Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

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re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

moodygirl — Sun, 31 May 2009 20:06:26 GMT

This is some really serious stuff. I still say you all need to come together to warn others & protect yourselves. Surely there is an attorney amongst you who could advise you on how to set it up so you won't get sued for reporting someone. It could be a web site where people can check to see if there have any bad reports on a prospective stable. How can you all continue to take these risks (even after checking references & keeping an eye on your horse)and lose all this money? Hold their the feet to the fire!

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

catnip lane — Sun, 31 May 2009 19:56:32 GMT

Lazaro, I totally agree with you that in '85 $20/day was big money and should have gotten you the very best of care for your mare. I don't really have a good answer as to how to find the right boarding farm for an individual other than to visit the farm before you send the mare and ask a lot of questions. Like I said before, I know a lot of people in all facets of the business and the majority of people I know are hard working, honest people doing the best they can. Yes there are crooks and cheats and liars out there. Thats true of all businesses. I can't possibly begin to defend all of Lexington. But I can tell you that we have the most advanced veterinary care in the world here. We have highly advanced podiatry available. We have 2 feed companies that do major research into nutritional needs of equines of all ages and types and then manufacture feeds to meet those needs. We have whatever it is in our soil/ grasses/ water that makes this area such a great place to raise healthy athletic horses. I don't think anyone has truly figured out what that combination actually is. We have a university that dedicates time and resources into many facets of the industry. It saddens me to hear all the negative about Lexington when I know that a lot of positive things happen here. I feel for each one of you that had a bad experience. I've seen the occassional bad thing happen that I thought could have been prevented, but I've also seen a whole lot more of good things happen - lots of difficult mares that got in foal, sick or injured horses that got high quality care and recovered, thin mares sent to the farms from elsewhere that were sent back to their homes fat, glossy and pregnant. I'm not saying that there's no bad farms here, because there are. But there are a LOT of good people doing good work here too and (from mareseatoats) to generalize all of Lexington as being in cahoots to screw everyone over is just not accurate. It's an exception in my experience. I like your suggestion of disclosure - what do u have in mind? Releasing pregnancy rates? complications rates? Injuries? Its an interesting idea....

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

mareseatoats — Sun, 31 May 2009 16:29:11 GMT

What no one tells you is that the vets are in cahoots with the farm managers. The vets go through the farms and run the charges up willy nilly and then they give the farm manager free vet care, free antibiotics...Can you say KICK BACK? The farm manager that I have now is a decent guy. He feeds good hay, feeds Nutrena feed, but he owns a couple of horses with the vet who is VERY YOUNG. This vet treated my broodmare three times with the same antibiotic to the tune of $750 each time plus the farm call plus the administration fee and still could not get her culture to come back clean. Duh! Then when I wanted to have a different vet that had no conflict of interest, all I got was crap from the farm manager. They do all sorts of dirty deals that we probably know nothing about. There should be some sort of disclosure, but never will that happen in the good ole' boy network in Kentucky!

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

lazaro — Sun, 31 May 2009 08:50:18 GMT

to catnip lane,

i went back and read your blog about government intervention and i have to agree that this is not the answer, but i do take exception to your contention that more money equals better care.

i go back to my first blog and the fact that i paid $20/day back in 1985. i think that was a good sum of money at the time, but it certainly didn't get my mare $20/day of quality care. was my experience an aberration? i say no.

lexington has the reputation of being the heart of the thoroughbred racing world, but when you hear that a mare who earned over a million dollars racing runs into a pickup in her pasture at "night" and kills herself or seven or eight babies get loose from a pasture and run onto a major expressway near lexington only to be run down and killed by a semi, it makes you feel that someone isn't doing their job, whether it be in management or the person who is responsible for maintaining a safe environment for these animals.

i fully understand that the thoroughbred can be his own worst enemy, but when you send your horse to a farm, you try to take into account the wide range of problematic situations that can arise. with this knowledge, you entrust personnel at these farms to deal with the tangible issues at hand, whether they be in the category of injury or illness and to react as quickly as possible to unexpected events . that is not too much to ask for your money.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

