Quality Road has shown flashes of brilliance and his last race was a disaster from start to finish and getting mud kicked in his face for a mile was a problem.  The outside post is perfect for him and he will be forwardly placed and try to dominate the race.  Summer Bird will not be a factor.  The question is can Quality Road hold off Macho Again.  It took one of the greatest efforts ever by a 3 year old to hold him off last time.

Two things can happen here Quality Road stamps himself as the real leading 3 year old male or Macho Again proves he really is that good.  I will give Quality Road one more chance if he gets a fast track.  If its a off track bet the house on Macho Again.

Glad to get the outside post in the Vosburgh.

Munnings certainly is a concern.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Go Go Shoot will be the sacrificial lamb and toast Munnings.

Unlikely, I guess.

It would take a lot to toast Munnings.

Anything to make of the Kodiak Kowboy barn change - in terms of what to expect on the track?

Think SA will want him kept closer?

Best of luck to Todd Beattie, RD, and Fabulous Strike(PA).

Peace

7 Munning

8 Dynaforce-Leamington

9 Al khali

10 Ouality Road -Sette E Mezzo-Macho Again-Asiatic Boy

$8 Pick 4

Looks like a minor tune-up for Gio.  Jason...Bold statement regarding Music Note.  Perhaps a Music Note/Zenyatta matchup will get 40,000 people to skip work on a Friday.  The tickets to sit are a lot cheaper this year.  Can't wait.  Got some West Coast preps to get through first (Lady's Secret, Goodwood).  Last chance to see the Kentucky Derby Winner and the undefeated Lady's Classic winner up close.

"Summer Bird won't be a factor." Good luck with that statement Draynay!

Jason, off the subject question but who do you consider the best race horse, not sire, from Europe say with the last 10-15 years. It seems every year someone says "this is Europe's best chance in the Classic". I just wondered if you thought it was Giant's Causeway or Galileo maybe, just curious of maybe your top 5. thanks. Let's go QR!!!!!

    Still looking at this weekend, but, I don't see the best three year old colt losing, Summer Bird and Macho again in Exacta.      

    My biggest shot of the weekend would be at Thistledown on Saturday, The Ohio Derby(G2,Race #8).  I Love Ice Road, At a Morning line of 15-1, He is a steal at that price!  Ice Road, Giant Oak, Join in the Dance and Gone Astray is your Super.  Ice Road got a terrible trip in his last race, prior to that, He finished 2nd to Brother Nick at Saratoga in the mud from outside gate.  He needs a good trip, If so, Take him to the bank!

 I love Win Willy at Hoosier Park on Saturday in the Indiana Derby(G2, Race 11).  It is his second race back, The distance suits him(1 1/6 Miles), He is a good price at Morning Line of 6-1, So Ice Road and Win Willy are my two biggest shots this weekend...

Hope it is a safe weekend and Good Luck to all...

Dray I am glad you are staying on the Quality Road bandwagon! I love QR but Macho Again rain very impressive his last race! Should be a great race I have no idea who is going to win but would love to see "The Beast" aka quality road hold off Macho Again. QR had an awful ride in the last race but should be ready to rumble this race. Macho again is a stone cold closer and might get QR by a nose. If you go back to QR last race he still was impressive getting 3rd.

Summer Bird, does not get the respect he deserves, that he has earned, but will just keep on winning, tomorrow, and after.

pick four- Kodiak Kowboy

          Moneycantbuymelove

          Interpatation

          Summer Bird

With all the big stakes races this weekend, THS goes with the Indiana Derby? What gives Jason? Why not the Oak Leaf or if it has to be a Saturday Race, why not the Flower Bowl? Anyway, i'm not gonna make a big deal out of it. Anyway Jason, Pick 6 looks like it could be formful till the last race. Will you be placing a ticket?

Slam dunk sunday in Oak Leaf-Always A Princees

IF IT LOSES I WILL HAVE TO RELY on IEAH-IEAH-IEAH NY-BRED-DUTROW to save my week

Summer Bird has proven to run well w/o the aid of mud, infact he won w/o it on this very same track in the belmont. QR, i fear is a 9 furlong horse and won't get that extra furlong. Macho will be there if the pace sets it up fast again. QR is one i'd watch but not bet on(if i could bet.) SB has proven his worth and has proven himself at this distance and over. I see him or Macho winning this.

PICK 4 TICKET

7: FAB STRIKE

8: PURE CLAN, DYNAFORCE, MONEYCAN'TBUYMELOVE

9: ALL

Like $54 or close to it....? I love Gio Ponti in the Turf, but I got a funny feeling about that race. Everyone thinks the Flower Bowl is where a nice price might show up. Might be worth it to beat Gio Ponti trying something for the first time. I think he'll handle 12 furlongs, but why not try to beat him, you know?

10: QUALITY ROAD, SUMMER BIRD

I really like Kodiak Kowboy...I believe he is primed up to run a huge race.

Summer Bird will run huge again. He is the best, no distance trouble. Mud/dry doesn't matter. Macho Again for second.

JASON

Hope you had a nice vacation. I,also was on a fun vacation in Ca. This weekend I agree with Draynay w/Quality Road.

I see a number of the stakes at Belmont with similar pace scenarios and race setups.

In the Vosburgh, I see Fabulous Strike sitting to the outside of Go Go Shoot, pouncing on that rival at the top of the stretch, and then holding off Munnings and Kodiak Kowboy.  At the old Vosburgh distance of 7 furlongs I think Munnings would get up, but at 6 furlongs Fabulous Strike is just a little too tough.

I expect Quality Road to get a similar trip to Fab Strike in the JCGC. Unlike the Travers when he was bogged down on the rail, I think Quality Road will show more  early speed and will be able to get a stalking position outside of Tizway. I think the pace will be slower than what it was for the Travers(and definitely slower than the Woodward), and that Quality Road will have the opportunity to open up a few lengths on Summer Bird on the far turn.  Summer Bird has demonstrated excellent tactical speed in his last 2 races, and he should be able to lay within 3 lengths of Quality Road. However, if Quality Road is allowed to use all of his natural early speed, he should be able to build just large enough of a cushion that he could hold off Summer Bird in a desperate finish. I think Macho Again is a very legit gr.1 horse and merits respect. However, the pace scenario is not going to be nearly as kind to him as was the Woodward setup. I envision Macho putting in a solid move into a moderate pace, but then either flattening out a little the last eighth of a mile(I am convinced that even if he momentarily put a head infront of Rachel, he would not have beaten her at 9.5 or 10 furlongs that day) or Quality Road re-kicks in the stretch and keeps Macho at bay.

I understand why the connections of Icon Project chose the Spinster over the Beldame, but I am with Steve Haskin in questioning the move.  Chances to win grade 1 races do not come around often, and in the Beldame Icon Project would have only had to defeat Music Note, which I think she would have, to win consecutive grade 1s.  Without Icon Project, Music Note is a standout. I expect her to stalk and then pounce to win her 5th career grade 1.

In the Flower Bowl, I believe Pure Clan will turn the tables on Dynaforce. Pure Clan was severely compromised by a slow pace in the Beverly D, yet still found a way to close about 5 lengths on Dynaforce in the stretch. The pace of the Flower Bowl should be much more testing than the Beverly D, something which should flatter Pure Clan's late run.  Moneycantbuymelove is a group 1 placed Euro, which class-wise puts her right up with Pure Clan, Dynaforce, and Criticism. I'll take her in the 2nd spot.  

Finally, Gio Ponti will be tough in the Joe Hirsch. The Arlington Million was clearly the best distance turf race in North America so far this year, and Gio Ponti won that race fairly comfortably.  The runner-up in the Million, Just as Well, returned to win the gr.1 Northern Dancer, while 5th place finisher Einstein bounced back from that race to run a huge 2nd in the Pacific Classic on polytrack. The one concern is that with the likely scratches of both Presious Passion and Winchester, there will not be alot of pace for Gio Ponti to run at.  Even so, Gio Ponti has proven his ability to adapt to any and all circumstances, and he simply looks too good for this field. I'm with Jason in liking Musketier for 2nd, given the pace scenario should be similar to what it was when he ran 2nd to Gio Ponti in the Man O' War.  Grand Couturier can be breathtaking when on his game, but the pace scenario does not favor his late running style and, although a 3-time gr.1 winner, he has never beaten a horse of Gio Ponti's caliber.  

It's pretty unrealistic to say Summer Bird won't be a factor in the Jockey Gold Cup.  He deserves a lot more respect than that statement.  It's difficult to figure whose day it will be but I feel like Macho Again is due to win a big one.  He was amazing against Rachel!  So I'm going with Macho Again, Summer Bird then Quality Road.

Of course the center of the racing universe this weekend will be Pinnacle Racecourse.  I jest, but Saturday is Michigan Sired Stakes day, with 6 races each with a $50,000 purse(used to be $80,000-$100,000).

The two horses to watch closest are Valley Loot in the 4 year old and older filly and mare race and Meadow Vespers in the older male race.  Valley Loot is the two-time defending Michigan Horse of the Year and a winner of 10 stakes races in her career, including a stakes race at Presque Isle this year. That victory aside, Valley Loot has struggled much more this year than in the two previous years and is coming off a so-so 2nd in the Farer Belle Lee at Pinnacle.  Still, Valley Loot is the horse to beat in the older filly and mare race, having won the race last year as well as the Michigan Sired Stakes for 3 year old fillies two years ago.

Meadow Vespers is a 7 year old veteran that has finished in the money in 30 of his 33 career starts. Meadow Vespers is seeking  an amazing 5th straight Michigan Sired Stakes win; in 2005 Meadow Vespers won the Michigan Sired Stakes for 3 year old males by 8 lengths, and in 2006, 2007, and 2008 he won the Michigan Sired Stakes for older males.  I know it's only Michigan breds, but anytime a horse can win 4 state-bred championship races, including 3 for older horses, you know the horse has some quality.  On Saturday we will see if Meadow Vespers can make it 4 older male Sired Stakes and 5 overall Sired Stakes.

i see muning winning and gio ponti the other two races are complicate, firts i think the european mare is winning and second i think is summer bird, dry martini and quality road. i think macho again have run some tought races and he will be fourth or five because the pace is going to be slow.

Late pick 4

7: 3-2-5

8: 4-6-1,1a

9: 1,1a-2-4

10: 3-6-4-1-7

Jason.  What do you think of the Smart Stike colt Lookin at Lucky in the Norfolk?  Looks to me to be the best 2 year old out west.  It's 80 degrees in Arcadia and the fires are out.  All systems go in the Baffert barn.

Beldame - Music Note

Pick 4 - Vosburgh - Munnings

Flower Bowl - Pure Clan

Turf Classic - Gio Ponti

Jockey Club - Quality Road

Cotillion - Just Jenda

Ohio Derby - Gone Astray

Indiana Derby - Win Willy

With the 2 million dollar yearling Mi Sueno out of the Oak Leaf due to Wednesday's injury at Hollywood.  The Oak Leaf looks up for grabs.

for the beldame i like: music note and with flying colors.

Vosburgh: go go shoot, fab strike , peace chant

Flower bowl: criticism, dynaforce

Turf classic: Telling, Musketier, and the entry

Jockey Club Gold Cup: Tizway ( He's returning to belmont and he might have not liked the track at saratoga) , Summer bird, Asiatic boy.

Kelso: Ready's echo, Le grand cru.

Norfolk: Lookin at lucky, John scott, Alfarabi

Indiana derby: Misremembered, Hoopoe, Flat bold

Ohio derby: Ice road, Join in the dance , Gone astray

Hawthorne Gold cup: Jonesboro, Nite light, You and I forever

Single Gio P and Fab Strike, use the 1 but not the 1a with Dynaforce if it's soft or worse. Good or firm use the 1 not 1a with Pure Clan. For the finale use Sette e Mezzo and Macho A. Say 10 units at 4 combinations. Maybe a saver win bet on S. Bird. If I'm not alive in the finale, a 20-40 unit win bet on Macho A.

Summer Bird in his last 3 races has defeated Hold Me Back and Dunkirk. I am not aware of all the Graded Stakes wins by these two and I think we all agree Quality Road had it rough last time out.  Look, Summer Bird is a 2 time G1 winner I can't take that away from him but when he faced a very tough Rachel A. he got whipped.  Macho Again is no Dunkirk or Hold Me Back.  Those of you back the Bird are going to be very upset but Quality Road third off a layoff and heading to the front will be very dangerous.  Only Macho has any chance at all of catching him.

JASON,

I have to say that your handicapping skills have come a long way since the days of Old Fashioned and Mr Fantasy.  Keep it up Bro.

I think that Fabulous Strike will be gunning for the lead this time and should thwart the challenge of Munnings down the stretch.

What a difference one race makes for the waggonists who have desserted QR.  Anyway we should see the real Quality Road tomorrow turning back the challenges of the formidble pair, Summer Bird and Macho Again in the JCGC.  This is going to be a very good race, however a sloppy track could be the "fly in the ointment" serving up a Dry Martini.

Music Note,Pure Clan and Gio Ponti are the "soups" of the day in the Beldame, Flower Bowl and Joe Hirsch respectively.  The facinating horses to watch this weekend are Gone Astray and Win Willy in the Ohio and Indiana derbies respectively.  Impressive performances could see them enter the ranks of the "Big horses" and affirm the depth of this years' crop of 3YOs.

I do not see any filly capturing the Arc D'Triomphe this year (no disrespect to Dar Re Mi and Stacelita).  From my perspective the colts are going to rule at Longchamp and Conduit has an outstanding shot at turning the tables on the sensational Sea The Stars.  Enjoy the feast folks.      

Dray,

    After QR went out you said Dunkirk would win the Derby. Now you act as if he is nothing at all to improve QR, which still doesn't work since all QR has beaten are sprinters, Dunkirk, the horse you're trying to belittle, and Theregoesjojo. Wow thats some list. If this race were nine furlongs i think he'd win hands down, since he can sprit with the best and stretch his speed to middle distances. You also fail to menition who else Summer Bird beat in the Travers which would be QR. Did QR have excuses in his last yes he did, and very valid ones, but as of now Summer Bird has done more and deserves more respect than you give him. The Travers is the Mid Summer derby, and probably one of the most important races for 3yrs, and it was SB who won that. The Belmont is also one of the more important races and he won that two. Had he not run into RA, he would've won the Haskell and would've completed the Haskell Travers double. He has proven that he can run on fast and sloppy tracks and can display tactical speed as well as close. I would not be surprised to see him close to QR in the early going of the race, just to make sure QR doesn't build up a good lead. Also beyer wise, if SB shows up with his best, no horse in this field can catch him. Don't be so quick to take SB's crown away.

I am looking for Court Vision to return to his old self in the Kelso.  In the Jockey Club, I am going with Macho Again, Quality Road then Summer Bird.

Quality Road

LDP, I am not knocking the horse aka Summer Bird.  I am trying to keep things real here.  He hasn't beat much winning the Belmont and Travers compared to facing Macho Again and a much more prepared Quality Road.  I wouldn't place MTB and Dunkirk in the same class as Quality Road and Macho Again.  Summer Bird is playing in the deep end this time be careful.

Have You Guys Seen The Line Up For The ARC On Sunday? The 3 Best Fillies In Europe Stacelita, Dar Re Mi and Sariska Going Against The Best Colts At 1 1/2 Miles..What A Race This Is Going To Be..Sea The Stars Is Going To Beat Them All.

Frank- Montjeu and Peintre Celebre were the highest weighted horses in the last 15 years in Europe, and I know the French feel Peintre Celebre was the stronger Arc winner of the two.  But in Europe horses are weighted in their distance category.  Timeforn doesn't distinguish distance when listing their top weighted horses of all time.  Both these horses were weighed at 137.  Zarkava last year was weighed at 133 plus they felt she had room for improvement and she was a three year old filly.  I don't know who they feel the best horse was who they sent to the US.  Swain was also highly thought of, as was High Chapparel.  But so was Giant's Causeway and Galileo.  But Sakhee was the highest weighted horse sent here at 136.  Of course all these ratings were for turf.  

QR hasn't done anything to suggest he is better than SB..you guys keep making excuses for this horse

Looks like weather will be a factor at Belmont on Saturday as rain 90% early Sat AM, after 2AM, continuing into Sat at 100%.  

Therefore if I follow the PPs...advantage to Fabulous Strike, as Munnings likes it fast, not mdy/slpy as do the others....Also will benefit Dynaforce in the Flower Bowl, and also Pure Clan and Moneycantbuymelove....In the Hirsch, should benefit Gio Ponti, and also possibly need to toss in Grand Couturier and Al Khali....In the JCGoldCup...should favor Summer Bird, Macho Again, with Sette E Metzzo poss as well.....Pick 4 Ticket -$18/27 depending on how many to use in the Gold Cup, and whether to include Munnings in the mix in the Vosburgh.....

Jason,

Just curious, from what did you need to have a vacation?  Playing on the internet?  Censorship?  Talking to people at the track?  You must be exhausted.  LDP ran circles around you, but you're still my third favorite writer about horse racing.  LDP #1, Steve Haskin #2, and you're a close third.  Win Willy and Dynaforce are the bets for this weekend.  Go big on a place bet on Win Willy and win bet on Dynaforce.  Skip the Pick 4 gimmicks.    

Ah, Ted, Jason.

What did people do in newspaper days? XD

I don't know enough about racing yet to make a fair assessment of Quality Road vs. Summer. I do know, though, that Quality Road seemed to stay at one level before improving, while Summer improved. Summer also has dependable feet. I like Summer's front forward running style. He'll need it. It's like a new pickup with constant improvements. People aren't sure if it's good, but those who know, go. That's Summer. Quality is like a basic trusty truck. He's consistent, but you could get more done if you take a chance on the new truck.

my pick 4 -- munnings, moneycantbuymelove, grand couturier, summer bird (watch out for asiatic boy also).

beldame -- music note (ho-hum)

arc -- vision d'etat(!)

hawthorne gold cup -- nite light

cotillion -- careless jewel

oh derby -- gone astray

in derby -- sumo

millreef- I wish Sariska was running, but they were afraid the ground wouldn't suit her.  Ot should be quite a race.

