Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

JerseyBoy — Fri, 22 Jul 2011 19:38:38 GMT

There seem to be lots of South African studies on this subject. Here are two excerpts from a report on a South African study that appeared in Today@Colorado State, June 29,2009.

1-"Furosemide, used in the United States and Canada to treat bleeding into the airways in thoroughbred racehorses, decreases the incidence of hemorrhage according to results of a recent study. The study, conducted by Colorado State University, the University of Melbourne and the University of Pretoria in the Republic of South Africa, provides a foundation for racing authorities to make decisions regarding use of this medication, which is the subject of heated debate and controversy around the world".

2-"Use of the medication is controversial because work previously conducted by these scientists found that it enhanced the performance of Throughbred and Standardbred horses".

The URL is attached:

www.today.colostate.edu/story.aspx

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

EJMitchellKy — Fri, 22 Jul 2011 17:03:27 GMT

Interesting comments from Kenny McPeek in the most recent edition of "And They're Off." He makes a good point toward the end of his segment about offering the blue-collar runners an opportunity to continue racing on Salix but eliminate the race-day medication in stakes races.

www.bloodhorse.com/.../21345DE1-653B-44EB-B8CF-49D3835700F5

I still have concerns about creating a mixed bag of regulations but it might be worth considering.

Also, I would like to point out I see very few similarities between U.S. racing and racing in Europe and Hong Kong. It was brought out during the medication summit how differently the training environment is in Europe compared with the U.S., where most horses train at racetracks in urban areas. And Hong Kong, while top-shelf racing, is a very selective and controlled environment in which 90% of the horses racing are geldings.

Where racing is more comparable to the U.S., I think, is Australia. Anyone want to weigh in on this?

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Mary in VT — Fri, 22 Jul 2011 15:01:22 GMT

Mr Baffert,

If medication goes the racing world will go with it? Really? Mark his words everybody. It will be interesting to see if this prediction proves correct or ridiculous if an industry wide phase out does occur.

But I do agree that your industry is in real danger of evaporating before your very eyes for a variety of reasons that revolve around deeply entrenched aspects of it's image being less than family friendly. Parents have to consider whether it is wise to expose little Johnny to the possibility of tragedy as one of the gorgeous horses breaks down beofre their eyes, or the need to explain that B means that this horse is racing on pain medication, and "Oh look, Johnny. L means that this horse is racing on a medication to prevent it from hemoraghing at the nostrils from it's exertions. Isn't this fun kids! Good stuff, huh!" Excetera.Excetera. Excetera.

If American horse racing is truly so propped up by race day medication that it can't exist without them then perhaps it is time that it died a quiet death and left the thoroughbred horse to the people that cherish it enough not to run a horse that requires long term medication. Who knows? Maybe someting sensible would rise up out of the ashes.

Love the Bloodhorse just the way it is for a myriad of reasons not the least of which is it's forum for robust debate.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

SUNNY FARM — Fri, 22 Jul 2011 13:06:47 GMT

Good Morning !

I have in front of me, the book:

Race Horse Training (Collins 1938 )

Sub-titled "Venture All ".

I have other old Throughbred training books, pre-1900's. I have YET to find any words or chapters to describe "Bleeding in race horses". It wasn't the norm back then, from what I gather.

Back "In the day", the horses ran TWO, even FOUR heats, all well over a mile IN ONE DAY. Back then, from what I read in Collin's book, the horses were walked & rested as needed !!!

Banning the 'drugs" will NOT cause everyone to quit racing. What banning the drugs will do is to give hope to those who race as sportsmen & care about their horses. As the word gets known, more of "us" will join up and arrive at the tracks. In the beginning, it will cause some loss but it will be well worth it.

IT'S WORTH THE RIDE TO GET WHAT YOU WANT"

Even though everyone laughed at me for choosing the old,anchient mares,with the old classic bloodlines,for my breeding programe', I never laughed at myself. What I see here at my SUNNY FARM, is a bunch of HAPPY horses who feel great...naturally.