Carol — Sat, 30 May 2009 12:47:58 GMT

I have had mares boarded in Ky lost to lighting strike, colic, foaling, you name it. Not to mention foals lost also. (one even sent home with a boken pelvis) I have had mares return to Maryland supposedly having been well looked after but one returning with bad scratches, another with most of her coat gone due to skin disease. I accept a certain amount of risk and understand stuff happens but I think you need to be very careful where your mares are sent. Please don't involve the government though.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

horseslave — Fri, 29 May 2009 16:52:21 GMT

I have worked for farms in Canada that shipped their mares to Kentucky to be bred. The mares were usually sent to a large operation and always came back in terrible shape. Most of them lost an incredible amount of weight, quite a few came back with the worst cases of mud fever, rain rot and other such problems that took us months to treat. Some of the mares came back with injuries that should have required immediate vet attention while they were still in Kentucky (like large slivers in their shoulders, horrible eye infections, gaping wounds), instead they were shipped home with no warning only for us to pull them off and van and run for the phone to call our vet. We were prepared to give the Kentucky farm the benefit of the doubt until our vet consistently confirmed that these injuries were older injuries. I had to wonder what happened to a few of the mares down there as they no longer enjoyed being groomed or handled and some became extremely difficult to catch in a field. The foals obviously were not handled while away from us. What really bothered me though was that the farm owners back home continued to send the mares to the same farm in Kentucky each year. Talk about perpetuating the problem. I know of other people that have had great experiences when sending their mares to Kentucky, I just haven't been fortunate enough to have a pleasant experience.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

Springsmon83 — Fri, 29 May 2009 13:37:43 GMT

My mare boarding experience has been pretty decent. The first time I sent my mare to a small, mom and pop type operation. She received excellent care, came home at about the same weight that she left, and sporting a new halter. The owner told me, in detail, what he had learned about the mare and how she had handled being at his facility. He knew how she kept her stall and her eating habits. He could even tell me how much water she consumed daily and she was there for 6 weeks both times. Charges were daily and I was not charged for the halter since the owner told me that it was HIS mistake that her halter was damaged. This from a mare that could destroy one in 24 hours! The experience with the other facility was different. This was a larger facility with a larger influx of horses coming and going. We took her down and got her settled in her stall. This facility did not do much turn out, she seldom left her stall for the 5 weeks that she was there. It was good that we took an extra halter for hauling as both her halter and her blanket were missing. She was extremely overweight due to heavy feeding and no exercise for the duration of the stay. She was, however, bright, well cared for, and well groomed. The owners could not tell me anything specific about her, other than the written record, they knew nothing about her.

I personally think that the Mom and Pop operation will give the better care. They have to keep everyone happy to stay in business. The owners that use these facilities will spread news, both good and bad, by work of mouth. They are not catering to the large breeders and the extremely wealthy clients. Much of what has been said so far seems to back this up! From what I see, my more positive experience has been the exception rather than the norm.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

lazaro — Fri, 29 May 2009 10:46:59 GMT

in 1985, i paid $20/day at a prestigious farm in lexington in order that my mare be bred to one of their stallions.

a week after she arrived there, we went to see her. the first negative thing that i observed was that her stall had a dutch door and that both the upper and lower sections were closed on a hot day. i had no idea whether this was accidental or not, but it was disturbing to me.

secondary to that, but even more bothersome to me was the fact that she had a laceration on her lower right hind leg, which i found out was incurred on the day she arrived.

the stallion manager stated that she jumped into a large, circular stone water trough out in the pasture, possibly as a result of intimidation by other mares.

that i could understand, but what i couldn't understand was the fact that her wound was festering and infected and apparently had not been treated with proper care. this was at least seven days later.

when another of my mares came home from another farm in lexington. every single spot on her ankles that had little or no hair from pinfiring was infected. in my mind, it does not matter why it took place, but rather, the fact that it was not treated by the facility.