If there's one thing that QR's last proved to me, it's that Pletcher is not making the calls as to where this hoss is running. I think, because of the distance, he's being ambitiously spotted again. They're doing everything they can to get him to relax early, so that he will have some kind of late kick at this distance. It's not likely, therefore, he's going to be given his head and allowed to kick away from these early. He'll stalk Tizway, and be happy to do so. Tizway has never gone the distance, he's got one yawn of a performance in the off going, and I don't wonder if they chose the wrong gold cup (Hawthorne) if they wanted to try this distance. In any case, there's no arguing that he's cycling upward. If Quality Road let him get away with murder, who knows? Pedigree-wise, I think I prefer Tiznow to Elusive Quality at this trip. To me, it wouldn't be the biggest shocker I ever saw, if he got really soft early fractions, I mean it's not like there are no question marks surrounding some of the main contenders. Summer Bird, for example, has been getting more and more aggressive in his races, not at all a bad thing if it allows him to be more tactical and yet still finish. So far, so good, however the trainer was not pleased with the fast work 2 back, because of the aggressive nature of it. SB is a horse of interest of mine (after he flashed in the AK Derby) but I would need to see this one, in spite of beautiful-looking form. If he won off I wouldn't be surprised, nor would I be surprised if he faltered a bit. I just think it's possible that the ingredients are there for a mini-debacle in SB's case. Quality Road is simply unproven at the distance, and the way I see it, they want to go as slow as possible early, while stalking the pacesetter. Macho Again, who is, I think, perhaps the most reliable hoss in this race, has been on an upward spike in 4 straight, and (I believe) regardless of pace, he'll be coming. One problem, though. Does he want a mile and a quarter? While I don't want to make too much out of his 3yo form (he's clearly maturing into a quality racehorse), the loss to Da Tara in the Belmont (one of the slowest BS ever run) creates a smidge of doubt, as does the 0-2 record at the distance. Dry Martini has never been competitive in a GRI, I know there are people enamored of his wet track prowess, but it seems to me that Macho would be more attractive under those conditions (price differential notwithstanding), because he's more proven, in top form, and loves the slop, too. Asiatic Boy has given no indication that he belongs with this kind, not yet, anyway, and it's not as though he hasn't been supported. If he won I'd have to shake my head, more so than I would for Tizway (who could move up with the added distance), and for that matter, Sette Mezzo, whose dirt form (wet or dry) is a mystery. Stranger things have happened (Cigar).If Tizway scratches, Quality Road, in spite of all the little negat will be savaged by the punters, the pace advantage would be huge. Weather and odds and scratches will have some say in where I land. If Tizway starts I'll have a few bucks to win on him, but in the P4 I will single Macho in that scenerio.

I think Summer Bird undoubtedly hits the board in the JCGC unless something goes seriously wrong.  I think Quality Road hits the board, too.  I'm playing both in a superfecta box with Asiatic Boy and a fourth horse that I haven't chosen yet.  

Agree that Dry Martini is tempting.  My concern is that he only carried 116 in his 10 furlong win.

Have serious doubts about Macho Again at the distance.  Don't care how good he looked in the Woodward, except for his distant second in last year's Preakness he's otherwise looked pretty bad past 9 furlongs.

So many of you are picking these big pick 4 tickets? $54 etc. I think this pick 4 has chalk city written all over it. I will keep it cheap $3 and play it multiple times. I would like to thank all of you in advance for the big tickets. You raised my payoff nicely.

Fabulous Strike

Pure Clan

Gio Ponti

Summer bird Quality Road Macho Again. Good luck. :)

Jason, poor sweet young confused Jason.  Go back and review the blogs and you'll see that I have been right on nearly every horse I've called on this forum.  Including the time I knocked Dray off the blog for 30 days.  What cracks me up most about you is your in-your-face east coast ways. NO SOUP FOR YOU. 30 DAYS.

A few singles worth a look at Big Sandie today...7th Kodiak Kowboy...Pyro beat him at the Spa when the later got thru in amazing race, 8th go deep, 9th I'm using the #4 Telling...Windy City shipper is on top of game.5yo shipped to the Spa and took the cash..Castellano riding well. 10th Quality Road for fun! EZ game.

Ted from LA,

    If your serious, then thank you very much, I certainly did not expect to come on this morning and see that. I will say though i still have a lot to learn, and though i consider myself a good writer, i wouldn't classify myself better than Steve Haskin or Jason, who have been doing this for far longer than me. Thank you though, i appriciate that you think that.

Dray,

    You twisted the facts and did a complete back flip. You knocked a horse that QR beat by only what  1 1/2 lengths or two? You said that after QR went out of the Derby that Dunkirk would win the Derby, yet you now knock him now to bring down SB and bring up QR. I'm saying that when you knock Dunkirk to bring QR up and SB down it doesn't make sense, since QR in his biggest win only beat Dunkirk, a horse you knock, and TGJJ, who has done nothing of great not since the FL Derby. The only good horses that QR has beaten to date are sprinters, that is it. Any other horses besides Dunkirk, who is a good horse in his own right, have been anywhere near the class of Dunkirk or MTB. If you look at who've these two have beaten it equals out, which then leads to who is more reliable and proven at the distance, which is Summer Bird. Also on my guest blog you said something to the effect of SB needing mud to win, which again is not true. He won the Belmont, on this very same track, on a fast track. All this plus the fact that his highest beyer and even second highest beyer, are better than anything QR has done at 9 furlong or over, says to me that SB is the better horse. As i said i understand QR had excuses in his last, but the fact that he is unproven at this distace, and does not have a running style that makes a person confident about him getting the 10 furlongs, does not really make me want to jump out of my seat to support him. If your keeping it real SB has the best chance out of the two to win.

LDP I believe you need some Kaopectate for you mouth !

en.wikipedia.org/.../Kaopectate

I don't have to do anything to build up Quality Road he is a multiple Graded Stakes winner and set a new Track Record at historic Saratoga.  He is coming back from INJURY some can come right back and some need a little time.  Third off a layoff should be perfect for him and if you look at his works I would say QR is the horse to beat.  As far as the rest of your post please see my above prescription.

Mach Again ran his heart out against Rachel in that loss, and he got a perfect pace scenario.  I think he could be a bit tired off that effort and won't get such a fast pace to run at.  He'll be second best to the best 3 year old colt in the country today.

Aside from his 6th in the Derby (which was a freaky kind of race this year), Summer Bird was flying home in the Arkansas, had a no doubt win in the Belmont, was second to the best horse in training in the Haskell, and won the Travers comfortably.  He is sound and consistent, and doesn't look the part of a tired horse.

Quality Road will be a monster if they keep him at a mile or less, much more like his dad (yes, I know he won at a mile and an eighth, don't think it's his best distance).  I actually think he' give Goldikova a run for her money in the Breeders Cup Mile!  He is freaky fast!  But a mile and a quarter isn't his best distance, IMHO.

1. Summer Bird

2. Macho Again

3. Dry Martini (based on surface pref)

1.)Music Note

2.)Fabulous Strike-Best sprinter in the country!

3.)Pure Clan

4.)Gio Ponti-I'm rooting for that 5th grade 1!

5.)Summer Bird-surprised so many are throwing him out still.  What's he done wrong so far?

I'm playing Sette E Mezzo in my exotics in the Jockey Club.  I think he'll like the distance.  I don't see him winning unless all the favorites have a bad day but I think he'll finish in the

money.      

I'm playing Ready's Echo to win the Joe Hirsch and yes I am nuts.  In June I had a dream he won (an unknown race) in an upset and I've been playing him ever since.  If I didn't play him today and he won I'd never get over it.

Speaking of keeping it real.

QR WON off a layoff. His finish in the Travers was his SECOND start off a layoff. Talk about twisting the FACTS to suit.

Holy Cow! Goldi was beaten into third by a head and a half length. I dearly hope she's not losing her form.

DN

Oh I see, third race off a layoff.

Guess your total lack of class sort of threw me a minute, not that I was TOTALLY shocked. I may have had issues with that poster but think you showed less maturity than a grade schooler with that comment.

Seem to remember you didn't want QR in the Travers, the distance and wanted him to 'follow' RA to the Woodward. JCGC is same distance as the Travers and QR seems to like the shorter distances. Summer Bird so far has shown to be a TRUE distance horse.

Can't see how he can be dismissed so easily.

APPARENTLY you only want certain horses to win in order to PROVE a point about your fav.

You keep talking about 'mud' horses, you include RA in that?

JASON:

I'm totally against Lava Man returning,however do you feel like perhaps his health will remain intact? I would like your opinion. Thanks!

Zenyatta wants no part of Music Note in 2009.

Jason, Ted's just being a horse's patoot. You are my favorite horse racing writer. Steve Haskins is up there too. You guys are both great and I look for your blog everyday.

Somewhat surprised about Goldikova coming in third, but it just goes to show you, all horse's have their own "Upset." Can happen to even the greatest horse running, and for a variety of reasons.

Dirt vs Pro ride? Unbridled Belle ain't no Zenyatta.

Well here's the rain Draynay. The racing gods laugh at you just like the rest of us do. Don't tempt mother nature.

Guess Vinery got over their snit with the Asmussen drug deal. Kodiak Kowboy, gave this one back to him.

Impressive fractions by Careless Jewel. She is a freak. Running all over the track, cocking her head and getting SO worked up in the paddock and then winning for fun.

Agree with the talking heads saying if Zenyatta goes in the Classic, then CJ has to be the favorite in the Distaff.

Knew we could count on Dray to curse it. NOW they're expecting FLOODS in Elmont. sheesh.

I just HOPE he gets a new favorite before DT.

Wow Dray,

    I need that stuff, well in reguards to that I say consider the source. Your horse set a track record in a SPRINT, his works are just that WORKS. A horse can work well the just tank the race. When QR beats some real horses and sets records at 10 furlongs let me know. You said you were keeping it real, and you weren't, you were twisting the facts, like you normally do. I have no problem with you like QR, I like him, but not a 10 furlongs. For reasons why look back at my other posts. Oh and unlike yours, my reasons are valid and actually make some sense.

Thank goodness we don't have to hear anymore nonsense about Gio getting votes for HOY.  Gio got beat by a poor turf horse and I feel sorry for Grand C.  He got a pretty bad ride and could have won the race had he not had all the trouble into the final turn. I had it going and singled GC so now I will wait for Macho to romp.  My Pick 4 ticket is now trash.

Well, Gio Ponti ran great but may have distance limitations. Wonder if the rain had anything at all to do with it even though the race was on grass. The rain was torrential.

Careless Jewel is special. Very impressive. She might give Zenyatta a run for her money. I would be pretty surprised to see Zenyatta in the Classic and not the Distaff.

Ha! You were saying?

I have NOTHING but good to say about Kent today.

That rank horse on his inside could have done him in.

Tim Ice won the first race for the Docs with a claimer. Congrats to the guy!

LDP,

It's a great article.  You have a bright future in covering this sport.

Dray,

Another Bird beats you again!...and hooray for Kodiak Kowboy

Draynay

I'm still waiting for that big time effort that Macho Again was supposd to deliver.....Maybe now you will put things in proper perspective.  The two best 3 year-olds of either sex were on the track today in the JCGC and there isn't another 3 y-o with the possible exception of Mine-That-Bird that can go with them.....SORRY.

By the way Dray

I hope you have more than one house seeing that you got your OFF-TRACK for Maho Again......

Your Post.....

Two things can happen here Quality Road stamps himself as the real leading 3 year old male or Macho Again proves he really is that good.  I will give Quality Road one more chance if he gets a fast track.  If its a off track bet the house on Macho Again.

Draynay 02 Oct 2009 12:35 PM

I think like the Jockey does.  Summer Bird has been lucky to catch his kind of slop.  Poor Macho Again looked like he was running on ice and Quality Road was back on his game.  Quality Road won't have to worry about mud at the Breeders Cup.  I believe Quality Road will be the horse to beat on a dry track.

The more it rained the better Summer Bird's chances looked.  Like most I was out of the Pick 4 thanks to a bad ride for GC so it really didn't matter to me.  Music Note was very very impressive.  Eddie Castro did his job in Ohio !

LAZMANNDICK how much was your pick ticket worth ?  That's what I thought...

See what happens when you disrespect a horse? You get your butt handed to you. Frankly your ticket was trash before the races were run.

Laz, he'll tell you he has homes EVERYWHERE. I sure didn't know they counted cardboard boxes as homes.

I like Dallas, but Macho isn't the great horse Dray tried to paint him as, just because he came so close to beating Rachel.

I can say that all that stuff I heard from the guys on TVG? SB is a DISTANCE horse. He ran a different race against her and I FOR ONE hope she comes back next year and TRIES to run longer than her normal 1 1/8.

I was so happy to see that Careless Jewel, Gone Astray, Summer Bird, Music Note.. what a nice day of racing.

Completely off topic but does any body know whatever became of Bob Black Jack?

Summer Bird is the best 3 yr. old colt hands down. Quality Road not too shabby either but the distance is a little too long for him. Still like him alot. QR did very well.

LDP: You called that race.  You said you wouldn't be surprised to see SB close in early on QR and that is exactly what happened. At first I thought he was moving to soon but it proved to be a very wise decision.  QR was fighting for it..I was impressed by that but he just didn't have enough to get past SB, who still hasn't gotten the respect he deserves.

Dray....keep talking in riddles. It makes for some good laughs. Seriously though..I'm just poking a little fun at you.  I like QR as well..just not sure he is back 100%.  

Careless Jewel is the best Woodbine based filly since Dance Smartly and that one went on to win the Distaff at Churchill Downs.

Is she good enough to win the now

changed name Ladies Classic? She certainly is showing all the signs.

its amazing how tizway held on for 3rd even though his race was over when entering the far turn.

Dray can NEVER admit that Jason, he thrives on trashing horses, jockeys and trainers that he knows nada about. He really has to be the worst handicapper EVER and worse than that? He's a bad loser, bad winner and his excuses reek.

Oh by the way? You have to be a MAN to man up. Not a name calling, insult tossing little boy.

Think it'll take something stronger than Kaopectate to resolve his problem, time to get an Rx for diphenoxylate hydrochloride and atropine sulfate for starters.

Dray"

I had big money on the Cowboy Exactor.  I'll be sleeping in my OWN house tonight.

Agree on CJ Jason. What makes her such a monster is her bad behavior before and during the race, yet she STILL wins easily.

That filly looks like she could beat ANYBODY if they can get rid of her quirks.

I thought she was going to go the outside rail at one point and then when Robert used the stick on her once, to get her attention? She cocked her head like she wanted to turn around and take a bite out of him. Pretty impressive.

Jockey Club Gold Cup- Summer Bird proved beyond a doubt that he is the best 3 year old male at a classic distance.  The tactical speed he "discovered" in the Haskell has served him well since and was vital to his win today.  The pace was so slow that it was going to be difficult for any horse to make up alot of ground on Quality Road.  Unlike Macho Again, who is a pure one-run horse, Summer Bird had the speed to stay within 3 lengths of Quality Road throughout the early part of the race, and one knew that when he drew even with that rival at the top of the stretch, his superior stamina would be the difference.  With 3 grade 1 victories, Summer Bird has a strong grip on the Eclipse for champion 3 year old male.  The ONLY way he losses it is if Mine That Bird wins the Classic.  Horse of the Year, however, is very, very unlikely.  Summer Bird obviously deserves consideration for the award, but folks can't simply forget that he did lose the Arkansas Derby and only ran a moderate 6th in the Kentucky Derby. Most significantly, Summer Bird was soundly defeated by the horse that is his main competition for the HoY, Rachel Alexandra.  Yes, the Haskell was at 9 furlongs and Summer Bird appears best at 10 furlongs+, but it was a million dollar race and Rachel won convincingly.  Shouldn't the HoY be determined by what happened on the track?  Throw in the fact that Rachel, unlike Summer Bird, is undefeated this year, and that she has won 2 more grade 1 races than he has, and I just don't see how one could vote Summer Bird over Rachel. Nonetheless, Summer Bird is having a monster year, and the JCGC made him the first 3 year old since Easy Goer to win that race, the Belmont, and the Travers in the same year.

Quality Road ran well, but had no excuses for the loss.  Given how slow the pace was, I think Quality Road should have been out on a 5 length lead, but it wasn't like he had alot go against him. He was allowed to stalk Tizway on the outside and had a clear run the entire race.  Summer Bird simply had more endurance, and is just plain better at this stage.  Macho Again was disappointing, but hardly surprising.  It's questionable whether he wants 10 furlongs anyways, and he certainly wasn't going to win at that distance trying to make up 10 lengths against a ridiculously slow pace.  His supporters should just throw this race out and expect to see him in the Breeders Cup Dirt Mile(if he goes to the Breeders Cup in the first place).

Hawthorne Gold Cup- It was a disappointing day for West Point Thoroughbreds at Belmont(Macho Again) but their Awesome Gem took down the top prize at Hawthorne.  Awesome Gem, although stabled in Cali, demonstarted that he is a little bit better on dirt than synthetic.  Awesome Gem won the 2007 gr.2 San Fernando at Santa Anita when that track still had conventional dirt.  Finishing behind Awesome Gem that day were 4 grade 1 or 2 winners, Midnight Lute(gr.1 BC Sprint twice, gr.1 Forego), Brother Derek(gr.1 Santa Anita Derby, gr.1 Hollywood Futurity), Arson Squad(gr.2 Swaps, gr.2 Strub, gr.2 Meadowlands Cup), and Spring at Last(gr.1 Donn, gr.2 Dubai Mile).  Later that year, Awesome Gem outdueled Street Sense for 3rd in the BC Classic in slop similar to what he skipped through today.  For a horse that has so many graded stakes runner-ups, it was good to see him get a big one.  As for the Breeders Cup Classic, he has a shot, but it will be a longshot.

