Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 12:53:27 GMT

Bottom line: Princequillo daughters produced 9% of Bold Ruler foals but 31% of his stayers. Another was produced by a mare by a Princequillo son, another by a mare out of a Princequillo daughter. That's Princequillo up close on the dam's side of 41% of Bold Ruler's stayers. And Princequillo's sire Prince Rose appears once more through a different son, Prince Bio, to make his presence felt in 50% of Bold Ruler's stayers.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 09:49:32 GMT

I'm such a sucker! Here's the data, not exhaustively researched.

The champions who stayed, in no particular order:

SECRETARIAT (Somethingroyal x **PQ), BOLD BIDDER (High Bid x To Market ex Stepping Stone x **PQ), LAMB CHOP (Sheepsfoot x Count Fleet), GAMELY (Gambetta x My Babu), WAJIMA (Iskra x Le Haar), SUCCESSOR, 2 y.o. champion, SW at 13f (Misty Morn x **PQ.

Not far behind: BOLD HOUR (Seven Thirty x Mr. Music), BATTEUR, EAC 10f T (Bayou x Hill Prince, son of **PQ), STUPENDOUS, classic-placed (Magneto x Ambiorix), BEAUTIFUL DAY, classic-placed (Misty Morn x **PQ), DEWAN (Sunshine Nell x Sun Again), TOP COMMAND (Polly Girl x Prince Bio, paternal 1/2 brother to **PQ), SYRIAN SEA, classic-placed CCAO (Somethingroyal x **PQ), TERENTIA, multiple classic-placed .

Judgement calls. These horses seem to me to have shown they had stamina but weren't top drawer, usually due to unsoundness.

BOLDNESIAN, won 4 of 5 starts including S.A. Derby and broke down,(Alanesian x Polynesian). KEY TO THE KINGDOM, only stakes performance was 1st Stymie H. at 9f, 1/5 off American record, beating solid G1/G2 handicapper Arbees Boy. Something wrong with this colt but it doesn't look like it was stamina.(Key Bridge x **PQ). PLUCKY PAN, 2nd Delaware H. @ 10f (Pucker Up x Olympia).

Doesn't make cut: Might (Sicarelle x Sicambre, also a Prince Rose-line stallion), not quite good enough, not quit far enough. Bold Lad (US), brilliant 2-y-o champion (Misty Morn x PQ), broke down in Derby, won Met Mile under 132 and off that I'd bet him to go farther, but he didn't actually DO it, so . . .

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

moonrise — Fri, 30 May 2014 16:15:49 GMT

Quoting Needler in Virginia:

"Ever since I first saw him run he's made the hair on the back of my neck stand up and that hasn't happened in ages."

^THIS exactly.

I've read about his sire and his dam and his chances and his detractors and listened closely to his trainer and riders. BUT this is what makes me believe that a Triple Crown winner is possible. I know it's not scientific, I know it's not practical, but it's been reliable...I was around for Secretariat, Seattle Slew and Affirmed. They made me feel this exact same way.

Even if he doesn't win the Triple Crown, he's a great horse and he's done wonderful things for the horse and the sport. I think he can do it! Go Junior!

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Signal — Sun, 25 May 2014 22:31:59 GMT

I beleive Chrome can do it all along,

but now we have johny come lately expert

predicted he will win the belmont, it could

be the jinks he does not need right now.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Draynay — Sun, 25 May 2014 01:08:45 GMT

How many times has a horse won the Triple Crown facing 10 horses or more at Belmont ?

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Scott's Rail — Sat, 24 May 2014 01:01:04 GMT

Great insights and as usual Steve is point on. The only thing that will GET CC beat is jockey errow. We have been down this stretch before...Alysheba, Real Quiet and a few more. Foolish confidence is detrimental, quiet assurance, sublime....:

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

sceptre — Fri, 23 May 2014 19:50:48 GMT

Cassandra Says:

Before you utter more nonsense; please tell us who were the "quite a few" classic oriented Bold Ruler horses that Mrs. Phipps bred (out of *Princequillo mares) "once she discovered Princequillo mares?"

You should have read more carefully my original post (to you). Yes, Bold Ruler did sire some classic distance types--but that's not what I was addressing. BTW: Lamb Chop and Gamely were not out of *Princequillo mares. And as an aside--I lived (real time) through Bold Ruler's entire stud career...Your last post addresses nothing.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

sceptre — Fri, 23 May 2014 19:24:57 GMT

Cassandra Says:

You actually proved my point in your rant. 34 named foals out of *Princequillo mares is quite a lot (fairly synonymous with "countless" in terms of horse breeding numbers wouldn't you say?). And very, very few won at classic distances--I didn't hear you cite more than a slight few! Not though, the "quite a few" which was your point. So, my point was that *Princequillo mares with Bold Ruler didn't make much (if at all) a difference relative to Bold Ruler's ability to sire distance oriented runners. Your rant has no logic/no meaning, and I'd suggest that, in the future, you do the research before posting unfounded observations.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