also, on another subject , but no less important, i had a colt in training and he was gelded at this facility. the site became infected and he was given penicillin. if not for the immediate intervention of the vet on the premises, he would have died.

i had given this horse penicillin on at least two prior occasions without a hint of a problem and even though i have heard that a sensitivity to such a drug can develop over a period of time, i do not believe that this was the case. i think that it was nothing more than improper administration by an unskilled farm employee.

in conclusion, it can be seen that all of my complaints were medically related, but as far as i am concerned, medical issues are of foremost concern to the wellbeing of any of our animals when they are in someone elses care and the fact we pay good money for that care also.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

PomDeTerre — Fri, 29 May 2009 03:19:57 GMT

How timely can this blog be? I bred my NY maiden mare in Florida ( to a stallion that is currently in top 20 list for 2nd yr sires) and left her there for about 5 months as she is nervous and I didn't want to see embryo aborted or absorbed. I brought her back to New York, and she stayed at a farm in the western part of statefor 3 months. She received great care there, and I often went out to follow her progress, dropping by unannounced and was always welcome.

Now the horror story begins... I had to breed her back to a NY stallion to keep my foal eligible for NY bred status. The stallion chosen is farmd within 30 minutes of where I live , near Saratoga. I thought this was great as I'd be able to see the mare even more often, as well as be available upon foaling (due in Feb.) I checked with a number of people including horse vets and was recommended to a broodmare farm about 5 minutes from stallion and vet. Checked place out, all seemed in order. Once my mare arrived there, the owner did nothing but rag about how my mare was mistreated, underfed, in poor condition and not even pregnant- none of which was true. I showed up unnanounced a few times and was accused of taking time away from manager, when it was him who sought me out to talk to. I seriously considered changing farms, but as it was too close to foaling, I wish I had. My mare was three weeks late delivering, and I happened to be out of town. I finally arrived at farm when foal was FOUR DAYS old...a beauty! But then I looked at my mare and almost screamed! She had been torn about 4 inches in the birthing. Not only was this wound untreated, but she had puss running through her tail, and when I lifted the tail to look at cut, there was at least a cup full of puss around vagina and wound! I hardly doubt that this happened from the time she was let out @ 10 am that morning until I arrived. I started to leave paddock immediately to find manager. As I was leaving, my mare layed down to rest, and, as I watched, at least a gallon of watery liquid came GUSHING out of her. I brought farm mgr to see her- he knew NOTHING of her condition, and told me that I was the first to discover it! $ 2000 worth of vet bills, antibiotics and 3 flushes and many cultures later...she has been covered 4 times (separate heats) by the stallion (a multiple G1 winner whose sperm count is prolific). I intentionally did not cover while in foal heat. Bottom line- yesterday, vet called me: she has still not conceived on the cover of 18 days ago. Vet and I conferred at great length, and today a uterine biopsy was done. Vet feels that infection was limited to vaginal and external area only, but I a) believe it might have spread to uterus, possibly causing endometritis, leaving my mare possibly infertile and b) fail to see how or why this blatantly obvious infection went unnoticed. Thank God I showed up that day! And farm owner continues to brag about her list of "famous" clientele, trainers, owners who use her, while she has treated me like crap and abused my mare. And this place is 20 minutes from my house and highly thought of.

All I can say is I hope the owner can spell the word "negligence", because if my mare is infertile due to this pathetic lack of attention, she has ruined a top quality broodmare. I hope she also has a good attorney.