Ohio Derby + Indiana Derby- Solid performances by Gone Astray and Misremembered; both horses were winning their 2nd important stakes race of the year.  Gone Astray was a total class standout in the Ohio Derby, but he had to struggle a little more than expected before drawing away late.  Gone Astray is certainly a good looking and good moving horse, and has every right to continue improving. It's doubtful that he is ready for top level competition in the Classic, but hopefully he remains in training for his 4 year old season, when he should be a leading handicap horse.  Misremembered is probably not ready for top level competition either, but like Gone Astray he should get better. 10 furlongs is somewhat of a question, but one has to like his speed and ratability.  Baffert has one to watch in the future.

Cal Cup Classic- Misremembered's Swaps rival, Grazen, tragically was pulled up in deep stretch when leading the Cal Cup Classic.  The injury was sadly reminiscent of Indy Anne's breadown in the gr.1 La Brea this past December.  Indy Anne, an elite female sprinter, was dueling with Indian Blessing in midstretch of the La brea(well ahead of the 3rd place horse) when she was suddenly pulled up. I was present at Santa Anita that day, and my friend and I started booing and shouting negatives about the synthetic track.  Indy Anne, who a few days after the La Brea was euthanized, was one of a rash of significant injuries that occurred during the first week of the Santa Anita winter meet.  From what others on here have written, it sounds like there have been a spike in injuries during this first week of the Oak Tree meet.  What is going on? Why does there seem to be such a dangerous transition period when moving from meet to meet?  For all the money invested, and all the propaganda about synthetics, the sight of Grazen, a promising graded stakes winner, being pulled up is simply unacceptable!

Cotillion-  Carelsss Jewel is something else.  She was far from professional today, and seemed to get distracted in the stetch. Yet, the talent is unmistakable.  She has amazing unbridled speed, and with her high leg action, appears capable of carrying that speed as far as needed.  There is no doubt she will be a MAJOR factor in the BC Distaff.  The Beyer for the Cotillion will probably be about 5 lengths slower than her Alabama or Delaware Oaks, but Careless Jewel probably gave away those lengths with her antics in the stretch. Careless Jewel still alot of unseen talent and has room for improvement, and that's just plain scary.

Beldame- For such a prestigious race, the field was completely underwhelming. Music Note did what was expected, stalking the classy Unbridled Belle until the stretch, and then drawing off in a professional rather than scintilating fashion. Still, it was Music Note's 5th grade 1 win, placing her alongside Rachel Alexandra, Stardom Bound, Riboletta, and You for 4th among female grade 1 winners this decade(Azeri is 1st with 11 grade 1s, then Ashado and Sightseek with 7--note Ouija Board also won 7 grade 1 races, but 5 came outside North America).  Music Note proved that she can run very well on Santa Anita's Pro Ride last year when a good 3rd to Zenyatta and stablemate Cocoa Beach.  Zenyatta or not, Music Note has a good shot in the Distaff and should be viewed with Careless Jewel and Icon Project as the favorites for the race(if Big Z goes to the Classic).

Joe Hirsch- Well, Gio Ponti is not perfect.  I wouldn't conclude from the race that Gio Pnti can't get 12 furlongs; given how heavy the turf course was, the Hirsch was more like a 1 mile and 5/8ths race.  After making his typical smooth move around the turn, Gio Ponti simply got tired in the stretch.  The Eclipse award for male turf horse is still likely his, but the talk of Gio Ponti for Horse of the Year should be dead.  As for the Breeders Cup, I would understand if Clement and the owners are now leaning for the Classic at 10 furlongs rather than the Turf at 12 furlongs. Hopefully, however, they recognize that 12 furlongs on Santa Anita's blazing turf course is very different from the 12 furlongs he ran today.  As I said, the Hirsch was basically a 13 furlong race, and it's likely Gio Ponti would have won today had the race been a furlong shorter(he had opened up what appeared to be an insurmountable lead before hitting the proverbial brick wall).

Flower Bowl- Pure Clan was able to turn the tables on Dynaforce and others.  Very astutely, Julien Leparoux kept Pure Clan much closer to Dynaforce and the other leaders than he did in the Beverly D. Given the slow pace, this was vital. For a few seconds in mid-stretch it appeared that Cirticsm was going to be able to take advantage of this slow pace and that Pure Clan's late run may again come up short. However, the extra sixteenth of a mile(as compared to the Beverly D) proved decisive, as did Pure Clan's class and endurance. The win was Pure Clan 2nd gr.1 at 10 furlongs, and should set her up for a good run in the Breeders Cup Filly and Mare where she will be one of the leading contenders.

Vosburgh- The race unfolded exactly like I anticipated, except that Fabulous Strike was unable to hold on.  In midstretch, Fab Strike appeared a definite winner, particularly since Munnings was floundering. However, Kodiak Kid, winner of the gr.1 Carter and 4 other graded stakes, didn't give up and was able to nail Fab Strike just as he did in that Carter victory.  Fab Strike had absolutely no excuse to fade as he did.  The pace, with a half in 45 and 1, was reasonable, and he had a perfect trip stalking Go Go Shoot on the outside.  The loss was one of many tough defeats Fab Strike has suffered in a big race.  As consistent and honest Fab Strike is, the fact is he has not been able to close the deal in the majority of his biggest, most important stakes races.  A trip out to Cali for Fab Strike appears, at least to me, even less likely than it was 24 hours ago.  Fab Strike's preference for dirt rather than synthetics is well documented; the fact Fab Strike wasn't good enough to win a dirt race at a track he had enjoyed decent success on does not bode well for his chances in the BC Sprint.  Today's loss also cost Fab Strike severely in terms of the Eclipse award for top sprinter.  Fab Strike NEEDED the Vosburgh to put him ahead of Zensational. Now, however, Zensational is the clear leader for the award. Having already won 3 grade 1 races, a win in the BC Sprint would guarantee Zensational the Eclipse.  Even if he shoud lose the Sprint, Zensational should still get a number of Eclipse votes. Had Fab Strike held on and won the Vosburgh and then Zensational bomb in the Sprint, I really think the Eclipse would have been Fabulous Strike's.  It is now Zensational's to lose.  As for Munnings, it is apparent he just does not care for the slop. His Eclipse chances are now a very long shot.

France/Arc weekend-

Shockingly, Goldikova LOST today.  In an almost unbelievable result, Goldikova was actually passed by 2 horses in the stretch of the 7 furlong Prix de la Foret and crossed the wire 3rd.  This only reminds us just how tough and unpredictable this sport is.  Widely hailed as the best turf miler in the Breeder's Cup era, at least co-leaders along with Miesque and Lure, Goldikova was going for her 7th grade 1 win and was viewed by many as the biggest favorite for the upcoming Breeders Cup.  Her loss suddenly opens the BC Mile(turf), and it will be interesting to see if a few horses that were being pointed for other BC races over the Mile(think Ventura) are again under consideration for the Mile.  It's entirely possible the loss was an abberation and that Goldikova will bounce back and run huge in the Breeders Cup.  However, there are now questions, and one must wonder whether her 2 year campaign has caught up with her.  From Freddie Head's comments, it's even possible that Goldikova does not come over for the Breeders Cup.  Hopefully, she checks out sound and is given a chance to defend her Mile title.  Who would have believed that Goldikova and Gio Ponti would both lose today?

Harness Racing: Kentucky Futurity(a futurity in harness racing is actually for 3 year olds)- Muscle Hill easily won both his elimination and then the Final to take down the final leg of the Trotting Triple Crown.  Although the Triple Crown(which is nothing close to the thoroughbred Triple Crown in terms if prestige and importance) was not on the line given Muscle Hill did not run in the 2nd leg(Yonkers Trot with the Hambletonian the opening leg), the race held alot of significance since it was Muscle Hill's 18th and 19th(elims count as a race) consecutive victories.  Amazingly, this is the 2nd time in just 3 years that a trotter had won his 19th straight race by taking the Kentucky Futurity.  Muscle Hill, unusual for a standardbred in how powerfully he is built, is an almost perfect horse, with his only career blemish a 2nd in his debut last year.  Should Muscle Hill do what Donato Hanover failed to do, and win the Breeders Crown(Final + elimination race), he might just go down as the greatest 3 year old trotter in history.  I was honored to have seen this active legend in person when he won the $1 million Canadian Trotting Classic two weeks ago.

Michigan Sire Championship Day-

Valley Loot held up her end when she won the older female stakes by a little more than a length.  The win was Valley Loot's 2nd straight older female sire stakes,  her 3rd overall sire stakes win(won the 3 year old filly stakes in 2007 after running 2nd in the juvenile filly), and 11th career stakes win.  The victory pushed Valley Loot's career earnings to $525,000+, making her the 3rd richest Michigan bred female in history.  

Unfortunately, Meadow Vespers was not able to win his 5th straight Michigan Sire Stakes.  Last early, Vespers made a brief run around the turn and then flattened out, crossing the wire 5th.  Today was only the 4th time in 34 career starts the 7 year old was not able to finish in the money.  In a changing of the guard, the race went to 4 year old Bipolar Express, the winner of last year's Sire Stakes for 3 year old males.  The horse that ran 3rd behind Bipolar Express in that 2008 Sire Stakes for 3 year olds, Hot Chili, was 2nd today. 7 year old Demagoguery, the star of the Michigan breds at 2 in 2004, ran his best race in years to finish a very close 3rd.

Sea the Stars and the Arc tomorrow!    

Karen2,

    Thanks. I'd been noticing they'd been using him for more tactical styles in his last two, and he seems to run bettter that way. His last two races were his best beyer wise, a 111 and a 109, and both were run closer to the pace. I thought that since that was going on they would do a milder version of what they did in the Haskell. QR had some soft fractions today and still couldn't hold off SB, and the slop was no excuse, QR ran just fine and still got beat. This is why i think if he's actually pushed to do more early on that he will falter, JMO.

Ted from LA,

    Thank you again for the compliment.

Dray,

    Guess i won't be needing that perscription, though i'd be happy to buy one for you.

Summer Bird is a vastly improved colt indeed and he revels in the slop. Take nothing away from him for his victories in the Belmont, Travers and now the JCGC.  He will be a deserving Eclipse award winner.  

However to put things into perspective he has had the good fortune of sloppy track conditions in his last three outings which has certainly given him competitive advantage (except against Rachel Alexandra ...the Great).  Quality Road on the other hand has run into a revelling Summer Bird twice in the slop which he doesn't appear to relish and closed the 5 lengths gap by which SB beat him in the Travers to 3/4 length in the JCGC in only his third start off injury.  I have every respect for Summer Bird's brilliance and improvement but I am still looking forward to Quality Road performing under fast track conditions.  The Breeder's Cup Classic on Pro-Ride is a "horse of a different colour" in terms of which horses will move up on it versus which ones will regress so we may have to wait until next year, hopefully in the Donn Handicap at Gulfstream for him to commence his taking of the 2010 season by the scruff of the neck.

Other impressive performances today came from Gone Astray and Careless Jewel.  The latter is truly another awesome filly and both of them underscore the depth of talent in this year's crop.  Gone Astray is a colt to watch for next year.      

Yes, Careless Jewel was impressive.  Just gawking and all over the place and still winning very easily.  Quality Road showed his class, Summer Bird can really cover the ground.  Join in the Dance was so rank he was dangerous.  Are Gio Ponti's owners going for the Classic now with possible distance issues?  Grazen was a horse I really liked and was keeping an eye on, so sorry for that incident, thank goodness he is OK.

Gunbow:

I was really impressed with Kodiak Cowboy.....had big money on the exactor.....I think Carless Jewel should get a jockey change…..nothing against Landry, but the way he handled the horse actually made me nervous.....Not smooh at all.

A little off topic.....How about that Muscle Hill in the Futurity.....1.51.1 under wraps.....there was win betting only in the straight pools.....of 22,451 in the win pool, 21,192 was on Muscle Hill, a little over a thou' on the rest of the field combined.

Seeing Grazen pull up today almost made me sick. Synthetics have got to go. They have no excuses at all, they don't get muddy, they are suppose to be weather resistan, and be safer all around for horses, yet we've seen breakdown after breakdown after breakdown. Cali needs to take their head out of the sand and relize that they are driving themselves into the ground with this stubborness and pride that won't allow them to admit they made a mistake.

Lol... yes I was wrong about many things today but I was not wrong about Summer Bird.  He caught a lucky break getting that rain an hour before the race but rain won't save him on Breeder's Cup Day.  I think Quality Road will win and be crowned top 3 year old colt.  I think like his jockey does, if he catches a dry track they won't catch him.  By the way does anyone know how many G1 races Mr. Pletcher has lost in a row...?

To say I had a good day at handicapping is a understatement.

(See Kevin Oct 2 2:37 PM)

But racing is racing and the gods know how to smack you down. I stood with my friends (trainer and owners) in disbelief as their horse "Pappy's Double H" took a bad step, and flipped, in the eleventh race, and had to be put down on the track. Just got home, and as of now, (Thank God) it looks like Jessica Medina (Jockey) is not seriously hurt.

Turned out to be a day that gives me strange emotions right now. Don't mean to be a downer. I'll be back at Belmont tomorrow with these same friends, and I will be hoping that their horse "Mercy's Delight" in the seventh race wins for them. They could use the lift. Doesn't bring back Pappy (or Birdbrain as he was called around the barn) but it, a win, would help the raise the spirits of the barn somewhat.

So, Jason, and whoever else might chance on this, root with me tomorrow for "Mercy", to have a safe race and maybe even win for David (the trainer).          

Jason, I'm really bummed about Grazen in the CA Cup. Thought he had huge potential & a joy to watch him run.  So according to the article by Jack Shinar, his trainer doesn't consider his injury life-threatening - but he won't run again.  Luckily, he isn't a gelding, so hopefully another future awaits him.

But what about the other breakdown in that race, Blackbriar?  No mention was made by Shinar of his condition.  Can you find out, please?

Even with all the glop at Belmont, we saw no hurt horses...yet on a beautiful day at SA.....well, maybe a lesson for the PTB can be taken from this day. We can hope.

My prediction if Summer Bird makes it to the Breeder's Cup he will be owned by Darley, there's no way they will resist adding him to their stable.

Another sad note:

The Cal CuUp Classic.....both Grazen and Blackbriar took bad steps and were vanned off.....I don't know how serious but it sure is sad.

20 years ago, Easy Goer won the Belmont, Travers, and Jockey Club Gold Cup in one year.  I don't know if any other horse in the modern era had ever scored that particular triple before, but I don't think so.

Summer Bird just did it today folks!  And unlike Easy Goer, Summer Bird didn't have a start as a 2yo!

It's a BIG if, but if Summer Bird goes to California and somehow wins the Breeders Cup Classic, he will absolutely threaten Rachel's so-called lock for Horse Of The Year.  I know she man-handled him in the Haskell, and Rachel's campaign has had a historical significance of its own, but if Summer Bird wins the Classic off of what he's already done, the vote will be nothing less than contentious.

Ranagulzion  03 Oct 2009 9:24 PM

I agree !  Gone Astray hit the double for me and helped me hit the pick 3 for one of my few wins for the day.  He looked very good.  I will be watching QR workouts.  If he takes to the surface he will be my pick no matter who shows.

Give it up Dray, admit for ONCE THAT YOU can be and USUALLY ARE wrong!

What YOU don't get about Summer Bird is he didn't even RACE until MARCH of THIS year. Foaled in April 06, he is a young horse on the improve. Every race he gets better and every race he shows a new dimension and more grittiness.

Todd hasn't won a G1 in New York since 2007. He's won a number of G1's in that time frame, just not in NY. Don't try to blame it on him. How Many G1's have YOU won?

What's your deal with Birdstones? Did Mary Lou snub you? Sheesh get over it.

I can just say if you're still coming to Keeneland for opening weekend, like you said, then I'm betting all the opposite of whatever you say you're picking. That'll be easy since you're all chalk unless it's a Birdstone.

Sherpa

You must have missed the last at Belmont.....terrible breakdown, Pappy's Doupuble H.

Sorry for your friend's loss Kevin.....I couldn't imagine having to go through that.....Keep your spitits up.

All I know is that I wish I owned stock in Birdstone.

Dray

    Come on, SB has won w/o the aid of a wet track, the Belmont Stakes, remember? Also your horse had the dream trip, sitting on the outside, off snail like fractions, and still could not hold off Summer Bird. Johnny V was being a poor sport, Pletcher has said before that QR doesn't mind mud and runs just fine in it, so you can't use that as an excuse either. You were wrong, period.

ZipsSecret, I was thinking along the same lines, except with respect to Careless Jewel and Jess J.  I sincerely doubt that the good Drs. J would have an interest in selling the stellar homebred colt they've been striving for these many years.

Which reminds me of an oddity I've wondered about -- does anyone know why the Jayaraman's colors have a bit "T" on them instead of a "J"??

Gun Bow- I wasn't surprised that Goldikova lost.  I thought it ws a gamble, but I think Freddie Head wanted to get a race that would sharpen her speed.  She attended a pretty hot pace, forged to the lead earlier than she needed to, and then seemed to get a little tired at the end.  Milers in Europe sometimes have trouble with seven furlongs.  They usually don't run them at that distance unless they want to tighten them up.  But let's hope that she is ok, and they were just over confidant.  As far as Ventura, they seem to want to keep her around one turn, as she is the most effective in that scenario.

Meant to add to GunBow -

I love your long, wonderfully informative posts.  Your synopsis of today's races was masterful.  You should be writing for BH as a regular columnist or blogger.