GiddyUpBoyWhoa — Fri, 23 May 2014 19:15:49 GMT

Maybe Chrome is just out running his pedigree. Whatever, the Belmont looks to be his race to lose. If he shows up, runs like he has been, Victor continues to keep him well placed and out of trouble, and Chrome fires, its all over. We'll finally have a triple crown winner. I thought the Preakness was California Chromes best race yet, and he did not look fully extended to me.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Pedigree Ann — Fri, 23 May 2014 10:28:02 GMT

Well, many years we don't have anything more than good horses around, nice horses, maybe very nice horses. Excellent horses seem to come around in bunches, and the greats, too (Buckpasser, Damascus, Dr. Fager racing together; Secretariat and Forego in the same crop). So some years, you have to make do with good. But certainly, Lucky Pulpit had more in him than he was able to show. That happens to more horses than we know and could be how an unconsidered stallion (or mare) sometimes jumps up with an outstanding runner. Carry Back is the poster boy. But don't forget Kip Deville, Best Pal, Little Mike, etc.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Thu, 22 May 2014 21:06:40 GMT

"Does anyone remember that a Bold Ruler could NEVER get the Derby distance??"

No, nobody remembers that. Lots of people make it up, though. It's a lot easier to win an argument if you get to write the script for your imaginary opponent.

Bold Ruler sired the filly Lamb Chop in his first crop and she won the Coaching Club American Oaks at 10f, in 2:02 4/5, on her way to the three year old filly championship.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Thu, 22 May 2014 20:53:27 GMT

"Sorry, but you're wrong. Bold Ruler was bred to countless *Princequillo mares, but only a small few showed any aptitude for classic distances." [Sceptre]

"Countless?" "Small few?" [And btw, what does "small few" modify?] It takes about 40 seconds to find out that Bold Ruler sired 34 named foals from Princequillo mares. If you don't care enough to look it up, or check out other facts, why post?

These foals broke almost 2 to 1 fillies to colts, meaning the PQ grand-daughters had limited chances to show their stuff beyond a mile, and also that their broodmare value was so high they were shipped back to the farm at any sign of trouble.

Misty Morn, e.g., had two Bold Ruler colts and four fillies. The colts were both champion 2-year-olds and Successor stayed. Bold Lad was effective up to a mile. The four fillies won two races among them. It's not impossible that this reflected a chance distribution of ability, but more likely it goes to the old saying "You can't just wave your pedigree at them." You can in the sales ring.

Your post not only does not address what I said, but it is meaningless. Since Bold Ruler sired only a handful of stayers in total, 100% of them could be by Princequillo without contradicting what you say.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Ranagulzion — Thu, 22 May 2014 05:02:17 GMT

California Chrome is evidently just too good for the 3YO compettion right now. He is fast, thrives on racing and relishes a distance of round. Its going to be jubilation on Belmont Stakes day when the 36 years Triple Crown drought is broken ...the writing is on the wall folks. Believe it!!!

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Wed, 21 May 2014 22:20:49 GMT

"Cassandra - Lucky Pulpit ran well with very good horses in the fall of his 2yo year and into the early part of his 3yo year. He ran Castledale to a head in the 8f G3 Generous S on turf; Castledale went on to win the Santa Anita Derby. He ran second in the Santa Catalina (G2, now the Lewis), defeating Master David, who was well fancied in the Derby after a close second in the Wood Memorial." [Pedigree Ann]

In the post you referenced, I said I had read every one of Lucky Pulpit's charts. We do not interpret them the same way.

BTW, Lucky Pulpit did not "run Castledale to a head in the Generous." You're reading the pp preview wrong. Dealer Choice was second by a nose to Castledale with Lucky Pulpit two lengths back in third after having led in the stretch. He also led into the stretch in the Catalina before finishing second. In the Santa Anita Derby, Lucky Pulpit was also in the field; he set the pace until Castledale blew by him and he stopped to last.

One of the tells in the racing decline of a bleeder is consistently losing ground late.

You seem to be saying that a bleeder can't race at all. Think of your history. Many of the old time greats were notorious bleeders. More recently we saw the shameful deterioration of wonderful La Prevoyante, who took quite a few votes from Secretariat for Horse of the Year in her 12/12 two-year-old season.

We know for sure the last time La Prevoyante bled. At the end of her four-year-old year she collapsed on the track and bled out from a ruptured lung. Do you really think that was the first time? How then to explain her two-year decline in class and stamina?

Bottom line: I think Lucky Pulpit went wrong well before the Santa Catalina, and his subsequent races demonstrate a distinct pattern. Bleeding is progressive. Each time it happens there are more weakened blood vessels and scar tissue.