I'd welcome your comments about this nightmare. Thanks for allowing me to vent, and , PLEASE choose your facility carefully; I thought I had, but my mare's future is now in jeopardy due to the quality of care she received

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

PomDeTerre — Fri, 29 May 2009 03:18:49 GMT

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

sceptre — Fri, 29 May 2009 01:11:54 GMT

To Catnip lane:

Note that you rejected the need for "government intervention", but I had suggested "industry" (through a centralized body) intervention (to use your term), not government. Among my points was an acknowledgment that state governments would be insufficiently motivated to step in. One can infer, however, that you would also be against any type of mandated standard of care. You feel that the level of care afforded their horses should be left to the discretion of the owners. If they're content with lousy care owing to their "business plans", or their pocketbooks, or because of lack of knowledge and/or oversight, or general lack of concern,that's fine by you. Well, that's not fine by me, and among the main reasons for the suggestion I offered. Should such minimum standards result in unaffordability for some, then yes, they should disinvolve themselves from horse ownership. What's the alternative; that it's ok for the horse to endure poor care? Your post addresses this issue from just the owners' standpoint, as if only he/she counts. Perhaps you took this position merely to point out the NEED for some to expend more for their horses' well-being. That's fine, but your words suggest that we have a fundamental difference in matters relating to animal ethics.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

catnip lane — Thu, 28 May 2009 20:55:40 GMT

I must disagree with sceptre - I don't think government intervention is the way to go. I think it's the mare owner's responsibility to do their homework before they decide where to send their mare. I have lived in central Kentucky and worked in the horse business for over 20 yrs. Yes, there is a wide range of farms - from high quality to the lowest of lows. And I personally take care of my own horses myself, largely because I am very picky about how they are treated. I believe its all about money. I'm not saying that farm owners are greedy and just out to screw mare owners. Most of the people I know in the business are honest, hardworking folks that are living paycheck to paycheck. But what I AM saying is that it costs a lot of money to take care of horses the way some of you are demanding. If you want your horse up in the barn every night, you need to pay someone to put them up at night, pay for the bedding and for someone to clean that stall 7 days a week and put hay, feed and water in that stall, and for someone to turn that horse out. And of course the farm has to have the facilities to put the horse in and the liability insurance and all the other costs of operating a business. I think everyone gets what i'm trying to say. If you can only afford to board your mare for $15/day (just an example) then you'll get $15/day service. If you want more than the minimum service then you need to shell out the dough to provide that. I think its the mare owner's responsibility to ask specific questions of the farm manager (not just how much/day and can I send my mare), and to follow up with visits. And I must agree that taking a hard look at the other horses on the property, and not just your own, is also a good idea. The other side of the coin is this. Some people are just in the horse industry as a business. They don't care how the horses get from point A to point B, as long as it happens. And they want to maximize their profits. So for those folks, some of the management practices you are describing are acceptable to them because it is cheaper. So it comes back to money. What is your mare and future offspring worth? and how much can you afford to spend on her board each year? If you legislate a certain standard of care then I suspect very few of us could afford to board horses at all.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

MOODYGIRL — Thu, 28 May 2009 17:06:59 GMT

Oh My God! My rose colored glasses are now off. My Grandad & his brothers were in the business, I am only a fan. If I were one of you all with these nightmare experiences I would be enraged. You should band together to find some way to get the information out to other horse owners about these particular facilities. This blog is a start but there has to be a way to name names working toward accountability. This is an expensive business. Could the Better Business Bureau be of any help or at least serve as some kind of initial model? There should be a central registry where complaints & documentation could be entered and prospective boarders could freely access the information. I'm not a big believer in bureaucracy because they usually don't work & are vulnerable to corruption. However, inspectors to check out these complaints to add further documentation sounds good. These could be semi-retired horse folk (does anybody fully retire) or internship opportunities for equine students, vet students. One final thought, I WOULD PUT ONE OF THOSE TINY CAMERAS IN MY HORSE'S HALTER to find out what was really going on in my absence. God Bless You All.

re: Mare Care at the Boarding Farm

Will — Thu, 28 May 2009 14:23:38 GMT

Let me just say don't ever drop a mare off and not do everything in your power to follow up and drop in unanounced!! I dropped a mare for 5 weeks when she was 12 years old she is now 18 and I still fight with her to get a halter on and off!! I can't even figure out what went on those 5 weeks