Sherpa,

This is all I've found about Blackbriar. It doesn't say a lot, but what it says is quite sad.

www.google.com/.../ALeqM5j_SPR5gt39pU_tC5wogGT9cucyigD9B3TKAG0

Draynay,

 Your handicapping skills were pathetic as always. Your lame explanations as to why the horse you gave no respect kicked butt are even more pathetic. Summer Bird is a threat to any horse racing today. Rain, Sunshine, or synthetic surface, it does not matter.

Sherpa, Tiffany Farm, Ocala, owners Dr. Kalarikkal Jayaraman and his wife, Dr. Vilasini Jayaraman. He's a retired cardiologist and she's a retired pathologist. They own the colt, and he was broke on the farm.

I understand the couple was downsizing and even considered leaving the game. Then they got the Bird.LOL

I THINK they still own the farm, but they got their start at Oaklawn, they both practiced in Hot Springs.

Laz, I saw Kevin's post about Pappy's Double-H, but only after I had already commented (it does take some time before posts show up here).  What a heartbreaker; and re Blackbriar, too.  Thank you, Melissa, for posting the article you found.

LDP give it rest...lol...really just give it a rest finish High School and be a good girl.  Longwaytomay you bet Summer Bird at the Breeders Cup and I will bet Quality Road.  Let me know how it works out for you.

One of these day the Birds aren't going to catch any mud and we all know it will be at the Cup.  Let's see how the Birds do without mud.

Like I told Draynut, SB didn't even leave their farm until he was 3, pretty impressive 6 months for the colt.

Had Summer Bird over the Tiznow horse but Quality Road Showed up and it was on....Cali represented in Illonois/Indiana, it's fake tracks not fake horses...But oh, the Cal Cup Classic, I saw it once and did not want to see it again, God help us all....

Well, I was at SA today for fabulous CalCup Day.  I want to publicly apologize to the couple standing next to me that I offended with my tearful emotions when Grazen broke down in the Cal Cup Classic.  I must have taken a zillion pics of Grazen in the saddling area, in the walking ring, in the race, and after.  I still don't know his ultimate fate, don't want to right now.  I was so focused on him, that I never realized that another horse was worse off, and that is why Grazen stood there for a while, and was allowed to turn around full circle before a vet got to him and strapped a metal rod on his left-front leg.  Someone yelled out to Gomez that you saved that horse's life, and he walked off shaking his head while looking down.  It was so sad.  Garrett did his usual masterful job of bringing the horse to a stop.

I have to say that I believe Lethal Heat, who was insane before the race, pushed the lightly raced 3-year-old, and I wish she had NOT been in the race.  All the males were so calm, especially Grazen who is a very cool-headed horse;  even when he broke down he seemed to remain calm.  I hope he is still alive.

Kent Desormeaux rode a great race...he knew the 2 colts were pretty equal and that if he let QR get away he couldn't catch him...but on equal terms, right now there is no catching Summer Bird...did you see the ease of his stride? Kent was HAND RIDING him at the finish...that colt has blossomed into a true race horse. He ran in real race time on a slop track.

I love QR and was one of only two people who believed in him after he had bombed in his second race (haha) but when I saw Summer Bird at the Arkansas Derby he popped out at me.

What a great representative of his granddad he's going to be.

Tim, Draynay is not a race horse lover or sportsman...at first I used to think he was and was just passionate about his favorites, but no horse person disparages with such vitriole another horse simply because their choice gets beaten.

He's just busting our chops, spewing out whatever he thinks will get a rise from us, LOL.

It's not just him...we've all read posts here from people who have pompously disparaged Man O'War, Ruffian, Secretariat, Seattle Slew, etc. as not being real race horses.

Anyone who knocks any race horse is not a horse person. From a hard knocker making his 151st start as an earner of $300,000 (last week, can you believe it?  A thoroughbred, not standardbred)or a maiden at 5 who's owners won't give it up so he keeps trying with the little talent (not effort) he inherited, to the top graded stakes winner who loses once in awhile, they all pay the same at the window and they all give what they have. Do YOU?

Misremembered set a track record..

I had SB, QR and Macho Again...as a Tiznow fanatic...aaaagh, I didn't let my favoritism guide me! Mach Again was tired, to me,

I had Pure Clan, Dynaforce, Criticism

Music Note, Unbridled Belle, Captain's Lover

I had Lethal Heat, Graezen, Bold Chieftan

I had Gio Ponti, Grand C, Telling...

I had Awesome Gem, Going Ballistic, You and I Forever

I had Fab Strike, KK, Munnings

Missed them by THAT much!!!!!

Like Johnny V I would like to see them meet on a dry track. The slop deffinatly moves SB up as he's able to run closer to the pace.Thats not unusual for closers and turf hoses that run in the slop. I was very impressed with QR performance.

Dray,

    At least I have the maturity to admit that i'm wrong when someone shows me the facts and show's me up. I flat out called the race, you didn't. QR got the easiest fractions you could get, and still couldn't hold off SB. Your next exucse was he wasn't prepared enough, for his third race off a layoff, yet all the time before that you were saying how much better prepared he was and because of that he would whip SB's butt, wrong again. You then say the mud was what did it, when his trainer has even said the mud has had nothing to do with it, he runs in it just fine, plus you conviently forget that Summer Bird, did win on a dry racetrack in a Grade one already, so obviously he doesn't really need mud to win. You want to tell me to finish high school, well, i'm in the process of doing that, and actually can find the time to be an A student and kick you butt at handicapping. If anything you should just go back and retake grade school seeing as how you maturity leve doesn't go past a seven year old child.

I was watching the horses warm up before the Opera this morning.....I couldn't help but be impressed by the way they bounced around, very contented like they were really enjoying what they were doing.

Draynay,

I never said anything about Summer Bird winning the BC. Don't put words in my mouth. I said SB is a threat to any horse running today. I stand by that statement. I also said your exuses as to why Summer Bird won and Quality Road lost were pathetic. I stand by that statement also. Someday you might learn to remove all personal emotion from your handicapping strategy. I believe  that is a piece of advice that would serve you well but is something you would never consider.

another great bet the house pick by dray. get over it summer bird is the real deal

Sometimes you have to give credit where credit is due.  Kent D. was brilliant in riding the Bird.  When Quality Road took over the race Ken pressed him right away.  He did not want to get into a sprint contest down the stretch.  Really a great job by a jockey and horse that are in tune.  Quality Road was not pressed real hard and should come out of this race ready for a peak performance in the Breeders Cup.  A third and second place finish after injury is something to build on and he moved forward from his last.  I expect him to move forward again and will be my choice for the Classic.  Congrats to Thistledowns and Ohio Racing for putting on the Ohio Derby during these tough economic times.  I hope the slots come soon and Ohio racing comes back to its former glory.

Mine Thst Bird is now officially and forever "the other bird".  Summer Bird is the boss.  And after yesterday's Cal Cup injury toll at Oak Tree and career ending training injuries to Mi Sueno and Marchfield, could we please have another round of "synthetics are safer" howls?  Anybody?        

Shug's been pretty adamant that Gone Astray is not ready for the big boys yet. DRF says he's aiming for the Discovery H. Shug generally puts his horses where he thinks they'll have their best chance, and not just to have a horse in a grade 1. What has happened to With Flying Colors since she was sold and moved to Pletcher is disheartening- it's highly doubtful that Shug would have put her in these spots off her previous form.

On another "note" the performance by Music Note was even better than I first thought.  I watched the race again and the fractions were fast and UB ran a very good race but MN is an improving horse and a rested horse and will be my pick in the Ladies Classic.  When the race was over she appeared to be hitting her best stride.  Music Note and Quality Road for the Double!!!

hellsbelles I've seen hundreds of break downs on dirt--STILL...I cannot help but lament the advent of syn thetic tracks--I say for training--THE BEST! For racing? Dirt...DIRT....with sand, water, and (a little) pooh pooh...Grazen was a real nice horse, I believe the best horse Mitchel ever had, a huge loss and he was a top cal-bred, just a tough loss....

If Sea The Stars shows up at the Breeders Cup, Summer Bird vs. Quality Road is going to be a moot point in my opinion. That is one incredible horse. A race between Sea The Stars and Rachel Alexandra would have been a race for the ages.

Tim G - thanks for answering my question last night about the "T" on the Drs. J silks.  I'd read a number of articles about them but must've blanked on Tiffany Farm.

re Draynay's comments: at first I thought he just had it in for MTB because of the astonishing Derby win. But as he continues his diatribe against SB, I have begun to wonder if the *real* grudge is against sire Birdstone - or even grandsire Grindstone...?  Lost a lot of money betting against this family, Dray?

Of yesterday's races, I watched the Hirsch replay more times than any other and have to say,  Interpatation's win is most thrilling. As Gio passes him it looks to be the predicted outcome (even Robby thought so); but then Interpatation digs in and refuses to concede the race.  Don't think I've ever seen more determination from a horse. I do love it when the "rank outsider" wins the day! LOL

Gosh, Dray, I think the mud moved up Music Note. She's not really THAT good.

Now see how stupid that sounds?

Sea The Stars was a monster in the Arc. I hope they do decide to bring him to the BC.

Possible dreamer here but would it not be neat to see a Sea the Stars x Rachel Alexandra foal?

I was really happy for Awesome Gem, too. He's still a fan favorite of mine.

Lol... da3hoss it's spelled VITRIOL!  If you're going to use fancy verbiage please try to spell the words correctly.  It may add some weight to your meaningless posts.

SEA THE STARS became a European immortal today in the Arc.  I hope that they send him to the Breeder's Cup before shipping him off to stud.  What a horse!! If he comes here an wins the BCC he ought to be a nominee for HOTY.  Good horse sense must prevail over parochial nationalism.

Summer Bird, 3 yr old champ.  Why? Why is it that this sport continues to penalize horses that run in all three triple crown races and continues to reward the ones that pick and choose the easy spots.  Why couldn't Summer Bird run in the Preakness or Derby? This is what really bothers me.  The versatile warrior always gets shunned for the pick and choose champion,  I don't think its right.  I hope Mine That Bird wins the BC Because he rightfully deserves the 3 yr old championship; he danced all the dances. So I guess the triple crown races mean nothing, pretty much what I thought.

kevin mercy ran a good race if she didn't have to go wide then he probably would have won or come just shy of first. but  a good run hope he wins next out.

If Sea the Stars comes to America for the BC Classic does anyone out there besides Dray think that he would lose? If so, please tell me how.

In fairness to Gio Ponti, the Belmont turf was so bad today that several stakes races scheduled for the grass were switched to the main track....I know that the others had to run on it and this is not intended to slight Interpretation, but that was one tiring course.  The time was 17 second off the track record and about 15 seconds slower than Sea The Stars Arc time.

I don't think Sea The Stars will make the Breeders Cup Classic. I think he is done. He is worth more to them in the breeding shed.

Sea the Stars and Rachel?  No contest- Sea the Stars.  I still say Zarkava was a better 3 yr old filly than Rachel Alexandra.  Ran against better horses and won her races easily.  She could be a challenge for Sea the Stars.  We didn't see the best of her ever.  Just won as she pleased.  But Sea the Stars is special, much more special than Rachel is.  He is in a different class.

But I have never underestimated the talent of Zenyatta, unlike many on these blogs.  She can run a stretch as well as anyone.  Thank you to Steve for writing that article showing how wonderful her races were this year.  I'm so tired of people slamming her.  She closes and wins on any pace and beat Ginger Punch when she was in top form.  Ginger Punch beats Macho Again anytime.

TIM G

I have the million dollar question for you! It's way old and tired that you are always on DRAYNAY at every turn and also thinking you know everything about everything. Is there anything that you don't know? Your act,like some others  is in need of a new comedy writer!

LONGWAYTOMAY

DRAY isn't the only one. While STS is a "superhorse",I would love to see him take on Zenyatta.

To Whatever:  Summer Bird did run in the Kentucky Derby.  He drew post 17 and finished in 6th place.  He didn't run in the Preakness.

Summer Bird won the "New York Triple Crown" - the first horse to do so in two decades (Easy Goer was the last horse to do it in 1989).  

I like MTB, too, but horses that only win the Kentucky Derby and nothing else all year very rarely, if ever, win 3YO champ.  MTB would have to win the BCC to have any chance now.  

To longwaytomay:  I don't think Sea The Stars is a lock to win the BCC by any stretch if he comes here.  He's had a tough campaign for one thing.  And he might not like the surface or track configuration and he might not like the climate either.  Because of those factors, I think he would be at his most vulnerable in that race.  

Whatever,

    Summer Bird did run in the Derby. He had a horrible trip and wound up a closing sixth in only his fourth start. He then runs in and wins the Belmont and has run in nothing but Grade one's since then, winning the Travers and JCGC, and finishing second in the Haskel. So far MTB has yet to really run back to his Derby win or Preakness place, while SB keeps on getting better.

Whatever Summer Bird did compete in the Derby

To Whatever - Summer Bird ran in the Kentucky Derby - He had a troubled trip but finished 6th.

Ranagulzion, The Eclipse awards are for the AMERICAN thoroughbred champions. Truthfully, even though none of us would turn one down if awarded, people just aren't chasing them as the end all and be all. Until it is points based taking out the political aspects and personal favoritism? It just isn't something worth ruining a horse for. Note Zenyatta's current path.

Summer Bird was fantastic!  He is putting together a campaign a lot like Curlin's - started racing this spring and keeps winning important races.  But for some reason he is sure not getting the credit for it....?   Whatever: MTB was great winning the Derby but without another win this year, I don't see how he could possibly be considered in the running for HOTY - even if he were the win the Breeder's Cup.  Summer Bird also won one race of the triple crown if you remember.  And for the record, Rachel is HOTY in my opinion.  Ranagulzion: the Cartier Awards are for horses racing in Europe and Sea The Stars will surely win that!  The Eclipse Awards are however, for "American" racing campaigns.  IF he comes here and wins ONE race on our soil, that does NOT entitle him to be our Horse Of The Year.  IMO that should NEVER happen in the voting although it unfortunately has in the past!

Relva, you don't know the half of it. Don't read my posts if you don't want to. No one is holding a gun to your head.

However, UNLIKE YOUR claims to others, I do know a lot of people in racing, I'm actually involved. Sorry if it interupts your fantasy world. By the way? When did you become a champion of his?

You enjoy him insulting your friends like LDP etc?

Even if I've had differences of opinions with her and others, the disrespect exceeds anything I'VE read on here. Figured since her 'friends' aren't defending her I would.

By the way Mike? I know the ins and outs of two things, Medicine and horses. I'll debate you on either of them. Or better yet match up with you in the actuality of either.

Thanks MIKE RELVA, what they all seem to forget is if you play the horses you are wrong every day.  Everyone of them were wrong too but they seem to relish in telling me I was wrong.  Funny, when I am right none of them mention it. Sea The Stars is a great turf horse but I don't really care that much.  He hasn't beat GIO and until he does he is just the best over there on the pretty green stuff.  Whoopeee.  Until he wins something on dirt against G1 competition I am not all that impressed.  

TIM G

If you are in fact a Doctor,I can only wonder since you are in love with yourself. Also,I don't live in a "fantasy world". I know individuals in the racing business. You must be pretty shallow if you believe you are the only one that knows someone in this business! Good luck with that! Get a reality check!

TIM G

I'm an engineer w/ a Masters' degree. Guess you are an "expert" in that field also. lol

Tim G you are a piece of ... work. I see that we heard NOTHING from you until AFTER the Jockey Gold.  AFTER the race we have had to listen to your nonsense 6 or 7 times.  I guess it's easy to be a expert after the fact huh.  Since you are a medicine and horse expert why don't you try sharing you brilliance with the blog BEFORE the race instead of AFTER the race.  I think Mike is on to something maybe you need a ghost writer.  It worked for Sarah Palin!

I'm in the camp hoping that Sea Stars decides to come State-side--precisely because I don't know if he'd win but he seems to be one of those once in a lifetime horses, who unlike Rachel Alexandra, isn't cherry picking his races for best advantage--he also seems to not have "bad" trips, in the sense that nothing that happens to him during a race seems to prevent him from winning--a sure sign of greatness if ever there was one.

I have to say that I am green with envy over the European Race tracks, watching those horses race through the verdant parkland of Longchamp has to be one of the most beautiful things I have ever seen in my life.

If only Mine that Bird could have a jockey as patient as Mick Kinane, who believes so completely in the horse beneath him...Summer Bird found his jockey and Summer Bird's results show what a difference it makes. What might have been had MTB formed a lasting partnership...

But anyway, I'm just happy for Birdstone whenever either Bird does well...it's bad luck to boo a horse for winning. He's getting the last laugh now.  BTW, does anyone know what's up with MTB being nominated for Oklahoma all of a sudden?

It isn't the message, it's the delivery.

This blog comment section is JUST that, a comment section with peoples opinions. No need to beat people down and try to humiliate them.

One thing only a couple people do on here is bash the horses. A certain person is the worst of all. I don't enjoy it, it isn't funny and frankly MR, you seem to be in the minority, read above.

Like one old time trainer said on here and has said to some mutual friends (heard and read you liked him MR?) at any rate he said some people just don't like those people who are in the game and come on here and write.

Call it tilting at windmills but certain people on here overstep the bounds of decency and trash other people in an extremely unkind way. It's fine to differ, even get a little heated I'm guilty of that, being passionate about racing but the name calling and disrespect of posters and horses just seems to take the fun out of it.

I was on call. Only got to watch the tail end of it. Didn't get to go to the races and I'll never post my picks. I've explained it over and over.

No Mike, never claimed to be an expert in that field.

However, I do know that you have challenged a couple of trainers, several owners a person who was a track super or at the very least related to one.

Actually Mike I believe that you told many on here when you were fighting with Wanda that you OWN race horses.

