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I have always looked  at  the femail side of  the bloodline, and its folly not  to concider this factor, we are breeding sprinters, the thoroughbred  was not intended to be sprinters   but distance runners, we here in the USA only have one 1 1/2 mile  race, come on!

crosses are important  and line breeding  needs  to come  to a halt.

out crosses only enrich. the lines

 within  the mare are a vast  treasure do not  squander this way of  thinking, arabs  have been breed  this way  for ever!

theres is  the purest lines

trace your mare back  and see who she really is you might be  suprized to find out  she is breed better  than  most  studs!

breeders wake up!!!

ironic that a horse walks within hours of being foaled, and a human can't usually for 12 months yet as adults the weakest part of a horse is its legs and on a human the strongest....  

• Scot's reply: Interesting idea, and well stated.

she was just bred wrong - to many mr prospectors, raise a native & northern dancers in her pedigree

they also should have waited another year in letting her grow up

I own tbs and work int he racing industry and this accident gave us all a black eye - we care a great deal about out horses and they are cared for before anything else - it is to bad that it had to happen - what about the horses that died in the rolex? anything abou them - eventing is just as bad you know

I think breeders/owners are breeding for the quick buck. Precocious 2year olds bring the promise of speed and a quick turn around on the dollar. Never mind that the Mr. P speedsters can't last a season; he will sell well- let someone else worry about the breakdown. The great stallion himself was barely able to walk. Same situation with Reviewer fast but fragile; just look at Ruffian. In the natural order of things, these fragile creatures would not last long enough to reproduce. We no longer have tough racing machines of years past; the Secretariats, Foregos, Kelsos, Seabiscuits and such. Racing needs to look hard at it's practices or it too will go the way of the fragile thoroughbred.

Anabolic steroids. Why not ban them all together? They make the animals feel too good and pack on too much muscle fro their frames. And please don't argue that this is not the case here: look at the yearling photo of Man'O'War. No one would purchase a scrawny little yearling that looks like he did in this day and age BECAUSE of the use of steroids throughout these animals' lives. It is an indecent outrage to be aghast at baseball players' usage, and not at an athlete who cannot chose.

As a rider and a member of a racing family, I am equally dismayed at the losses this weekend at the industry's premiere event.  The best spin I can put on it is to pray that the NASCAR effect happens.  Racing cars used to be deadly, now the cars and tracks are a wonder of modern technology - -- I only hope we can invest some of that same effort into makeing Equine events as safe as possible.  I vote for the synthetic track and for a careful review of our show jumping and eventing methods.  Fingers crossed for Chelokee too

"Another high profile breakdown from the unbridled line"? I believe the last high profile public breakdown was Barbaro from the Roberto line.

As a Bloodstock agent I feel we all share some guilt in the breeding and racing of unsound racehorses. I am not judging Eight Belles herself as I never inspected her. The Unbridled line (she was by Unbridled Song), however, is notorious for producing fast, talented, but very unsound horses. His foals are especially straight in the pasterns and shoulders which creates severe pressure on the legs, especially the ankles. Just look and see how many of his horses show great promise, win a big race, and then are never heard from again. Unfortunately as long as the market demands precocious, fast horses it is unlikely we will see a change in the breeding patterns  

I am a thoroughbred racing fan.  It is a breathtaking sport with  flaws that are dangerous to the athletes.

As a fan, it is extremely difficult to reconcile the pros and cons of racing such as the breakdowns of Barbaro,Go For Wand, Eight Belles and others.  Somehow, Eight Belles going down was even more painful to witness.

I only hope  the racing industry will take note of what this latest tragedy has done to the acceptance of thoroughbred racing in this country and continue to focus on the safety of the horse both on the track and when the horse is retired.

If I were in charge of the universe, there'd be a few big changes made in the world of thoroughbred breeding and training -

first, no horse is backed until their calendar 2 year old birthday.  That means no rider, no weight, no call for speed until they're 2 years old on the calendar (born April 3, no weight until April 3).  I know that would "ruin" early 2 year old racing, but it would let the bones and tendons grow and the horses come into balance.  And while I'm at it, ban speed shows at sales.  No more of this "can they get to 10 seconds" nonsense on tendons and bones still growing.

second, no steroid use except for actual treatment of injuries or illnesses

third, reopen the stud book to qualified Arabians for, say, 20 years.  Arabian racing takes place in many countries, so set some time and performance standards and let Arabians breed back into the Thoroughbred line.  You want denser bones and more solid structure?  Go to the source - Arabian stallions brought those qualities in as the 3 founding stallions of the breed and as many, many mares and stallions after that up until the last century, so do it again.  BUT these horses need time to develop, so the ban on young horses carrying weight would really need to be enforced.

Expensive?  Sure, these changes would be expensive, costing both money and time, but the gains and, for that matter, the preservation of the sport, could be huge.

