The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

kathleen o — Sat, 26 Jun 2010 18:20:52 GMT

dray, let me know when one of your top five wins 17 in a row

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

LAZMANNICK — Mon, 21 Jun 2010 05:19:57 GMT

Shane

If Zen's opening fraction was 11.60 she probably would have run a sub 1.48 1-1/8M. If you're trying to say that final splits don't mean much why is there always so much talk about horses running a final 1/4 in 24 or less?

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Slew — Sun, 20 Jun 2010 14:22:10 GMT

Happy Fathers' Day.

Did anyone see Gozzip Girl yesterday? I thought she was the best of the contenders, but she stumbled badly coming out of the gate and lost her jockey immediately. He's ok though...I hope she is; I think it took a lot to wrangle her but they eventually did.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Paula Higgins — Sat, 19 Jun 2010 02:24:24 GMT

Monica, yes, I do know what you mean about Draynay and agree. There is a good person there. I believe he loves all these horses. But like CV and Kay, I could strangle him when he is being provocative, which is just about all the time LOL.

Kay, I enjoyed reading your take on the crowds and California tracks. I wish I could have been there, but the best I could do is buy a Zenny bobblehead off of eBay. ITA about TVG. They get her greatness.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

drfager01 — Fri, 18 Jun 2010 20:55:33 GMT

guninpocket thats a silly comparison. like in boxing style make fights. in horse racing style make or break you. so dont be decieved by time. running against 4 claiming fillies is far less pressure filled than rinning againts better colts and older horses. had rachel run in the foster and lets say hypothetically speaking she won the foster. you tell me how much that would have taken out of her. in this case time is not the judge we all know unless your a closer like secretariat or zenyatta, large fields usually produce slower times than a 4 horse race.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Pedigree Shelly — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:39:28 GMT

I certainly hope I Want Revenge goes in the Suburban on Saturday ! IWR really blew my mind in the '09 Wood Memorial ! I've never seen a horse get stuck in the gate , yet go on to win going away ! If he gets back to his old self after his injury , Watch out QR and others :)

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

shane — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 13:42:48 GMT

and when you guys start talking splits.....please use the WHOLE race because I guarantee that if Zenyatta ran her first splits in an 11.60, she would not be running her last split in a 11.60. Come on people you guys are taking what you want from the race and using it.....gimme her every split for the race please.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

shane — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 13:39:36 GMT

GunBow,

I think the weight adjustment is more for the race in particular. Competitive weight, So by your estimates Rachael should be undefeated this year, because she was giving weight in both of her losses, yet you never said that. You just go on about how she is not that good. You cant just use weight the way you want to use it be consistent with your argument about weight. You cant just drop a hoses time 2 seconds because of the weight. If she had carried 118, Mike smith might have let her lay back a little more.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

tvnewsbadge — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 05:06:23 GMT

Kit J says

"I have seen several articles about Zenyatta, several about the Triple Crown races and during Breeders Cup a two page spread.

I saw a 3 sentence blurb about Rachel her first race back, nothing after that."

And Zenyatta does any better? The weekend sports guy on my local TV station has never heard of her, seriously. I've had several heated arguments with him about that.

And as far as seeing Zenyatta run, the only way I could watch her last race was to spend Sunday night at the OTB, sucking down ersatz MM peanuts from the quarter machine with the local gambling crowd who could give squat about Zenyatta, Rachel, or any of the rest.

Isn't it pretty laughable when people talk about either of these horses being a "draw" for the sport in any significant way when you have to visit your fan-unfriendly OTB or wait for the grainy YouTube upload to see Zenyatta's greatest race???

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Saratoga AJ — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 02:17:30 GMT

helsbelles:

Are you simple or just being funny? You compare a horse going for a record 17 straight wins with the Met Mile? Quality Road as great as he is was not going for any records. And it was a Holiday weekend to boot.

When Rachel ran last September 5th at Saratoga, she brought in the biggest crowd ever for the Saturday in the middle of Labor Day Weekend, almost 30,000.

And what would Zenyatta gain by racing at the oldest and most historic track in the country, as well as the premier racing meet in the world? To even imply that there is no benefit to Zenyatta racing at Saratoga indicates how little you know. Or maybe you are just joking.

I hope for your sake it's the latter.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

LAZMANNICK — Thu, 17 Jun 2010 01:22:43 GMT

Zen has no chance of defeating Rachel if she avoids her.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Backtalk — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 23:10:02 GMT

Ditto to berttheclock's comment. It took me longer to read this blog than Atlas Shrugged.

And it looked to me like Z got her big hind end beat more than 6 times . . . no hand-ride for her in any case and no victory by 10 1/2 lengths either.