Like I said talk amongst yourselves, you all are the experts.

While I think Sea The Stars is formidable, any horse can lose a race at any time. Nothing is a given. So while I expect him to won if he shows up in the BCC, because he is one incredible horse, nothing is a given. New surface, new kind of race, hotter, new competition, jetting across the ocean etc. etc. Plus he has been running in Grade 1's out the whazoo and winning. I bet he is due for a good long rest right about now.

Paula, STS already has lost his coat, so I bet he doesn't come. It has been a long season for him. Wouldn't it be great, though, if they brought him back at 4?

Mike ! You have challenged some trainers and owners ? Oh my goodness how could you ? Lol. wow. I honestly can't stop laughing.  There are PLENTY of owners and trainers that NEED to be "challenged." Maybe Tim is not familiar with another sport called FOOTBALL where owners and Coaches (aka) trainers are challenged after EVERY SINGLE GAME !  Is it wrong for someone to question Todd Pletcher about his horrible record in Triple Crown Races or in G1 races in NY ?  Is it wrong to question what a trainer that gets many of the best horses each year and can't get them in the winner circle in Triple Crown races?  Has he ever had a colt win a Triple Crown Race ?  If you want to win a Triple Crown race why would you give a good young horse to him?  Would you hire a football coach who had a record of 1 win 40 losses?

To littlebirdstillgotwings:  it's free to nominate a horse to the Oklahoma Derby.  I read that MTB's owners are friends with the Oklahoma track owner so I assume that's why he was nominated (maybe to get the track a little free publicity?).  But all reports say that MTB is still racing in the Goodwood at Santa Anita and not the Oklahoma Derby.  

Personally I would love it if MTB ran in Oklahoma.  My son lives in Oklahoma City and we're visiting him that weekend.   Would be great to hit the track and see MTB race in person.  

TIM G & RACINGFAN,

The American HOTY title becomes cheapened and lacking in lustre when it denies any superior thoroughbred that accolade which has not only beaten the best that America has to offer on american soil but has trounced the opposition consistently wherever he/she has campaigned, putting on a show for the world of racing fans.  

If Sea The Stars comes to the Breeder's Cup Classic and conquers, his lone race in America should be put in the context of his overall campaign within the international racing community/global racing village.  Let his accomplishments be stacked against Rachel Alexandra's and let the chips fall where the will. Participation or non-partication in the Breeder's Cup should have some consequences for heaven's sake!!!  

Everyone is fully aware of the vagaries of the Pro-ride surface but sportsmanship must be upheld and taken into consideration when the ballots are being counted IMO.

BTW TIM G, you are way off track to mention Zenyatta's campaign in support of your argument for a points system to determine the HOTY.  Zenyatta's terribly disappointing path has nothing to do with politics.  Her connections have been overly tactical and timid and when it seemed clear that Rachel was winning the tactical battle with a far more enterprising and successful campaign they now appear to be giving the impression of disinterest in the HOTY title.  It plain for all to see but Zenyatta is still an awesome mare IMO.

TIM G

Look if you desire to bring Wanda into the equation that's fine. Wanda knows more than I ever will,unlike some I can put my ego in check to admit it. But,the problem w/ her is sometimes she thinks she resides on her own planet. That's not right!

SHAWN P

I'm not "one of those who only come on here to write". I recall you stating recently about your family background of med. experts. Hate to burst your bubble.but my mom was also a doctor in Miami,where I'm org. from. You've never seen me slam any horse on this blog or any others'. Prove I'm wrong!

DRAYNAY

I agree w/ you on STS. I do think he's something special,but still buy into what you said regarding him coming here.

SHAWN P

DRAY is DRAY,but I can say without a doubt he knows alot regarding racing. He's an individual that doesn't shy away from risk taking,alot like myself in that respect. Even though him and I disagree from time to time,I really respected what he said over a month ago about MTB. It illustrated class. People like to "pile on". Many on here,on their best day don't scratch the surface regarding his knowledge!

Footlick

Glad to see you defend Zenyatta....right now she is IT for me.  It would be interesting to see if she could perform as well on grass as synthetics....Of the top American runners I think she is the only one with the kind of kick that would do well against top Euro horses, and with her almost arrogant 'refuse to lose' attitude she would do a lot better than many people think.....Could she beat Sea The Stars?....I don't know, but if she addapted well to turf she would certainly give him a test, probably the toughest test of his career (afer his first race loss).

Hey guys and gals:

It's Monday morning.....a whole new week to let the BATTLES RAGE.....I see we have plenty of ammunition now that the undisputed QUEEN of racing in N/A, Zenyatta is racing this weekend.

Shawn P

I can honestly say that I have never heard Mike Relva slam a horse.....if there is one person on here that has an honest feeling for all horses it's MIke.....

I just want to know why the ARC was not on TVG yesterday in Louisville? All that was on was replay shows and the Lava Man special and I missed the race on t.v. PISSSED.

Rachel Alexandra had the most difficult campaign of any 3 year old filly in decades. I am stunned by some people's comments that her campaign was 'cherry picked'. I would would challenge those people to train a horse to those 'easy' wins themselves.

Unfortunately 'cherry picked' is a very good word for Zenyatta's campaign this year. Lacking in quantity and quality would be another. Rachel Alexandra should be horse of the year. There should also be a category for a horse like Sea the Stars (or Goldikova) that could come over from Europe and win a major BC race impressively.

What rock have you been hiding under littlebirdstillgotwings???  RA connections cherry picking races for best advantage?  Oh that's right, I get it - 3-year old fillies win the Preakness, Haskell and Woodward all the time.  Every year they go undefeated in 8 races at 7 different tracks.  Every year they win the Oaks by 20 lengths, beat the Derby and Belmont winners, older males, etc. etc.  

I agree that it would be great for Sea the Stars to come to the BC.  But Rachel isn't coming, so get over it - she's done a lot this year, and you should be able to recognize that.  If you want to see a better example of cherry-picking races for best advantage, I refer you to Zenyatta's PP's for 2009 (with all due respect to the great mare, as it's not her fault that her connections aren't running her much).

Well regardless of HOY vote the world knows who the best horse in the world is now -Sea the Stars win was awesome in a field that big and the mile and a half distance. Hope he does come to the classic. He did run against the best in Europe and 6 grade 1 's is very impressive. Zen hasn't even run against the boys once yet they want her to be HOY -phony , RA quiting and avoiding the best horses in the cup -phony.Prove your the best against the best at a mile and a quarter -a distance her owners have avoided, anything less is a popularity contest and sure she or Zen  wouldn't beat Sea the Stars case closed.Come on since when is a true champion crowned when avoding the best competition.Not in sprots you have to earn it against the best .What do you think Sea the Stars will be worth syndicated $$$$$$!

DRAYNAY,

Go easy on Todd Pletcher Bro.  Next year could be his Kentucky Derby breakthrough year if he manages this Giant's Causeway colt called ESKENDEREYA properly.  The colt looks very talented and the pedigree of his female tail line has the ingredients to produce a Triple crown horse that can go all the way through to the Belmont.  Let's watch and see and hope for his soundness to hold up.  

One of the best aspects of these horse racing web logs is the intelligence brought by so many who care about horses and the industry.

However, one of the worst aspects is that I am, too often, reminded of the sophmoric bickering I see at the KC Star on their sports blogs about the Griefs or Mizzou and my beloved Jayhawkers.  Please, stop the personal attacks.  More insightful comments and less sniping at others, please.

I didn't mean Mike slams horses. We all know who does it. Just sometimes if you mention his name it causes issues....... Mike, my comment about you being in the minority was the fact that you jumped on your new friend's bandwagon. HE is the guy who several others said things about and who Jason himself took to task on here. Seems like most of those were just agreeing with Jason.

I'm not sure how knowledgeable someone is or proclaims to be from 'reading', following or going to the races, it's just not the same as actually living through it day to day. I know for a fact that certain people on here know far more than you guys can imagine. They don't just 'read' or talk about it, they have lived it for years.

Like the guy Kevin who mentioned his friends losing their horse and many others as well.

Frankly, I thought better of you.

First who the heck is he to question Todd Pletcher and WHO gives him horses? Not that Todd cares one iota but lets see DN do any better. No Todd hasn't won a TC race with a colt, but he did so with a FILLY. How many trainers have actually WON TC races anyway? Especially the Derby? Plus it's not HIS call anyway. NO SANE owner would listen to someone like DN. Question why give Todd a horse? Well maybe total purses won with less than HALF the numbers of Asmussen for starters?

While this is a comment section for opinions. There are SOME opinions that are based in practical experience.

By the way Mike what does my statement that my Dad is a Dr have to do with anything you said? That was in relation to medication and their effects. What I have learned from him about it.

However, you and Draynay who WAS the  person I WAS speaking about and who is the ONE who DOES slam horses, might want to step back a bit. That whole exchange by you both was pretty sad. A poor attempt at slam board speak. Personally I don't think it has a place on here and from reading some of the other comment sections particularly that of Mr. Haskin's I think a lot agree, including Steve himself.

I've seen several of the people you have questioned post very positive information also some very detailed and informative comments.

Just go back and COUNT the number of people that he threw insults at on here. THAT is why several of us are tired of him.

I don't care what 'HE' posted about MTB, it all comes off as totally insincere due to his repeated attacks on the poor animal.

My reference to writing on the blog was about the old trainer who

said a 'few' people on this blog comment section don't WANT those in the game to come on to this blog and write comments.

I don't know if you're misinterpreting intentionally, I hope not. I just don't think I'd be so agreeable with a guy who drags outside political references onto a horse racing board, has been banned from many boards, is a professional board commenter and frankly, from what I've read on various boards is the biggest know it all on the planet.

WOW,  Gone for a couple of days and this Blog has gone from being on topic to every other direction, Pretty Funny...

What a great and sad weekend for racing, First, A huge Congrats to the best horse on the planet, Sea the Stars!  What an amazing turn of foot he has, He seems to win with no effort!  His campaign for the year is over(IMO), Nothing to gain in the Breeder's after his long amazing year...

Congrats to Yeats on a gallant effort in his last race, His eight year old legs just couldn't hold off those younger legs coming at him. Hope he enjoys his well deserved retirement, He earned it!!!

A Huge Congrats to Mr. Tim Ice and Summer Bird, This guy just keeps getting better with every race, Hands down, The three year old Champion of the year...

Also, I know there are Owners, Trainers, Historians, Fans that come on this great blog, I want everyone who loves this sport to PLEASE look at this E-Bay page, It has alot of great items from this sport, The Biggest item?  It is a Halter worn by the GREAT "John Henry", It is a very rare piece and I would love if it garnered a High Bid(It deserves one!).  She also has A halter worn by Giacomo and other items.  She runs a Rescue and just lost one of her seniors, Shifter, a wonderful Thoroughbred gelding, She needs the funds to pay for his surgery prior to him passing. It would be great if everyone here would at least take a look, Thank you very much for letting me post this here Jason...

"John Henry" Halter E-Bay Link:

cgi.ebay.com/Halter-worn-by-Famous-Thoroughbred-John-Henry-with-CofA_W0QQitemZ330365163549QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_SM_Fan_Shop

Lastly, While it was a great weekend of Racing, I would be amiss if I didn't mention the losses that occured...

R.I.P. Blackbriar

R.I.P. Pappy's Double H

I haven't received word on Naughty Cal and London Express who went down at Golden Gate...

A HUGE Thank You to Mr. Garrett Gomez for taking care of Grazen and possibly saving his life for his actions...

UGH!!!!

Had the right idea about the Pick 4 on Super Saturday at Belmont. If the rain could've only held off for another 30 minutes I think I would've hit. But it just got a little too deep for my single Fabulous Strike. Bummer. At least I rolled the P3 and got something back. Thanks Interpetation.

Wow that Sea the Stars is a beast. He was throwing his head about a good 1/4 mile into the race running up on horses heals and he still won with authority against a deep deep field. If they don't head towards the BC, I hope they keep him around for next year to give a go for the Dubai World Cup or the BC Classic on dirt. Could be the first horse to take down that deep trifecta!

Agree with Ranagulzion, Todd Pletcher could have his breakthrough in next year's Triple Crown with Eskendereya.  He broke his maiden in the one mile Pilgrim Stakes at Belmont (7+ length romp).  Turf race but it was moved to the main track because of bad weather.  I hope Pletcher keeps the colt on dirt now.  

His dam has produced two runners and both are black type.  Her sire was Seattle Slew.  The second damsire is Alydar.

The Phantom, very nice but your STS beats good turf horse good for him. Let's see him step on dirt and beat G2 type dirt horses!  Lol. he wouldn't hit the board !  If he really is that good have him take on GIO until then he is a European winner good for him.  Ranagulzion, I am not trying to pick on Pletcher but if he was a football coach he would have been fired long ago.  I wouldn't give a job to someone who is 1 for 44.

Lol... yes I was wrong about many things today but I was not wrong about Summer Bird.  He caught a lucky break getting that rain an hour before the race

Draynay 03 Oct 2009 9:42 PM

In fact nay nay you were dead wrong even on the off track!! Take a lookie see what you spouted in an earlier post.

Summer Bird will not be a factor.  If its a off track bet the house on Macho Again.

Draynay 02 Oct 2009 12:35 PM

nay nay you just can't lie when the facts show you were dead wrong and no it wasn't a "lucky break" that made you wrong. You spouted off that SB would be a non factor including on an off track where you said to bet the house on Macho Again. The facts show you were against SB even on an off track. To try and claim you weren't wrong because he won on an off track where you gave him no chance to begin with is typical of you. I'd bet the house your eyes are brown cause you are so full of crap.

I think Sea the Stars is the best horse, male or female, on the planet this year. But unfortunately, I doubt we'll see him at the Breeder's Cup. And the only hope we have of seeing him next year is that his owner already has a lot of money so maybe he will keep running him for the sport of it. That's a very slim hope, his trainer said he probably won't be racing next year. It would be awesome to see him in Dubai or, even better, a match race with RA, Zenyatta and Sea the Stars. I'd better wake up now. Anyway, has any other horse won that much money in their 3 yr. old year? Has any other horse won as many Group (Grade) I's in their 3 yr. old year?

Wow Rock, you and anyone else who had Interpatation, congratulations.

That was a great pick!

I know they said Gio likes the soft going but apparently your horse was able to skip over that sponge. Doesn't it feel great to hit one of those longshots? Yippee!

I agree on Sea The Stars! Gosh I sure wish we could see him here in the U.S.  If not this year then maybe his owner will bring him back.

Can you imagine being 28 and having a horse like that? A once in a lifetime horse, when you're that young? Bet he has chances at more than just one though.

Then watching Careless Jewel, what a fun filly to watch run. Sort of like a really talented 6 year old playing baseball, looking at everything, being a goof but having so much talent you can see it oozing out.

Greg, HUSH!!!! Don't mention buying stuff on EBay, my mom will have to restrain my Dad. He and I are both major memorabilia collectors and he has had his life threatened if she sees one more 'purchase'. I can get away with it but he's already taken enough hits for a while.

Agree on Tim Ice, what a super nice guy. He and the Docs are all really nice people. I laughed at Dr.J when he said he took out his trainers license then fired himself because he was so bad at it.  Not as easy as some people THINK, is it?

Sea Of Stars: Best horse in the world bar none!!

Riddle me this: What do Music Note, Zenyatta, and Careless Jewel have in common?

Answer: They all would whip RA at Santa Anita if her connections had the kahonas to show up.

Ra's victory over Macho Again lost some luster when he got whipped by SB on a surface he clearly loves.

What RA has accomplished this year is remarkable but in reality the 3 fillies named above are better than any she has beaten all year. Ra's connections have proven to be very smart in racking up an impressive list of wins while keeping her away from those who would beat her. Most horsemen point to the Breeders Cup all year. Ra's connections (since they bought her) orchestrated her year to avoid it. Enter a weak Preakness but skip the more trying Belmont,etc. Not a bad plan to win HOY. Duck the best when they are at their best and enter races that look good on a resume even though they don't produce the best competition. RA will likely win HOY and while never facing the best out there. I call that a shame. HOY with an asterisk.

The Phantom, I agree, Sea The Stars is awesome (too bad his dam died at such an old age from foaling complications) but OUR HOY is for OUR best horse, the way it should be...now if he comes here and races a few times...wow!

Absolutely not Sea The Stars for our HOY...good grief. It's bad enough Dubai winnings count for supposed North American earnings, never mind a horse who races one time get HOY in USA...he'll get all the awards he's deservedly earned in Europe, where he'll also stand at stud.

Misremembered won Sat in Indiana, made a big move and it was enough....got 5-2, just like the 5-2 on I Want Revenge, (or was it 3-1) when HE went East---Beyers are just not "there" on the synthetics, Misremembered's Beyers were equal or better than his Indiana Derby opponents Sat, which made him a standout based on the "fact" that the Beyers are low for synthetic races---case in point---Zenyatta's Beyers are low, when you consider she'd be FAVORED over any horse but Sea The Stars in the Classic--including Summer Bird, Gio Ponti, Einstein, Rail Trip, and even Rachel Alexandra, so in that respect the Beyers are bogus, and that doesn't happen on dirt at the big tracks---as if Del Mar has become Portland Meadows, but the horses are still there and they're still good....

Sea The Stars will rum in the BC Classic or else thats all she wrote--I REFUSE to call a one season horse "all-time" anything, I will remind you secretariat was HOY at TWO as well as three---MUCH more respect for horses like Goldikova, and Zenyatta, and Curlin, and hopefully Rachel Alexandra---I want to see great for two seasons because I've been spoiled by the real thing! US has more "racing heart' than the economic minded Euro Racing---those 1/2 great horses over there, early-retired while brilliant---never allowed to become household names, shame!

Dray, such acrimoniousness and animadversion to my misspelling a single word!