I see no bleeders here, if I do, I'll change the career of that youngster,because that is the right & proer thing to do for the welfare of that horse.

I love my horses a LOT...so do many others....do not worry, we WILL come to race as soon as the playing field has become a level & fair venue. The fans will bet "heavier" and the Handi-cappers will find more enjoyment & satisfaction.

YOU GO MR.Stronach, and press forward with your rule changes,they are for the right reasons.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

nedjohnsonsux — Thu, 21 Jul 2011 16:13:40 GMT

Thanks for your response.

The truth is they use plenty of medication on horses in the rest of the world, many cases more than we do here. They brag about no race day medication, but give them plenty leading up to the race. Spend some time in a yard and you will see tons of syringes and drugs, and not all in the hands of veterinarians. (here if you have a syringe you are ruled off) And their horses do bleed. The only thing they have going is shorter season. But make no mistake, they medicate, and quite a bit. And they love running in the US as they can use Salix.

We have too many hypocrites here, chief among them is this year's Derby winner who loves to talk the talk abut eliminating meds but uses them on nearly 100% of his charges.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Arian Haxhillari — Thu, 21 Jul 2011 03:38:11 GMT

We need a randomized control study to address this issue as if we do with any drug in human studies. No study up to this point is of this kind regardless the results. Forget the South Africa or Australia studies.

They just prove some point but are not the one we need to base our scientific results.

Arian Haxhillari

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Onechaser — Thu, 21 Jul 2011 01:01:09 GMT

I agree. Ban all race day meds in all the races. Keep the sport on a level playing field. It would be better for the breed and for the future of racing.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Needler in Virginia — Thu, 21 Jul 2011 00:07:31 GMT

Oh, please. Meds are administered for a reason, be it legal or illegal. If meds are legitimately required, fine, but that horse should not be racing until the need for the meds is over. If a horse requires long term meds to race at all, maybe that fact alone is enough to judge that horse unfit to race. If the meds are illegal......... well, we won't go there.

Why not slam bad practices? Bad practices in baseball, football, basketball, ice hockey and YES! even curling, should be condemned as just that....bad for the sport. Why not in racing, too??? Racing is not perfect, nor are the other sports, but with so many ways to wager available, I would think racing would want to present a rather more elevated picture of our sport than it has done. Race day meds DO NOT present racing in the best light.

Cheers.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

s delight — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 23:07:45 GMT

In my opinion, the answer to these attitudes regarding medications for horses, is that any individual making the rules for medication should have to follow the same rules.

Let's do away with their heart medication, lasix for blood pressure, and of course other blood pressure meds, anti-inflammatories for when they take their daily jogs, and let's not forget the viagra......Horses are athletes and they are a live being performing under very difficult environments. Where's the common sense.......

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

sceptre — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 22:54:07 GMT

Eric, and all-

Eric, I appreciate your reply, but suggest that before you reach any conclusions first gain some understanding of EIPH's mechanism (physiology). No room here for me to discuss it, but I'm sure you can research the topic. Perhaps had The Breeders' Cup and Mr. Stronach done the same they would have concluded differently...Know that the type of effort expended by horses in horse racing is NOT a "natural" activity for even the thoroughbred breed. Racing at such speeds and level of fittness can, and often does, impact negatively on them. It is rather doubtful that we can ever biologically engineer them to such degree that this reality will be nullified. "Bleeding" (EIPH) is but one of a host of such negative consequences. Salix has been proven to minimize the effects of EIPH (E=exercise; I= induced). Racing (on race-day) is a higher degree of exercise than is usually mere training. Salix, therefore, plays its most efficacious (and needed) role on race-day...It has been amply shown that the vast majority of thoroughbred racehorses evidence EIPH. This was likely always the case-moreso as horses "improved" to race faster-but in times past was less apparent before the advent of the endoscope...As in many other human endeavors, it seems the wrong people are calling the shots. It's unfortunate that those (vets and trainers) likely best able/best experienced in matters such as this are also perceived (correctly) as being vested in permitting race-day salix. I am neither a vet nor a trainer, but am rather certain that a race-day salix ban is absurdly premature. I truly hope that science and logic will prevail, but this hope grows ever more faint...I see where Mr. Baffert is also against the ban (on salix), but I reject his argument, and since he does have a voice that can be heard, suggest that he too become more versed on the topic.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