I think "ran well with good horses" is damned with faint praise. From his earliest races, we might have expected more than that.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

sceptre — Wed, 21 May 2014 20:56:31 GMT

Cassandra Says:

Sorry, but you're wrong. Bold Ruler was bred to countless *Princequillo mares, but only a small few showed any aptitude for classic distances.

Also re-other posters:

It's rather absurd to classify Smile similarly to a grouping of Forego, Dr. Fager, and Precisionist. The latter three demonstrated far more distance aptitude than did Smile. Actually, Forego belongs in another group altogether. And, back in that day Arlington Park was quite speed favoring-not a good yardstick from which to judge inherent stamina.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Soldier Course — Wed, 21 May 2014 19:51:31 GMT

Food Fight

Tall orders? What about Afleet Alex? He ran in all three Triple Crown races, had clipped heals and went to his knees in the Preakness, and still won the Belmont Stakes. Now that's a tall order. If he did that, then California Chrome can do it too. Accentuate the positive. Time to send good thoughts out into the ether.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

themailmansson — Wed, 21 May 2014 17:54:53 GMT

Maybe michel jordan is the mail man's son (hehehehehe)

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Wed, 21 May 2014 17:48:33 GMT

Bold Ruler sired quite a few horses able to get classic distances once Phipps discovered Princequillo mares. Prior to that the concentration of classic winning mares in Bold Ruler's book went mostly in vain. Bold Ruler had the most unbelievable books ever, champion mares from around the world.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Cassandra.Says — Wed, 21 May 2014 17:39:26 GMT

Wayne, Wayne, Wayne . . . how can you think "genetics" has nothing to do with character? Temperament, competitiveness, courage, however you want to cast it, is more notably heritable than most other characteristics.

Even to the specifics: Northern Dancer's sons were emphatically and dramatically NOT whip horses, like Dad; Ribot was a savage, and passed it on; ditto many in the Hail to Reason line, currently represented by the last Dynaformers. You don't see inherited temperament in the Tapits? Watch them a while; I think it will strike you.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Where You From? — Wed, 21 May 2014 15:26:46 GMT

Ladies and gentlemen, the nasal strips are a non-factor. The only reason it has become an issue is because the press has to have something to write about. Did anyone even think that Belmont was going to let CC walk away because of a band-aid over the colts schnoz?

I'll tell you the major player missing from this race, and CC's dance with becoming a legend....Untappable. The filly is Cali's only true competition. I'd love to see them square off.

You?

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

TK Lawless — Wed, 21 May 2014 14:19:53 GMT

And, to echo Pedigree Ann....Precisionist was a pretty damn good route horse in his day as well, even though he was named Champion Sprinter off his Breeder's Cup win. He won the Swaps & Strub Stakes back when those races were still contested at 1 1/4 miles. Here's hoping Art (& Alan) Sherman stick to their stated plan and aren't tempted to drill & overtrain (ala Van Berg with Alysheba) CC in an effort to "help him get the distance' ... The 'El Gran Senor' Horatio Luro, should be heeded ... "Don't squeeze the lemon dry"!

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Zengal — Wed, 21 May 2014 13:37:22 GMT

I am probably the only one on this planet that is not on the Chrome bandwagon. Sorry, do not call me a hater because of this. I have been watching the triple crown for 47 years now and I have seen plenty of great horses run (via tv of course). I have read a lot too. I am for Ride on Curlin. This little horse ran one gutsy race in the preakness. Like his sire he has placed in most of of his races. He hasn't won the big one yet, but neither did Palace Malice untill the Belmont. I know ROC is not as well bred as Malice, but I have faith in him. ROC doesn't have a shabby pedigree either. I know I will probablt get a lot of negative comments over this, but what I speak is true, if you look further in most horses pedigree you will find many of great horses. What will happen in the Belmont is anyones guess. Remember Smarty Jones? I hope for a day horses will not race on any meds including Bute and Lasix. I remember a day when no horses were allowed any bute or lasix, that was like over 15 years ago.

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Your Only Friend — Wed, 21 May 2014 13:15:26 GMT

Can he get the distance......who knows.....but like they say... no one else has run that far either.....time will tell....

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Lise from Maine — Wed, 21 May 2014 12:46:04 GMT

Hi!

Good luck to California Chrome and his team!

He is a special horse, and he will make every effort to win.

Hopefully he doesn't get injured and drops out.

This horse racing industry needs this win as I see it as a dying profession, and I have only been interested in horse racing since Barbaro won the Kentucky Derby in 2006.

Love to California Chrome and his team.

Thank you!

Lise from Maine

re: Chrome Is Ready for More - by Eric Mitchell

Pedigree Ann — Wed, 21 May 2014 10:29:49 GMT

Eric - Chrome has run well on Poly Track, Cushion Track, Santa Anita's speed favoring track, Churchill's frequently cuppy dirt full of clay, and Pimlico's rain-affected dirt. He doesn't need to take his track with him. He barely touches the surface before his foot leaves it again, anyway. Quite efficient racing stride.