Good catch, though.

I'll try to stick to using the vernacular, instead of endeavoring to embellish my posts with grandiloquence.

I made the Draynay hit list...he NOTICED ME!!!

Rachel A. (for real)

This may not be the most appropriate blog for this oomment but then again it is BC Chat, right?  Am I seeing the ESPN schedule correctly????    October 10 BC Challenge was supposed to be on ESPN but is now on ESPN Classic only??     What is going on here?

POOR QUALITY ROAD-only good for cheap BC dirt mile

DRAYNAY

Well said!

OK, one REALLY silly comment: "until he (Sea the Stars) wins something on dirt against G1 competition I am not all that impressed" (who else: Draynay on 4Oct09 at 10:25p.m.)

Want an equally dumb counter-argument? Here it is: " until she (RA) wins something on turf against G1 competition..."

Draynay: can you see the goofiness of either comment?

Maybe not.  Too much to hope for.

On another note: it'll be really sad if they retire STS and RA and Zenyatta all this year.  

Gee Shawn P sounds like you need a hug.  Mike doesn't agree with me all the time and I think you are missing the point of his post.  He is asking you to take a new approach.  

Who the heck am I to question Mr. Pletcher ?  Well, why can't I make an obvious comment ?  Isn't 1 for 44 above and beyond bad luck ? Secondly, isn't this a forum to discuss such things?  Few have any problem with calling jockey's out for a bad ride but you can't call out a trainer for bad training ? Silly.

Quality Road Does not like mud or his jockey

IF his trainer said the horse liked the mud then he's stupid

Quality road is still a much better horse than Summer Bird

schabelli, are you short?  I just want you to know I had nothing to do with it so chill.  da3hoss ! lol. best post of the day. Mike Relva thanks Mike !

mz turf racing is turf racing those who dare say STS is a better horse than RA are nuts.  STS couldn't come close to her on dirt.  STS is the second best turf horse around.  Until he beats GIO I am backing him !  Who cares if he beat some Euro's, come here and do it.  Real racing is in the USA. Been all over Europe and have learned they do NOTHING better than we do.  USA USA USA.

Karen in Indiana, good post.

Gee Dray, sounds like a weird comment coming from a 50 year old dude to a 21 year old guy. But trust me I have a girlfriend to hug me, my Mom, brothers and even my Dad. Who, by the way? You couldn't carry the pot for him to....well never mind.

I don't know what approach Mike's asking me to take, support you? He** no. You guys came off as the totally negative ones with your childish comments to more than one person, especially you.

Maybe YOU need to take a different approach instead of your look at me I'm a tough guy.

I don't think I or anyone else who has issues with you bashing horses have called out a jockey or questioned a trainers win %. We may have been disgusted with the numerous violations and the smarta** attitude of one or two, but that's right up your alley.

WHO ARE YOU? To Todd? A big nobody, one of the hecklers that make jerks out of themselves every day. First he'd have to KNOW that you exist or care. Another NO response there.

I'll bet you whatever you want that he laughs all the way to the bank with his 15-17 million in purses every year.

You know it's bad training? Some trainers don't even HAVE 44 stakes starts in their careers. He broke Wayne's record for stakes wins and well, why am I even arguing with someone who would slobber all over himself if Todd, Wayne or any of the other guys even said hello.

Note to self, stop trying to discuss this like Dray is a rational human being, check that a HUMAN BEING PERIOD.

Shawn P,

I didn't exactly pick Interpertation as my pick as I just did an "all" in that race, but just felt like as a value play, why not try to beat the fave at something he's doing for the first time, you know? And when that rain came down, I thought it was more and more likely he'd get beat. He ran a hell of a race though, he just got outstayed is all. If the turf course was in the same condition and they ran that race at 10 or 11f's, Gio wins for fun.

Hey BoJangles. Remember the Haskell? Where Rachel Beat Summerbird by 6 legnths?? You can speculate all you want about who would win what, but when you have a filly going to all differnt tracks, setting track records and beating anyone in front of her, compared to Music Note(3 races), Zenyatta (3 Races) and Careless Jewel (3 races), your argument is terrible. Everything I see shows that R/A is faster, can race in any condition, and can lead, rate, or take back. If they were ducking the best, R/A would of been in the Beldame racing against girls.

Karen in Indiana:  I think Deep Impact and maybe TM Opera O earned more in their 3YO seasons (both are Japanese and they have hefty purses).  Don't know about the G1s.

Mr. BoJangles:  I don't think RA's Woodward victory lost any luster.  Macho Again isn't a 10 furlong horse.  His dad never won at 10 furlongs and Macho Again has always done poorly past 9.5 furlongs.  His best distance is 9 panels, so she beat him at his best.  

Congrats to Summer Bird - he was wonderful and it has really been a joy to watch him improve with every race.  He has developed into a formidable racehorse.  Watching Sea the Stars win the Arc was just awesome!  He is incredible - I would love to see him at the Breeders Cup.  The better the horses, the better the competition the better for racing.  I admit to being disappointed in Macho Again but I still love to watch him and will as long as he runs.  

LDP, you have written some spot on comments here and your blog was uplifting.  I sure enjoyed it.

My deepest sympathy to those who broke down this weekend - only those who love horses know the depth of suffering it brings.

DRAYNAY

You nailed it on Pletcher. He would have been gone long ago if he were coaching NFL. BTW I don't care for him anyway.

THE PHANTOM

Yes,STS is something very special. But,you are living in a dream world if you think for one sec. RA or Zenyatta couldn't beat him.

I am back from my vacation, and to save this blog from obscurity as it has not reached 500 comments since I have left.

Mr. Nay glad you are back yourself.

So Sea The Stars, the horse of the world like I said many times.  Da Re Mi and Stacelita proved to be the best two fillies in the world with their courageous effort in the Arc.  THe question is will the champ go to the Breeders Cup, I say John Oxx get your out of your behind, and just send the horse over, the horse has nothing else to prove yes, he is the best horse in thwe world since Mill Reef or the American Secretariat who we are very fond of out here.  His feat was monumental, but to leave little doubt he should go to America and save the Breeders Cup for the industry's sake.  If the horse is in good health there is no reason to hold back, unless there are 100 million reasons then maybe kiss the idea goodbye.  Conduit will aim to repeat in the turf, as Da Re Mi will win the Filly Turf.  Goldikova got a little hiccup but she is better at a mile and will romp there again.  Mastercraftsman will probably win the Classic by 5 lengths if Sea the Stars does not show up as I see no horse in America that can go with him or Rip Van Winkle.  But the for the salvation of this years Breeders Cup and to bring excitement back to the sport on a worldwide level, what better way than to end a legendary and brief career with a win in the Breeders Cup Classic, after already winning the Arc, The Ieish Champions, Eclipse, Juddmonte, The Derby, THe Guineas.  A feat no other horse has done before, and if he adds the Classic, a feat that will probably take forever to duplicate.  Its a horse like Sea the Stars that racing needs at this very moment.  So Breeders Cup, dont be cheap, raise the prize up to 10 Million, do all you can to bring the best horse of the last 35 years to your most prized race, in the end the price is cheap as the whole world will be watching.

I've been gone a few days and come back to find all the same kids are still arguing, about the same stuff.  I'm glad I haven't missed much! Hey, I'm planning on a trip to the BC races at Churchill next year - anyone else going? I think we should all meet up and have a party!

I did record a massive amount of racing this past weekend.  Is it just me, or has it done nothing but rain in NY all summer?!

I think Gio Ponti ran a good race, just got tired and beat by someone who relishes the going and the distance (Good call Kevin!).  I look forward to seeing where he runs on BC day. Turf or Classic?  Sounds like it will be the Classic.

Careless Jewel, I love this wild and crazy filly don't you? She is raw talent! I have a gray horse, so I'm partial to them anyways.  Which is why I was disappointed one of my favorite grays didn't show up Saturday - Macho Again.  But I've been betting Summer Bird since the Belmont and probably wouldn't have stopped now.

I was most impressed by the juvenile filly winner at Oak Tree, Blind Luck.  Obviously she's a legit contender for the BC filly. I also liked Lookin at Lucky the way he was just playing around when he got to the lead. Lead? Ears up! Oh I'm still supposed to run? OK, ears down.  Wait, we're almost home...ears up!  

Oh man, my boy Fabulous Strike got run down by Kowboy.  Bummer.  But another of my favorites, Awesome Gem finally got to be the bride.  Chances are he won't do that again anytime soon, but I still love him.

I managed to wake up in time to see the HRTV coverage of the Arc.  Man, I hate the way they film those races.  All the horses looked the same at that angle! LOL.  I didn't realize STS even came through horses until he was clear of them.  He was really, really rank in the early part of the race when he was boxed in.  The fact that he still ran them down was impressive.  I'd like to see him run here, but I think he'd take our best and run them into the ground.  Raven's Pass did it last year and he wasn't as good as STS is.

Have a great week everybody!

If Zenyatta meets See The Stars and closes on him in the stretch for 2nd---that will be equal to Glorious song against Spectacular Bid in the 80 Haskell, then for older horses....Zenyatta needs to try....Cascapedia, Ruffian, Winning Colors and Rachel are fillies I have felt should try males..also Susan's Girl, AND Amazon sized fillies like Cascapedia/Winning Colors are 'no-brainers"....But If I EVER saw a filly who should try males, it's Zenyatta--I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed for Big Z & co....I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a grande finale to one of if not the strongest racing season, top to bottom, coast to coast and worldwide, the greatest season of them all....

Bummed to read that Jung Man Scott and John Scott both sustained condylar fractures during the Norfolk. Enough already of this synthetic track business. It is just not any safer than dirt in my opinion.

Thanks Laz.  Actually, she has turf all through her pedigree so I would be surprised if she could not run over it.  It would be nice if they kept her in training for next year and turfed her.  I think she would be formidable in Europe.  She can run their style and can kick equally with them.  Don't know if she could beat Sea the Stars, and I hope they don't send him over as he has run in top class competition all year and deserves a break after winning the Arc, but I think she could challenge him in the stretch and he would know he ws in a horse race.  She just starts eating up ground and gets faster as the stretch goes on.  And she likes to lag back, which wouldn't hurt her in Europe.  I know her connections said that it would depend on what Europeans came here for the classic as to whether she would run or not.  So it seems that it didn't matter to them which Americans ran.  Hopefully she runs in the classic.  

Summer Bird locked up 3yo Champion Colt this year with his performance in the JCGC.  He's done something that hasn't been done in 20 years, winning the Belmont Stakes, the Travers and the Jockey Club Gold Cup and by running second to Rachel Alexandra in the Haskell.  If Quality Road hadn't had to take so much time off or if I Want Revenge hadn't been injured and off for so long, maybe one of them could've challenged it, but right now, there is no 3yo colt better than Summer Bird.  The fact that Macho Again was so close to Rachel in the Woodward tells me exactly how tired Rachel was, considering how poorly Macho Again really did run Saturday.  I also think that after the Goodwood, Mine That Bird will show us (hopefully convincing everyone else) that he really was just a lucky winner at the Kentucky Derby and that he didn't win it because of talent, but because the track suited him, the more talented horses were either injured and scratched, had bad trips in the Derby or came away from the race injured, as well as he had the best jockey for the day on his back.  Mine That Bird is a good horse, but he's far from great.  He is not a stakes horse, not at heart.  The fact he has only won one race all season tells me that he has no business running in stakes races and really no business running at the Breeders Cup next month.  He has the heart, but not the talent.

As for Quality Road at the Breeders Cup, I don't think the Classic is the right race for him.  I don't think he gets the distance well.  I think he's closer to being a sprinter than a distance horse.  He'd do better in the mile.

I would LOVE to see Goldikova go into the BC Ladies Classic and beat Zenyatta!  Although, I think going forward, Music Note will be the victor in that race and beat Zenyatta there.  I don't see Zenyatta at this point in her career taking the risk of taking on the boys.  That's riskier than anything that the Mosses or her connections have done with her ever and with no chance at HOTY, why not put her in the Ladies Classic and try to lock up older mare?

SHAWN P

Look,we've all came down on individuals on this blog. I'm making the case that DRAYNAY has lots to offer w/his posts. Just cause I don't always agree w/someone doesn't mean they have nothing to contribute. Many are "in love with their own voice" actually thinking the sea parts for them. DRAYNAY isn't forcing anyone to read his posts and it's my opinion he writes what he truly believes.

Tiznowbaby, it sure would be great to see Sea The Stars run again at 4, but the British Press seem to think he is going to be retired. I can only dream. But I do think it's too soon to see him compared to Secretariat, Man O'War and Citation. However, if he had the same kind of year next year, as this year, I would be a believer and put him up there with the immortals. He is one truly great horse (the three immortals are in a class by themselves) and beautiful in the bargain. I love the fact that he is Irish bred and trained.

You know, I don't think anyone should be putting any horse down for a campaign that was determined by their human owners and trainers. Let's speak a little more respectfully about these magnificent and amazing horses i.e. Rachel Alexandra, Zenyatta, Summer Bird, Sea The Stars, and Mine That Bird. We owe them that at the very least. As for Todd Pletcher, he has forgotten more than I will EVER know about horses and horse racing. That's good enough for me.

I cannot believe some of the things being said about Rachel Alexandra and how her races were"cherry picked" and she has never beat anything.  She has raced against males 3 times, all grade 1's and won.  She won the Preakness, one of our Classic races, she raced on 7 tracks this year, she has won 8 straight.  Who else has done that?  How many horses have won 8 straight?  It's because she's raced against the worst horses in the US?????  Give me a break!  She has raced in what, 5 grade 1's and won??? She beat the Derby winner and the Belmont winner who is now the top 3 year old maie. Hasn't she done enough?  Everyone wanted her to race the JCGC, then the classic.  The races she has won are not exactly claiming races.

Mr. Jackson does not like synthetics, he has every right to choose where she will run.  It's so damn easy to sit and criticize these horses, and say all these other horses are better but you have no idea of that.  You think they haved ducked Zenyatta?  You know this for a fact?  No you don't.  This is surmized by people who just don't care for RA or for her connections.  Give it a rest. Why can't you see that she is a very special horse and we should all be glad to have seen what she has done this year?  I don't understand people who can't give credit where it is due.

i dont think we have seen the best of quality road yet. summer bird has an advantage only because of the rain. he is a good horse yes but i dont think he will win the classic.. travers and gold cup.. he won becuase it was raining. mine that bird is the better bird. and give quality a dry track and ull see his fullpotential. and for those of u knocking quality... summer bird has been racing all year and quality hasnt. i stand by my horse and my choice if quality comes to sant anita he will win the classic.

ANNEM

Say what you will regarding Zenyatta,but Steve Haskin wrote an interesting article on her last week and he seems to think she's something special. BTW he gets paid for his opinions. Enough said!

Macho Again ran the best race of his career in the Woodward (and a good one in the SF).  He was due a "bounce" which he clearly had.  And it may be that he never runs back to that form, time will tell, he's not been the most consistent of performers but he's gotten better.

FOUR breakdowns this weekend at Santa Anita. . . . . if I was contemplating bringing the arguably best horse in the world over. . . . heck, value really has nothing to do with it.

Are you feeling lucky?

Steve S,

Come on man, I hope that was a burn towards dray, but if not then dont down QR, HE WAS SIRED BY A MILER, but he does has some "quality" stamina on the bottom. (which i am sure you are sure you know)  He has already proven that he can get the classic distance but is best at less than 1 1/4.  A mile and an eight or less and he IS a monster, and there is nothing wrong with running in the cheaper dirt mile.  Which i dont think he will run in anyway.  Put him on dirt at a mile and he would give you know who a run for her money and might even beat her at 1 1/8.  I guess what im trying to say is dont down a great horse just because you dont care for him (im not a QR lover),unless of cousre that was aimed at dray.  

On a side note, Go ZEN and MTB this weekend!  I really hope ZEN goes in the classic.          Anyone know about that rumor of keeping her in training til feb or march.

Mike- I was glad he wrote that article, because that's what I've been saying about her races.  She's carried weight and given away weight, she's closed on slow paces and has won every time she ran.  I still would put her up against anybody.  I've learned that I can't say anything negative about RA without getting slammed, but it seems they can slam Zenyatta as much as they want and its ok.  BTW, I know they were Europeans, but I would put Zarkava's and Goldikova's seasons up against Rachel's anytime.

Mike, I haven't seen anyone, in particular the guy you tried to hammer who have posted ANYTHING nearing the slams you two did. Singling out people for disagreeing with Dray and then saying that 'we' all have come down on people? Not the way he does ALL the time and not the personal attacks you two made.

Hey, maybe have you thought that when some guys say something with so much certainty that they actually KNOW what they're talking about? KNOW the people personally that are being spoken about or the horses? That's usually why I get so irritated. People who DON'T know people talking about the guys and putting them down?

You were told YOU didn't have to read certain posts but that didn't stop you from coming off like someone who seems jealous of what and who some people know.

You know some people in racing, but I guarantee you that Dray knows NONE of these people, hasn't even read what they say, been to their barns, NOTHING.

I just get irritated when people trash others they know nothing about.

Never once have I seen Dray ASK others something, or compliment someone with sincerity. I can definitely say I've seen some of the ones he loves to trash do JUST that.

On Todd? You don't like him, do you know him?

On your comment about Steve H? Remember what he said to your new little friend? Think back and also know that he said he wasn't putting up with THAT guy ruining the blog.

jedinite,

    You seem to conviently forget that Summer Bird won beating MTB on a dry track. You also seem to forget that the only win this year the MTB has had was on a very wet sticky track. Also, did you forget that SB is only in his first year of racing? QR is in his second and so is MTB. It is not normal for a horse to do what he has done, against the horses he is facing. QR was prepped and ready for the JCGC, the mud did not hinder him in the least, if it did then why did he finish at least five lengths better than Tizway, at least. The Travers, he was not ready for, but even then Pletcher had said it was because of him not being prepared, and the mud was not the issue. He has fractions as soft as angle cake for god sakes. He and SB both had perfect rides, both were given EVERY oppertunity to win, but it was SB with the superior stamina that pulled off the win. You would think that ppl would admire what horses like STS, RA, and SB have done, instead of constantly trashing them. Well whatever keep trashing them, keep putting down their accomplishment, i'm sure it's a great way to attract new fans, not.