EJMitchellKy — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 21:06:25 GMT

Bob,

I appreciate your comments. We'll continue doing everything we can to make the magazine better and the industry stronger.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

EJMitchellKy — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 20:51:50 GMT

Nedjohnsonsux,

I don't think human rights plays into the debate on Salix so I'll leave it at that.

But we have gone from Salix being a useful medication to help treat horses that are bleeders to every horse is a bleeder and will choke inhumanely following a race and spew blood like a fountain if we don't race them on this medication. Even when he didn't have Salix, there were relatively few cases of horses that bled to this degree.

What does it say about the quality of our horses if they are incapable of running without this medication? The argument has been made that it is inhumane to run horses that bleed without Salix. Is it humane to even run a horse at all that has a severe bleeding problem? Even some trainers in the U.S. will tell you a bleeding problem during training indicates a need to back off.

Phasing in regulation by crop is certainly one approach but you will eventually run into the same problem...some horses banned from running on Salix competing against horses that are grandfathered in to run on Salix. We know horses than run on Salix perform better than horses that don't. I don't think that is fair to the owners, do you?

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Bob Baffert — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 19:05:23 GMT

Eric,

You don't realize that you are damaging our business with these ideas of yours. You need to focus more on making your magazine a little bit better and worth reading. If medication goes the racing world will go with it. During these tough economic times it's getting harder for people to keep investing. Now you want to make it harder for them to keep horse in training. It's the sport of Kings in Europe but not in U.S. Stick to writing stories and stay out of things you have no clue about. We are in scary times right now. Horse Farms are going under, people quit breeding horses. Now is not the time to knock racing in U.S.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

chanceland — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 18:59:06 GMT

I trained horses before lasix and, believe me, bleeding was a much bigger problem then. All horses will bleed to some degree eventually if they continue to run, so why wouldn't you do what you can to minimize the lung damage. All of the horses racing now are all descended from horses who raced without lasix, so I don't understand how banning it will make the breed stronger. Racing has a lot of very serious problems and lasix is the least of them. Why don't we put all of this energy to work improving our labs and testing to catch the real cheaters, among other things too numerous to mention.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

GoldenBroom — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 17:43:52 GMT

catonie, Unlike in humans, in animals Darwin's theory of evolution is still the best way to improve the breed, which has not been improving at all in recent decades. Out with the weak and feeble, only breed the strong. As far as horses bleeding in extremely hot and humid weather, at high altitudes, here's an idea...don't race there or during peak summer months or when it goes over 85 or 90!? Not the most financially sound answer but the breed has been so watered down that it's feebleness and lack of interest (hurt by drug usage in the media) that it's time to change. And what is with the talk about wars and politics and the flag waiving? It's a global economy, we have a global sport. We are not talking about races at the local fairgrounds here. You have trainers from England and Ireland, owners from Dubai and France, horses that jump "the pond" regularly and come up from South America and fly over and back to Australia for stud duty. Welcome to the 21st century everyone. Lasix doesn't help the breed anymore than the patch and repair jobs done on horses with poor hooves. It just allows bad genes to continue on and on.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

EJMitchellKy — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 17:24:34 GMT

Sceptre,

What I think is true is that veterinarians agree that Salix is very effective in treating bleeding. The question is whether it is essential that a horse race on Salix. Clearly there are trainers in other countries that race successfully without Salix and veterinarians that have no problem helping to keep these horses healthy and sound. The medication is used during training or during rehabilitation, at least in Europe, then it is cleared out of their system in the 10 days leading to a race.

