran the last 1/4 mile as fast as Secretariat.  There is no doubt in my mind that Barbaro could have matched or beaten Secretariat's record, but his connections were looking for a win, not a record; save him for the next race.  It's against all odds, but there is a chance that somewhere down the line one of Barbaro's full siblings could possibly repeat his legacy.  But then again, I'm a dreamer; love the against all odds scenario.

Nicky and Lenny had a workout today good to see that with all the speculation going around..just love these boys...

See where both our boys had nice works yesterday and today.  Go Nic and Lentenor.

No followups since the races are long over?  Waiting for a "brothers" fix!!!

Where can we go to see Nicanor's and Lentenor's workouts.  Is there a web page?

Lou In Texas

I just received in the mail today the Zenyatta card, she is of course beautiful...Oaklawn was out of these the week of the Apple Blossom, I spent a week there enjoying the horses except the Beautiful Rachel Alexandra....they start racing at Oaklawn around Jan. 18,2011 and I will go and see more horses....Yeah, if you have and extra Rachel would love to see hers...

Your Kindness is appreciated...

Rose

See where Lentenor has been nominated for the Fifth Marine at Belmont on 9/15, whether he gets in or not is to be seen.  It is a turf race.  Go Lentenor.

Lentenor going in the Kent Stakes at Delaware on the 25th!

Hope Steve has time soon to give us an update!!  

Fifth Marine did not fill but looks like he will be going on 9/25 at Delaware in the Kent or dang he is also nominated at Woodbine on the 9/25.  Hopefully Greg will be able to find out what race he is actually going to be in.

From what Greg has mentioned, Lentneor will be racing on the 25th not the 15th and he (Greg) plans to be there. I think he said at Delaware Park. Will check and get back to you if that's not correct.

Hello Greg J. where are you? Stop gambling and finish this blog. We would like to see some pictures.

Barry,

Funny one, no gambling this weekend, lol.  Photos and new entry will be up tomorrow, sorry for the delay.