Also? I personally enjoy hearing the different stories, points of views from people like Wanda, Atthebarn, steve from SL etc. People who are IN or have been in the game or very much on the inside. One by one they've been run off the board by people who think they know more. Count one more in that, somebody who KNOWS these people and MAY even have a pct in some horses you guys like a LOT.

Shawn P you're a puppy ? Sorry, I didn't know.  It's bed time for you young fella.

TO: Sherpa-Lazmannick-Thomas

(And Jason)

Thank you for good vibes/thoughts.

Yes Mercy ran a very good race on Sunday. The Stable and Trainer (David Prine) needed that race after Saturday's horror with Pappy (Birdbrain).

When an outfit is smaller in scale there is more emotion involved. It is not about value or money, it is about love. So, along with you, I am happy for my friends, David and all at Pucker Ridge. The main thing was to race on Sunday after Saturday's tragedy and have a safe race. The fact that Mercy ran well was an added bonus.

Not to tout, but, a while back Bloodhorse had a HRTV Video on David. He is a pretty amazing guy. He has only been training for fourteen months, but later in life he is now trying what he loves, working with horses. Google his name you will see what I mean.

Anyway thank you all again, your good vibes were felt when needed.

Kevin        

I'll be here for it but not sure you sound like a party partner Runfast.

Although probably better than some who have 'threatened' to come to Keeneland for opening day. Which I'll believe when I see it with my own two eyes.

I dont think STS will make the trip. The classic looks like it could go to Rip Van Winkle. Murtagh rates him as one of the best he has ever ridden. He was unlucky to come up against STS. Plus he has his problems off the track. I think O'Brien is due a couple of winners at the BC. Some of you guys might know btter, but I think O'Brien has had about 5 or 6 second place finishes at the BC since High Chapparal /Johannesburg days. Rip is definitely better than Henry the Navigator.

Latst classic betting

STS  4/6

Rip  7/2

Summer Bird 6 /1

Zenyatta  6/1

The British and Irish bookies prices of 6/1 on Summer Bird looks attractive though

SHAWN P

You seem to harbor almost hatred for DRAYNAY. I don't see you going after EURO and STEVE S. Why not? I'm not giving them a "free pass". You talk about bashing/slamming,look what you are doing! I'm thirty nine and can tell you for certain,I wouldn't wanna be your age again. Grow up!

A quote from Santa Anita president Ron Charles after Cal Cup Classic.  In the Classic itself Grazen sufered a bowed tendon and Blackbriar broke down, apparently the second horse to be euthanized in the first week of the Oak Tree at Santa Anita meeting, a subject of concern for the track's president Ron Charles.

"We went five months, and 14,000 workouts without a fatality and then that happened," Charles said.

Is this true or is it just another load of bull?

For those knocking Summer Bird, who by the way received a 111 Beyer for his JCGC win, his Beyers have progressed in every race except the Kentucky Derby, a remarkable achievement for any horse.....(65 – 78 – 99 – 86 – 100 – 106 – 110 – 111)…..If they continue to progress that would mean that the winner of the BC Classic would have to run at least a 112 Beyer.....How many slated to enter have that potential?

MONICA V

What about the individuals that have bashed Zenyatta????

A horse that I hope makes the BC Sprint.....Hollywood Hit....He won the King Corrie stakes at Woodbine on the POLYTRACK in a track record 1.07.1 (21.4 - 43.3 - 55.2 - 1.07.1) by 5-1/2L for his fourth win in a row.....This 3 y-o gelding by Cactus Ridge is an Okla. bred and is a sprint monster.

EURO

Great timing coming back from your "vacation" after STS won,right? Sorry to to be the one to give bad news but this blog did fine in your absence. Yes,STS is truly great, but I think Zenyatta could make his world collapse in one frame!

SHAWN P

You mentioned to DRAYNAY that Todd "laughs all the way to the bank". I'll bet he cries like a little girl each time he blows the Derby! How many has he won? lol

Euro the Conquerer, I hate to start a mini-World War here but you can't mention Secretariat and Sea The Stars in the same sentence. At least not yet. Go to YOUTUBE and check out Secretariat's races. Ditto Citation's. Man O'War has only one race video on YOUTUBE but you can read about him. These three were in a class by themselves. Sea The Stars is a great horse in every sense of the word, but not quite in their league. I would love to see him run as a 4 year old and in the BCC and prove me wrong.  

Monica- I find it interesting that people are allowed to say whatever they want about Zenyatta, but you can't say a word against RA.  The most impressive three year old this year is undoubtably Sea the Stars.  He has won 6 gr 1's and has beaten much better fields than any other three year old this year.  Last year Zarkava beat Goldikova twice without getting warmed up, then won the Arc.  Goldikova went on a tear after getting out of Zarkava's shadow and ended winning the BC.  RA is a wonderful filly, but she has more to do if she's going to compare to either of there three.  But, of course, they don't count because they are European and turf- I forgot.

Dray- why don't we let RA and Quality Road and Summer Bird go to Europe and run against their Gr 2 turf horses and see where they finish?  It goes both ways.  You can't say because the horse is European they don't count.  Sea the Stars is the most accomplished 3 yr old on the planet.  That is the fact of the matter.  Period.  And I think he's a little better than "a good grass horse".

The most impressive BC Prep so far is Blind luck in the Oak Leaf--I think she'll finish no worse than 2nd in The Cup as she loves that track/has a big finish! It's just that kind of year where the two biggest names do not appear yet it still is strong....keep our fingers crossed the temp will be like today, 70 with a little breeze.....

All we are saying...is give peace a chance.  All we are saying... is give peace a chance...

Footlick, it seems you think a lot of these grass ponies.  Real horses run on dirt.  Let me see a Euro come over here and do something on dirt. Until they do give it a rest.  I have seen many go from dirt to turf not so many win Graded Stakes and then move on to dirt and win Graded Stakes.  If STS is all that come run over here on dirt. If not retire early and I guess we will NEVER know if he was truly a great horse.  Because if you fail to run as an older horse your career is an INCOMPLETE.  The horses that went on to be legends as older horses like Citation, The Bid, and Affirmed are three of the best because they PROVED it as older horses.

Boy, are my feelings hurt!

This weekend was more bitter than sweet for me. Of all of the horses racing the one I wanted to see most of all was Grazen.  He was my boy. I've bragged about him a few times. So sad.  But now he can live the life of a pampered stud. So that's ok.  But something has got to be done about these terrible tracks.  Too much is going wrong.

Riddle me this: Mr Bojangles.

You say Music Note, Careless Jewel, and Zenyatta would would whip Rachel Alexandra?

Riddle me this? What horse has as many wins this year as Music Note, Careless Jewel, and Zenyatta combined?

Rachel Alexandra.

You say that the connections are ducking good competition? A 3 year old filly that has ran in the Preakness against males, the Haskell against males, and the Woodward against older males all g1's and won all of them. Since when is it ducking competition for a three year old filly to run against the Kentucky Derby winner and win, the Belmont winner and win, and also win for the first time ever against older males in the Woodward. Not only is this not ducking competition it is the exact opposite. This is a 3 year old filly!

Now back to your three special horses who would whip her.

Music Note(2009)

First Race 5th by 10 1/4 lenghts

Second Race beat four horses

Third Race beat three horses all fillys.

Zenyatta.

3 for three and beat absolutely no won. And barely got up in last against an allowance quality horse and all fillys.

Careless Jewel

Three nice wins, small fields and little competition. All against fillys.

Rachel Alexandra

8 for 8 and everyone knows the rest.

There is no reason to bash either horse, meaning right now Zen and RA. The reason ppl are more incline to point a finger at Zenyatta, for those of you who keep bringing it up, is because she has done almost nothing this year. Has she carried weight, yes, but one time. Greater horses carried wieghts heavier and more often than she has ever thought. People give her accolades for coming up and winning her last because she had to face a slow pace, and was coming from about eight lengths back befor they entered the stretch. My take is that she does that all the time, and she has done that against a much better field than the one she faced last out, and won by much more. So i ask myself why should i be impressed when she does this all the time against better, yet barley got up to win. I am not saying it was a bad effort, it was fantastic, but not your typical dominating Zenyatta. Also, if you want cherry pick, her year so far has been the very definition of the word, running in three races, all in Cali, on two different tracks, and all against the same weak division of fillies and mares over and over.

Rachel Alexandra on the other hand has had, IMO, anything but a cherry picked campaign. Not many fillies come back off a 20 length win then beat the Derby winner in the Preakness. Not many fillies beat males then return successful in their next start, some don't even come back, let alone win by 19 lengths. After that, the season would've been great, and RA could've probably just taken on older mares for the rest of the year, but no, She runs in the Haskell, and wins it by six, only to return against older males in the Woodward, a race she took all the heat in, and still held on to win. She in her career has beat god knows how many "derby" winners, including the KY derby winner, she beat the Belmont winner, the Whitney winner, the Suberban winner, and the Stephen Foster winner. She has put togeather five consecutive grade ones, one in one of our Classics. She also has two back to back wins against colts, going from three year olds to older males. She's just done so much more.

There is no reason to bash anyhorse, but to nit pick at what RA has done this year just shows the contempt one has for her and her connections. To nit pick at Zen's career this year, is not unquestionable, seeing as how it is a fact that she this year hasn't really done anything of note.

Laz, It's true plus Jung Man Scott and John Scott both suffered Condylar fractures in the Norfolk at OSA that LatL won, both are out for quite awhile.

Matthew W,

Regarding Blind Luck....what a clever name, given her breeding. She looks like a nice horse.

SHAWN P

No,I don't know Todd P. and wouldn't want to. I can assure you that I'm not jealous of anyone at anytime. You feel free to make any comment you desire,I enjoy that right also. This is old cause I've explained,(which I don't have to explain a damn thing) regarding DRAYNAY. Just cause he and I have slammed one another doesn't mean I don't give someone credit when reading something that's intriguing. It's not like my intention is trying to force you to accept my point of view. I kinda doubt Draynay and myself bashing one another is the most you've ever read. Think you are being somewhat dramatic. How do you know Draynay has never visited anyones barn?

FOOTLICK

Great points regarding Zenyatta,thanks!

Whoever said MTB is a better Bird this year and could beat SB on a dry track, can you share some of whatever you are smoking? I would be suprised if he finishes in the money this weekend. He is at best the gelded version of Giacamo. He wins one TC race, and that is it. Maybe he can win an allowance race next year at Sunland? Good luck with that bet this weekend.

I just want to reiterate, I am not "slamming" the horse, but what have you done for me lately??? he was third in the WV Derby, to Soul Warrior...

I and some of the same people have said things to steve s and euro (who really hasn't been on long and doesn't post that much). The one guy you guys blasted is very consistent in who he battles with, just like me and quite a few others, read Dan's blog 'blood on the track'. Some of us just don't like to see horses slammed or for that matter people who are slamming people they know virtually nothing about.

MORE than one of the guys who have taken on Dray have been old enough to be YOUR father and one who was on here is old enough to be your grandfather I'll bet. Remember?

As for being a 'puppy' or needing to grow up? I didn't see any 'well  I have a nice car, young wife this or that and are you really what you say you are, take Kaopectate,  blah blah, immature babble coming in my posts.

The comment from a Doctor, usually relevant to meds, or saying what the areas of expertise are and not commenting on other things. Your retort? How mature was that?

I don't usually talk trash to people who are older, IF they know what they're talking about or aren't slamming something. I CERTAINLY would never contradict someone who has been in THIS game for 30-50 years or longer. Might discuss with them, get a little heated but wouldn't call them names or make fun of THEM.

As for the comment about Todd, that was directed at you both.

Todd hasn't won the Derby, true. But in the scope of things in total, he has done things that a lot of guys will never do.

Who ELSE hasn't won the Derby? Frankel, McAnnally, Mandella, McGaughey guys who have been training 30, 40 and 50 years. Of the young guns the biggest name? Asmussen who has been training for almost TEN years longer than Todd. Around 6 of the current top 100 have won the Derby, a moment in the spotlight but not consistently in the top and certainly a minute % of what Todd has done in stakes races and definitely not consistently in the top tier. They'll tell you themselves that it was a blessing, lightning striking or whatever. But it's the hardest to win, most prestigious race in America.

Baffert, Zito and Lukas are three of those Derby winners on the list and yet Baffert and particularly Wayne are hammered over and over again.

You CERTAINLY don't know Todd if you think he 'cries' over losing a race.

SHAWN P

No,again I don't know Todd,but I'll bet he's not exactly happy when he doesn't win the Derby. I recall two yrs. ago he had something like three or four horses entered and didn't win. I enjoyed that!

SHAWN P

One thing you can't and won't ever be able to complain about is ever stating that I slam horses,since I don't. I'm done!

Hey Draynay: remember the love of your life last year: Big Brown?

I guess he's INCOMPLETE.

Shawn P get a life.  Horse racing is a SPORT !!!  Tiger doesn't win for a month or two and reporters ask him what is wrong, is he in a slump.  A football coach losses 3 in a row and the press wants to know if he fears for his job.  Pletcher loses again and again and again in Triple Crown races and can't win a G1 in New York and we are not allowed to mention it or talk about it ?  His record in Triple Crown races is TERRIBLE.  This guy gets some of the best young horses year after year. Who would argue that ?  Why would someone who spends 500,000 on a 2 year old turn it over to a guy who has proven he CAN'T win Triple Crown races?  It is a honest question to ask and would be asked of any coach or trainer in ANY SPORT.  Can you imagine a trainer in boxing who was 1 for 44 in championship fights ?????? Would he EVER get another promising fighter?

I have to question the sanity of any owner turning their young horse over to Mr. Pletcher if he is interested in winning Triple Crown races.  I could care less about his other accomplishments.  The subject here is Triple Crown races and so far in his LONG career he has proven he has no idea how to get a horse ready for those big races.

Yes mz you're correct his career cut very short by injury is incomplete. But what a wonderful year I had watching an amazing horse, incomplete or not.

Big Brown 2008 Hoy !!!

Really if we think about it there have been some sensational horses this year. People talk about the downturn in racing but it's really looking up, to me.

In no particular order and sorry for any exclusions of anyone's favorites but Sea The Stars, Rachel Alexandra, Zenyatta, Mine That Bird, Summer Bird, Zensational, Goldikova, Careless Jewel etc etc. The two year olds, Lookin At Lucky, Dublin, Hot Dixie Chick and so on. The older guys, who can forget them? Commentator, Better Talk Now etc. Think when all is said and done this has been an exciting year. I'm just sorry for the people who really never got to see or know about these horses this year.

As I said several times. I didn't accuse YOU of slamming HORSES.

No trainer is happy to lose a race. They all want to win the Derby. Even the backwater guys like Chip dream of it and for some it comes true.

Like I said, Todd really cares about you or Dray being happy he loses or not liking him. THAT is my point about NOT knowing people and disliking them. That's like saying I don't like Brad Pitt because he gets rep for being whatever..... geez. I'm just as handsome as HE is (LOL).

IF a trainer is in a race against you and your horse, IF a trainer consistently BEATS your horse when you run against each other I can see that. But, don't get the rest of it. From a gambling perspective? That's one thing, but a 'hatred' like YOU guys display????

As for MY dislike, as LDP said, the trash talking, slamming horses on here attracting fans? NOT.

Draynay, you must now stop calling Rachel Alexandra great. She has not run as an older horse, so she is "incomplete."

Again, see how stupid you sound.

Hey Dray

I guess that Makes Secretariat really great.  He was a monster on the dirt and probably a bigger monster on the turf.

Quality Road should go in BC SPRINT and WHIP Zensational

Why would bettors think Mine That Bird is in any shape to run.

i have no idea how Chip trains

LAZMANNICK

Wanted to say thanks for your comment the other day when you pointed out I never slam any horse.

Tiznowbaby: Secretariat did not run as an "older horse" either.  Was his career incomplete? Is he less great because of it?

What's wrong in Rick Dutrow barn?

Let's do a better job of keeping horses safe.

Start bring in some longshots-all will be forgiven-okay

Yeah Shawn P,I'll be at Churchill Downs next year.  Santa Anita is a bit closer to my home base, but all of the farms I want to see are in Kentucky!  It's a one week "all horse" vacation for me.  I actually grew up watching Santa Anita replays (I loved Dave Johnson and still remember favorite horses like Tiller, Vigors, Terlinqua and Variety Queen!)but I've never been able to make my Breeders Cup dreams come true.  So it will be a real treat for me. It would be something if Rachel were to run.  But, don't want to get ahead of myself.... :-)

Steve S. I live in Louisville, and before MTB left to go back West to NM, he was having trouble training b/c he was body sore. My neighbor is an exercise rider for a big stable and she said two things to me. 1. Do not bet on MTB. He has issues. 2. Dublin is a freak, and Wayne might have another Derby winner. I will take her word for it since the last advice I got from her was Lemon's Forever. Thanks you $12,000 trifecta!!

Right on about Secretariat.....He never ran as an older horse, but ran as a younger horse.....two HOY titles.....Out of tens and tens of thousands of race horses in N/A, how many can claim that?

Draynay, I'm not sure YOU quesioning ANYONES sanity is too valid, considering the questionable state of your own.

The question and subject matter here ISN'T TC races. It's the JCGC and the fact that you're trying to blame SOMEONE for QR losing that race. Other than the fact that you selected a horse who came back and was just a bit short. A lot of owners are now TELLING trainers where they want the horses pointed.