Didn't this country once race horses without Salix? And how did we go from requiring that a horse demonstrate it is a bleeder to get put on the Salix list to having more than 90% of our horses running on this medication along with the position that we can't run without it?

I also find it curious that the U.S. is the only racing jurisdiction that allows the race-day use of Salix and yet the rest of the world is inflexible.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

catonie — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 16:22:00 GMT

I've read much about this subject and heard even more, the past few years, since we began this "do as someone else does" mentality, and it's very worrisome to me. Our country is light years ahead of these countries in almost every way. We fought a war to become independent and to be able to think for ourselves. Why in the world would we think that something they do is somehow 'superior' to what is being done in North America? These other countries are the ones who race 4 1/2 miles, over fences designed to make them fall, carrying 160 lbs before finally deciding which is the better horse. If they don't measure up, either over fences or on the flat, so what? They just send them to slaughter and eat them. At least in the United States we are able to determine which horse is best at a mile and a quarter and we don't eat them when they are through racing. Other countries send their horses here to race, where they can get Lasix so they don't bleed from the lungs. It doesn't make them run faster, but allows them to run to their own potential. In this day and age when field sizes are small and dwindling, why would we want them to become even smaller by limiting those horses who can compete? If you or I had a grand horse who raced on Lasix, would you want to run that horse and take the chance that it would bleed when you could help prevent it? Of all the things racing has done, and all the medications that have been discovered, Lasix is the one thing that works to help prevent this. Must we go back to the dark ages because Europe and Asia seem to be stuck there? It's not only Thoroughbreds who bleed, as Quarter Horses bleed, too, even with the short distances they are asked to run. Horses bleed more in hot, humid weather...and at altitude also. Quarter Horses who race at Ruidoso Downs, New Mexico, at 6,400 feet often bleed, many times profusely. Now, I hear Stronack doesn't seem to want lasix used at "his" racetracks? Even though it's a legal raceday medication in those states? There are many other race tracks, and I would hope the horsemen use them, rather than his. I believe it's time for the horsemen/horsewomen to come together and decide this thing, rather than the politicians who are discussing it at the moment. Lasix is something that helps, not harms, horses. I don't want people to go back to the witch doctors' remedies, or something rumored to help a bleeder when we have a truly good thing, already legal, and being used and regulated.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

nedjohnsonsux — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 15:58:49 GMT

You are so typical of everyone in the industry. Eric have you ever cooled out a horse that bleeds after a race? When you pull off the band-aid as you say, what effect will it have on bleeders? Do you think they will bleed less? I don't think even you are that ignorant. They will bleed and choke for hours after they race. It is sad to witness. But then we will be on par with the rest of the world. Great idea, let us copy the rest of the world, most who have horrible human rights. The reason the US is the best place on earth is because we blaze the path, don't follow. But let us get on par with the french, who hate us even though we saved them from the Nazis. or maybe you prefer we get on par with the Saudis who treat women as second class citizens.

Listen I am not against limiting and perhaps eventually eliminating medications on race day. But be smart and do it starting with a specific foal crop, then though won't be arbitrarily taken off medications they have been running and depending on their whole careers.

But then I forgot you just want to follow others not actually do better.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Needler in Virginia — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 15:01:19 GMT

Thanks for that, SUNNY FARM. It's only that I have tons of BACKSTRETCH (now defunct) from the late 90's saying the same thing (along with a HUGE number of other industry publications), and so far, NOTHING has happened, except Barry Irwin was smart enough to move all the Team Valor horses to Graham Motion's barn because of the "lies" that other trainers had told him about drug use. THAT'S IT. Even now, there are those who tweak the studies done, and, as we all know, you an make data prove any point you want to make....all you have to do is change the way the question is asked, or evaluate only the data from the chestnuts who ran on Salix in April of 2008, at a distance of 2 miles, on a synthetic surface, carrying less than 130 pounds and bearing jockeys who wore red silks. SOrry..my irony gene is kicking in.