I am thrilled and happy that both horses won their races this week--it was an exciting week for racing.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

LAZMANNICK — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 18:34:46 GMT

robinm

I think that Kate Harpe is saying that Zen has never lost to allowance horse unlike Rachel (who has).

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Colmel — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 18:19:31 GMT

Paula, JAJ, and many others. Thanks for keeping this blog real. Jason, don't know how you STAND it. Someone much earlier posted that they think Draynay needed blinkers. Perhaps hobbles would be a better idea.

I still will never understand why there are those who can't just appreciate their favorite horse(s) without having to run others down. It just seems childish. It just amazes me that we are so lucky to have some extremely talented horses out there competing at such high levels. What really amazes me are the girls! Here are two exceedingly good - no, that's too tame a word - spectacular females whose babies would bring millions still running. Every time they step foot on a track (training or racing) there's a chance of injury. The fact that the connections are still allowing them to compete is more for the fans. I'd love to see a blog about which stallions these two giants should be bred to.

Jason - thanks again for moderating this Blog. At least this is never dull.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Draynay — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 17:11:02 GMT

The winner of the Woodward will win HOY again this year.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

guninpocket — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 17:08:53 GMT

First things, first, the mare had to get fit. Now, she accomplished that and look at her time. She beat a pretty good male horse running that day on the same track by a second and he was all out to win, she was coasting and would have beat him by 5 lengths. Right now her only competion is Quality Road and hopefully everybody stays sounds , including Zenyetta and we see them in the Breeders Cup.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Kate Harper — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 15:42:20 GMT

Robinm,

I was responding to Draynay's list of horses he considers better than Zenyatta. My point was RA HAS lost to allowance horses, Zenyatta never has. I was not inferring RA was an allowance horse nor implying her career victories have come only against ungraded competition. Sorry if I confused you.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Draynay — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 13:22:24 GMT

robinm, please don't try to compare G1 winning males in open company against ANYTHING Zenyatta has done this year. When Zenyatta wins ANY race vs. males this year let me know. I'll wait.....

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

helsbelles — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 13:02:55 GMT

I have no doubt that Saratoga and NY would love to have Zenyatta come race there, filling their coffers and rescuing this sport. I just don't see any benefit to HER.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

helsbelles — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 12:33:58 GMT

Saratoga AJ, There were 9,386 in attendance to watch Quality Road's Met Mile, but don't let mere facts get in the way of your hateful attitude.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Draynay — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 12:21:39 GMT

jayjay, huh ? The winner of the Woodward will be Quality Road at the 6 to 5 favorite. Again this years Woodward winner will be HOY. robinm I don't care what Zenyattas record is against girls on poly. Zenyatta barely caught a little horse who through a shoe. Do you honestly think she can catch Rachel who time and time and time and time and time and time and time again runs FASTER. Zenyatta is a very average dirt horse. She has no chance of beating Rachel or Quality Road on dirt. If they did all race the two of them would never know she was in the race. Zenyatta has NEVER gone past 1 1/8th on dirt and I have no reason to believe she can. She struggled her last race getting whipped again and again. She is not ready to run long on dirt.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

Saratoga AJ — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 10:33:07 GMT

Kay:

There is no excuse for 12,232 no matter how hard you spin it.

She would draw more than that in just about any major track back East and you know it.

And that includes Saratoga, aka "The Big Time". I mean come on out here to the "Majors"! lol

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

robinm — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 04:53:32 GMT

Draynay; like her or not, Zenyatta's record is better than any of your Top 5. As to who would beat who, it largely depends on the distance. Same to those of you comparing Goldikova to Zenyatta and Rachel. They are each very different horses with different running styles and favored distances. Each could beat the other depending on the surface and distance.

Kate Harper: Are you suggesting Rachel is an allowance horse, or that she has only defeated allowance horses, or that Zenyatta has never lost to allowance horses? You might want to clarify that statement because you came off sounding pretty ignorant no matter how your comment is interpreted.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

jayjay — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 03:32:16 GMT

LOL Draynay, you crack me up. What does have the previous winners of Woodward have anything to do with this year's Woodward ?? If the Woodward was upset for some unknown reason, would you crown that horse the HOTY ?? Sometimes, you make me think you are a 2nd grader LOL.

re: The Fleur de Lis? Not For the Horse of the Year

LauraS — Wed, 16 Jun 2010 03:22:10 GMT

Too bad the Woodward isn't the race it once was, at 1-1/2 miles at Belmont in late September. I know it's been run at various distances over the years, but I think the glory days were the ones at 1-1/4 and 1-1/2 miles. IMO and YMMV