A lot of guys have never even RUN in a Graded stakes and a lot who have, haven't ever won one.

If you (not you literally because we all KNOW YOU have no TC contenders oops no RACE HORSES)want to point a horse to the TC races, you make your decision based on that. However that's a definite crap shoot and truthfully if you're in the game a win in ANY graded stakes is terrific, a G1 is sensational and a DERBY is reaching Mt. Everest. Even PLACING in a G1 of any kind is still banking the bucks

Since you DON'T own horses, let those who DO make their own decisions.

Geez WHY would anyone give a horse to Bob Frankel, it took him 17 YEARS to win a BC race and WHY would ANYONE give him a horse to win a DERBY, he's not done that or a TC prospect, he's won ONE of those in 44 years of training and it took 37 years to win that ONE.

There is a lot more to why we give a horse to a trainer than what YOU seem to think.

You tell us all how rich you are, buy one and send it to whoever you want. Just be aware that some trainers FIRE owners as well as the opposite being true.

Todd's long career? Relatively speaking even compared to those who have won the Derby? Pretty short career. Even compared to Chip. Todd started training on his own Dec 1995. He broke the record for Graded stakes wins that Wayne held for years.  

Talk about it all you want. Just be assured that NO ONE who really matters is listening or reading and anyone who DOES have those kinds of horses and take the time to respond to you don't really CARE what you think, they just don't want casual fans reading your negative crap. So talk on, that's what YOU do best (?) just sounds like wah,blah, wah blah wah blah.

Mike, maybe my initial comment wasn't clear or maybe you misread it. But my theme for MONTHS, Tim's theme, Tiznow,da3hoss etc have been that ONE particular guy consistently slams horses.

YOU joined him in SLAMMING PEOPLE who don't like to see that done. NOT that you SLAMMED  H-O-R-S-E-S, just that you BACKED someone who DOES ALL THE TIME and SLAMMED

P-E-O-P-L-E who don't like to see HIM do THAT.

Runfast159 let me answer that for you.  Secretariat was a great 2 and 3 year old but his CAREER is not complete so I would never compare him to Citation, Affirmed or The Bid.

Horses that NEVER ran as older horses should be compared to each other but trying to compare ANY horse to the three above that never ran as an older horse is just plain silly. Yes Lazmannick, Secretariat proved his worth on DIRT AND TURF when STS wins something on dirt let me know until then...(yawn)  Tiznowbaby what is wrong with saying Rachel is the greatest 3 year old ever.

Hello.  I'm new here.  Well not technically new I read this blog sometimes but never posted.  Wow, the arguing.  It's kind of funny so I wanted to add my two cents about Todd Pletcher.

I think he's an excellent trainer overall but I agree with the guy saying he doesn't know why anybody would give him their juvenile if they want to win a Triple Crown race.  I think that same thing every year when I watch the Derby.

We have finish last pools and reverse exotics pools at work for the Triple Crown races.  I've forgotten how many times I've won those pools thanks to Mr. Pletcher.  His horses pulling up the rear in Triple Crown races is the closest thing to a sure thing that I've ever seen in horse racing.

Sure many other trainers haven't won the Derby yet, but Pletcher has the worst loss record in history per number of entrants.  He usually loads the field with multiple horses and most trainers don't do that, and the other ones that do that at least win occasionally.    

Billy, yes Dublin is looking awesome. Has the similar look of another of Wayne's Derby winners.

Lets see how the switch to Ramon for the Champagne works if that plays out.

Shawn P... dude...lol...what?...lol... is it me or did anyone understand that rambling nonsense?

For the record what horse an I SLAMMING ?  I said MTB after the Derby was a one time wonder and it appears I am 100% right.  I said he wouldn't win another race all year and he hasn't.  He had surgery and I am a big fan of ANY horse that comes back from surgery to run again and I hope for nothing but the best for him.  That being said it is my belief that he should be racing in G2 or G3 races to get his confidence back before facing the best of the best.  Is there another horse I SLAMMED that I am not aware of ?  Maybe it would help if someone looked back and could copy and paste me SLAMMING a horse so I knew what SLAMMING a horse means.

Runfast 159, you must have missed my sarcasm.

Dray, you can say it, but that doesn't make it true.

You guys are right. Todd has been instructed to return the 11.5 million he has won this year to date and the 167 million overall (which in 4th place on that alltime list, he reached it faster than anyone has). He will also return the 4 consecutively won Eclipse awards, all the records he's broken will be nullified, due to the fact that he's hit a G1 NY stakes slump and hasn't won the Derby. Wayne will be doing the same, as well as several others who have been in slumps recently. All of this due to the fact that YOU don't think he's qualified to be a trainer.

Yes he was dead serious when he said a couple years ago:"My name is Todd Pletcher and I've never won the Kentucky Derby." He's worthless for sure.

Theresa a lot of people say the same thing about Wayne, but he's won 4 of them and more TC races than anyone. HE says Todd will win one and he believes that will start a string for him. Like someone said (Mr. Roy Jackson) there have only been 135 winners of the Derby. If you have been reading you can probably see that the issue is Draynay is peeved that QR didn't win, thus displaying his bad handicapping skills and Todd having the horse transfered to him is the fall guy. It's not even ABOUT the TC on THIS blog.

Why would ANYONE who loves racing even bet on a reverse pool? Bad karma.

Draynay

I know it is difficult for you to comprehend at times, but doesn't a 3 y-o defeating older horses on a regular basis negate your ridiculous claim that a horse hasn't really proven anything unless it races as an older horse?....Maybe I need a brain check, but I just don't get it.

Also, by saying what you are saying, Rachel hasn't really proven anything because she is still three......I guess that really does make Zen look good seeing that she's five.

Forgot you have a short attention span and apparently reading comprehension issues as well. Will try to keep my comments down to your level, 3rd grade.

Lot's of people have preferences of horses. Not everyone feels the need to make derogatory remarks about them being inferior to their personal favorites.  Mud winners, California Champion etc and THAT is just the MILD stuff.

Summer Bird, MTB, Zenyatta, Curlin etc etc etc.

Now if you could read that the way I said it, similar to the way I read a book when I was 2 1/2 years old, verrrrryyyy slowly with very precise and careful enunciation. I apologize for the big words i used, tried to keep that to a minimum.

PMAC29, the only way that Zenyatta will be in training past the Breeders Cup is if she stays undefeated.  If that happens, she will be close enough to the undefeated record that they will try to beat it before she goes to the Breeders Shed.  However, that could easily happen before February.  She will race until either (A) she is beaten - which I think will happen at the Breeders Cup, I think Music Note is just too good right now and if Careless Jewel runs the Ladies Classic, Zenyatta gets beat or (B) she will race until she beats Pepper Pride's record.  However, I don't see Zenyatta winning at the Breeders Cup, there is too much talent going in and the jockeys and trainers have figured out her racing style and how to beat her.  Keep in mind, she won the Clement Hirsch by a head, which is her narrowest victory yet.  I don't see her winning at the Breeders Cup.  She'll win this weekend, but that'll be her last victory.  She isn't the monster she was a year ago, which has been made evident by the fact she has had a very soft and easy season, in hand picked races that she should't be beat in.  

SHAWN P

If you have issues w/ DRAYNAY or myself that's YOUR PROBLEM! You want to have it both ways meaning it's ok for you to slam someone but if I do it or DRAYNAY then we should be thrown to the lions. Here's how it goes, I'll say whatever I want,regardless.I could care less if I don't line up with your views,that's your problem! If I want to agree sometimes with DRAYNAY,that's my decision. I've never responded to anyone trying to give instructions on what I should or shouldn't say. You can't convince me you have never formed an opinion like I have on Todd and Steve A.  on someone you didn't meet. I haven't met them,true and I still don't like them. That's my right! Last time I checked we live in a democracy.

RECHELLE

I'm going to make sure I remind you AFTER Zenyatta wins the Breeders' again next month. Be interesting to see what spin you employ when it happens.

Yep, same goes for you and YOUR issues with Tim or me or Wanda or anyone. Just kinda funny the more 'connected' to the game people are,the more certain people like to trash them.

I started this whole thing because of the nasty way Dray talks to people, about people both in the game and on here and the way he talks about the horses. Quite a few of them who I know.

I commented to YOU because you picked up his banner to attack someone who is IN racing and knows a lot about it.

Not just the usual kind of stuff that you've done in the past but really hateful crap. I can say I don't/didn't do it in kind, until you guys tried the same on me. Read my first post to you again.

I have opinions of Steve, I don't especially care for his violation record. But I know him, have talked to him and Dad knows him from way back when he was a kid.

Same as Todd, Wayne well not him as a kid LOL, etc.

I'm not saying we have to line up. Yes it's a democracy but what do you think it accomplishes to slam people with childish slams when they didn't initiate it? Know the history of the battles between people? But I can say that I haven't PUBLISHED an opinion on a public board of someone that I haven't ever conversed with, even if it's in THIS setting as it is with you and the rest of the folks on here. Show me where, I or even Tim for that matter attacked you in the same manner you did him or I. Especially me saying anything before you initiated it? Not sure I ever really did call you a liar etc.

Lookin at Lucky...Best 2 year old colt in the nation.

Draynay

I know it is difficult for you to comprehend at times, but doesn't a 3 y-o defeating older horses on a regular basis negate your ridiculous claim that a horse hasn't really proven anything unless it races as an older horse?....Maybe I need a brain check, but I just don't get it.

Also, by saying what you are saying, Rachel hasn't really proven anything because she is still three......I guess that really does make Zen look good seeing that she's five.

LAZMANNICK 06 Oct 2009 5:41 PM

Lazmannick I felt it was important to post what you said so you can show me where I said "a horse hasn't really proven anything unless he races as an older horse."

Lazmmanick, for the sake of me and the blog please show me where I said that. Because it seems you are just posting nonsense to get attention.

Draynay wrote: Maybe it would help if someone looked back and could copy and paste me SLAMMING a horse so I knew what SLAMMING a horse means.

OK.

Draynay 24 Jul 2009 1:30 PM

(In reference to an Eclipse award winner and BC champion) I doubt if anyone cares that Zenyatta could go undefeated. The path she took was the easy path and now she is little more than a state champion.

draynay 29 Apr 2009 10:52 AM

(Your thoughts on most of the horses in the 2009 Derby)This race has turned into a glorified allowance race. 15 horses have no business being in this race and the best horse left by far like it or not is Dunkirk.

Draynay 01 Apr 2009 8:55 PM

(In reference to Sham) Sham finished right behind Secretariat in the Derby... that is all I need to know because Sham was a nobody

Draynay 15 Mar 2009 12:50 AM

(In reference to Win Willy) Old Fashioned got beat by a nothing horse

Draynay 06 Sep 2008 8:22 AM

(Here's where you called an entire field nobodies) Col. John like last year beat NOBODY in the Travers.

and of course, my all-time personal favorite was when your wrote before the Travers that Colonel John couldn't find the finish line with a map.

Woolley is not concerned about the fact that Mine That Bird finished last of 12 on the Santa Anita Pro-Ride last year in the Breeders’ Cup Juvenile (gr. I).

“Last year, we got in late and he wasn’t ready for the race,” Woolley said. “He chased the pace five-wide on both turns and really didn’t have much of a chance. The horse likes the racetrack OK; he just needs a better trip.

Ummmm... did this bother anyone else or is it just me.  I am still in shock.

Mike Relva,

Thanks for your feedback about Rick Dutrow on Jason's other blog.

Wow, I ended up getting a little upset over there!

LAZMANNICK,

I have to agree with you.  I just can't see where a 3 yr old is considered incomplete when winning the BC Classic which has happened more than a few times.  Where is the logic there?

Shawn P, I don't form my opinions on what Wayne Lucas says.  I form my opinion on the cold hard fact that Pletcher has the worst loss record in Kentucky Derby history.  

Did you ever stop and think that his loading the Derby field with multiple horses might be a bad thing?  Do you like the 20 horse bumper car race that the Derby has degraded into in recent years?  Do you like the 20 horse rodeo that's almost impossible to handicap and is probably dangerous to the horses and riders?

If you don't like it, examine Pletcher's role in the degradation of the Derby fields.  Who else loads it with multiple horses year after year after year while usually finishing up the track? In case you didn't notice, he's had horses get hurt in the overcrowded Derby but he keeps it up anyway [see Bandini for example].  

It looks to me like his ego is getting the best of him and all he's doing is embarrassing himself and those unfortunate horses he enters.

Some of the horses in the DRAYNAY SLAM STABLE:

Secretariat

Ruffian

Zenyatta

Zenyatta won't lose to a filly not named Rachel---Music Note? She better get the jump on Zenyatta cuz Big Z will be rollin, and against fillies, she's just a big load....against males? Since no filly has beaten older on dirt at 1 1/4 since 68, I'd say they're taking a huge chance at defeat---I WANT to see them try---THAT is the filly who should try older males---Zenyatta is an amazon---I was/am critical of trying Rachel Alexandra, a three year old filly, with older males at Saratoga---but Zenyatta is as big/strong as a male, so it is something thet needs to happen....I'm sure someone or two will step up and challenge her, Zenyatta's a horse that always steps up.....

If this is about being able to criticize a trainer's record--I mean, this is horse racing, where everybody has an opinion, it's where you go to be critical--of everything and everybody--Dray is like a blood relative on this blog! Kin to a fellow traveler and true believer--me! Pletcher is ice in Gr I's...things can change overnight in this sport, for example--Bobby.....and, wow, all I can say to the poor soul who thinks this is a weak year in racing--you won't see horses like Rachel Alexander, Sea The Stars, Goldikova, Zenyatta, Summer Bird, and a Kentucky Derby like Mine That Bird's---you don't get years like that but once, twice in a lifetime....

Jason,

No disrespect to anyone on this site but why not end the comments. Start over. The path to me seems to have lost itself between the "yellow brook road" and the "jackie robinson parkway".

I now realize I left out a few people who wished well concerning Pappy's demise and Mercy's fight back on the next day, for all of you, thanks  for your good thoughts. But this site is hard to read some times with all the expert knowledge so freely given.

On a very lower level from the high heavens discussed, look for Mercy's Delight around the 23rd, Dominguez agent committed, so maybe some more good will happen.

Again, to ALL, thanks for good vibes.        

HORSWLD

You are welcome and I agree w/you.

Well I guess the solution to that would have been to not print any of them?

First and foremost to not publish the initial disrespectful comments to the various people on the comments?

Mike Relva, if Zenyatta pulls off the win, which I just don't see happening, not with Music Note & possibly Careless Jewel in the race, then she will have earned it and there will be no spin.  If she can actually defeat either of those two fillies, then she deserves the win and the kudos.

However, I am not seeing the same Zenyatta that we saw a year ago.  I am seeing a 5yo mare who is getting tired and is ready to retire and move on to a fantastic broodmare career.  Zenyatta a year was a monster.  Zenyatta this year is a great horse, but doesn't have the same quality she did a year ago.  That's not a bad thing, but it is a sign that she is tired and she is defeatable now.  I love Zenyatta, I think she's an amazing racehorse, but I don't think she's good enough to win the Breeders Cup race this year.  

Hey Draynay

If I wanted to get attention I would just call myslf Draynay.  OUCH!

Thanks Jason,

      Everyone has to do a little growing up...

No Lady beats Zenyatta on her home track at equal weight.  Not gonna happen.

Rechelle- Zenyatta only is doing what she has to do to win.  Smith isn't pushing her- he's hand riding her.  Can she win the BC?  I haven't seen anything that would scare her away, but that doesn't mean she will win.  I personally would rathe see her in the Classic or with her breeding try the turf in Europe next year.  One word of caution on Careless Jewel- she hasn't faced anywhere near the quality of the field she will face in the BC.  I agree she's been impressive, but very green and erratic.  Not the best way to run a Breeder's cup race.  As for Music Note- I don't really see an improvement from last year.  She beat a sub-par Indian Blessing, and she beat Unbridled Belle.  I don't think that makes her any more formidable.  And does she handle the track at Santa Anita?

Tiz, thanks for the research. Ummm who did Colonel John beat in the Travers again ?

RECHELLE

Guess you missed her last race when she was thirteen back and came five wide. Right!

HOUSEHOLDER

Great point!

Dray, it doesn't matter who Colonel John beat in the Travers. The point is that you called a whole field of horses nobodies. You slammed a whole field. That's what people would like you to stop doing.

Weaknesses..."Music not has yet to tackle the nations best older fillies and mares.  She has raced exclusively on dirt tracks in New York, primarily around one turn."

Breeder's Cup Bios

Footlick, there is no chance of Zenyatta running in Europe next year.  IF she goes through the breeders cup undefeated, they will try her for 3 more races to beat Peppers Pride's undefeated record and nothing more.  How can you not have seen that she simply isn't the monster she was a year ago which is why she has had the easy, handpicked races she's had?  Honestly, I'll be surprised if she pulls off a win this weekend, but I'll be astounded if it happens in the breeders cup.  If she was the freak she was last year, there was NO reason to not ship her to Belmont for the Beldame especially after the officials at Belmont stated they would not use the detention barns since that's been the Mosses' excuse for why they don't ship to Belmont.  They also upped the purse for her & Rachel to show up.  Rachel is exhausted and has earned a vacation.  What was the Mosses' excuse to not ship Zenyatta to Belmont?  Quite simply, I believe her connections realize that they don't have the horse they did a year ago.  But as I said, she will definitely NOT ship to Europe.  After she's defeated, she'll be retired to the breeding shed.

RECHELLE

Why don't you get your facts straight? PP was 19-0,so Zenyatta would have to run several times more to tie or break her record. You said you are a fan of Zenyatta. If this is how a fan behaves would hate to see if you didn't like her.