I MUST believe this a do-able thing; otherwise I can't watch it happen any more. The idea that US horses are somehow exempt from the rest of the racing world's rules is nauseating to me, as is the idea that, somehow, US horses are different from the rest of the Thoroughbreds in the world. And if something doesn't happen very soon, we will be watching the slow, gradual demise of Thoroughbred racing in this country. I HATE feeling this way, so once again, I thank you for the words of encouragement...........I NEED 'EM!!

Cheers and very safe trips.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

sceptre — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 14:43:31 GMT

Jersey Boy-

No, the S. African Study I cited was not the later (and different) study you mentioned. The former study dealt solely with the issue of Lasix's efficacy in minimizing EIPH and its findings were conclusive. The study that you cited dealt with the potential heritability of EIPH-I also read thoroughly this study, and found its methods wanting.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

GoldenBroom — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 13:56:17 GMT

To support purposefully dehydrating an animal to lower it's bloodpressure so it can perform is ridiculous. Enough already. We've already weathered (maybe not the end of) "rightsizing" the industry to meet demand, it's time for the second half of the cuts to be done and over with. Bite the bullet and do it already. I wonder if the breed will prove heartier in more ways than just pulmonary because of this? Better natural circulation MAY lead to healthier joints, muscles and bone...hopefully we'll see in the next 5 to 10 years as the "new" stock starts running...

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Frank Newman — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 13:08:15 GMT

Yada, yada, yada.........if we/you are gonna ban "drugs" do it. Don't wait 3 years or 3 months...Ban what ever you/we call "drugs" today ...why wait??? entry box will suffer, but time will heal that wound. QUIT TALKIN AND DO SOMETHING

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

Arian Haxhillari — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 12:44:34 GMT

Why is so hard to do a big study about this issue and get over with it. I think e big international study about use os salix will give the world the answer about it.

As a new owner I think it cost me more to get my horses in shape after using Lasix than the ones without it. The only person making money and interested on this are my vets.

I think even vets need to change there attitude. I don't see then helping me in conditioning my horses and love to inject every single time a problem comes up.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

JerseyBoy — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 10:19:14 GMT

Eric:

This is the second time I have seen mention of the fact that a South African study confirmed the efficacy of Lasix. It is also one of those rare occasions in which I have seen a study mentioned to support a point without any mention of the conclusions of the study. If it is the same study I read, the the conclusions include the following:

"Further steps should include the disqualification of “bleeders” from being registered in the Stud Book and that furosemide be banned internationally from racing, or failing that, breeders should refrain from buying potential sires that have raced on this drug".

Those who call for further study, can perhaps explain how this study will be conducted when horses are racing on Lasix which inhibits bleeding.

I support your call. I also hope the day will come when those who call for a delay will state that they have no conflict of interest in this matter. I have none.

re: Rip Off the Medication Band-Aid - By Eric Mitchell

SUNNY FARM — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 03:40:02 GMT

Needler in Virginia ; Take heart !

The changes will be made and the sooner the better. The Breeders Cup will set the standard for the best of Horse Racing & others will follow. This time it is going to happen. I am very excited, being a person who raises my horses as organically as possible. For me, this rule change will now level the playing field. AS soon as the public and other horsemen outside of racing hear of these changes, it will increase participation in horse racing over all AND a new trust will be formed. Other countries will arrive with thier horses into the good ole' USA to race.I am really looking forward to that day !The BEST news of all is that the THOROUGHBRED will become victorious in all of the drug-ban effects...as he deserves to be. The day is coming when the winner really will be the winner and the owner can take pride in that.