Some high in the PETA organization needs to come & spend a few months at the great & best horse farms in Kentucky.  Once then they will find out how well they are taken care of & loved by all handlers throughout their lives.  It all comes down to Belles breeding.  Inbreeding is what causes the most breakdowns.  Just look how long Cigar raced.  She gave her all of her heart in the Derby & she was loving the attention.  You could just tell by the way she was looking at the Grandstand in last few strides & the jockey had to use the whip to get her attention back.  When a jockey whips a horse it is nothing but a pat.  I wonder if PETA has ever watched a herd of horse play in the field, a bite to the neck or hindquarters even a kick does alot more damage & hurts the horse. NOT A WHIP!! A WHIP is USED to GET THE ATTENTION of the HORSE!!!!!!!!!!!  SHE WILL ALWAYS BE REMEMBERED.  GREAT JOB Mr. Larry Jones on the Training of A GREAT FILLY THAT WILL ALWAYS BE REMEMBERED FOR HER WILL & GREAT HEART!!!

Thoroughbreds are magnificently cared for and loved while they are winning and producing-if they can do neither they wind up in slaughterhouses!

How about only breeding sound horses For example even if Big Brown won the Triple Crown-his foot problems would disqualify him as a stallion

Another great race was saddened by the loss of Eight Belles, how many great horses must sacrifice their lives before racing makes some needed changes?  Synthetic tracks and let the horses mature before racing. There is enough money in the sport to make this happen for our equine athletes.

My wife and I witnessed Eight Belles' victories in the Martha Washington, Honeybee (G3) and Fantasy (G2). Because of her price, I kept trying to beat her. Never could. I was foolish to try. Hope they bury her remains at Oaklawn. She clearly loved that track and her many fans there loved her. It would also be nice if Oaklawn named one of its 3 year old filly stakes in her memory.

Wouldn't it be great if we retired the Triple Crown races this year when Big Brown in crowned?

Then starting in 2009, we inaugurate the Triple Crown Races but, this time, for 4 year-olds only.  It will be a more exciting and definitive series in finding the best horse in America.  Four-year olds will prove a sturdier bunch and will be less likely to break down.

What a great idea!

We could do well to look at the rest of the world, where turf racing dominates... long races, exciting stretch runs with many potential winners... and horses race DRUG FREE.

It only takes one mis-step, no matter what the surface or pedigree.

As to bringing in Arabians, as a longtime Arabian breeder and lifelong TB fan, it's an intriguing idea. BUT--- be careful that the Arabians considered, if ever, if any, are from longtime performance lines OUTSIDE the show ring. Many of the lines bred for show-ring pizazz are even more unsoundly structured than what has been mentioned above. I would suggest looking to endurance lines --- a horse that can go 100 miles in one day, over broken, rough terrain, is worth looking into.

I agree about the speed shows at sales. That's just asking for trouble. How many fast sale horses have had long and/or successful racing careers?

Look at Citation, as recently as 60 years ago he ran and won just a few days before the Derby. And then he won the Preakness and Belmont... and raced for 3 more years past his Triple Crown season...

Why is it that so many current TB sires look like short-legged, chunky Quarter Horses? Is it because the breed is being bred ever closer to QH conformation just for the short-burst speed? Look at the historic sires and notice the difference  in structure...      

Big Brown, well done. Eight Belles, well done.

As a stallion owner and breeder, I think we seriously need to police ourselves or we will lose everything we've worked for.  I'd like to see the following:

1) Take a hard look at our stallions which have inherent, life-threatening defects and ban them from being breeding stock, regardless of how brilliant and talented their offspring might be for less than 10 career starts over three or four years (if that long).

2) Limit a new stallion's book to no more than 50 mares, so we stop flooding the market with well-bred failures that add nothing to the breed.  It adds value to the stallions that do sire quality horses and limits the number of bad horses and the number of horses, period.  If the horse is a success, his babies will be worth more, which should reasonably satisfy the bane of the industry - the high end market breeder (You know..."Breed the hottest stallion to the hottest mare and who cares if it's a bad match - it'll be worth millions!").

3) Ban the use of Lasix, steroids and every other last minute tool of the trade for so-called trainers and lets see how long it takes to rebuild the breed and find out who the real trainers are.  Constant drug use weakens bones in humans and racehorses.  They don't have these breakdowns in countries that limit or ban "performance" drug use.

4) Open up the stud book to Arabians and Akhal Tekes (the horses that originally gave the breed it's stamina, intelligence and much of it's strength)to help rebuild the breed and introduce some fresh blood into the mix before we paint ourselves into a corner.

5) Encourage, foster, and campaign for a return to distance racing (1-1/2 or more) to bring the Thoroughbred back to its roots.  Speed is fine, but I'm sick of seeing a full card of races all under 1 mile.  

6)Realize that we would encourage the breed in many ways if we wrote more maiden and allowance races for distances from 9 furlongs to 14, thus giving more horses a chance to be successful and encourage racing at those greater distances.

All of these things could be accomplished if it gets driven from the top down.  The question is who at the top is brave enough to shake up the status quo for the good of our breed and sport?

When will breeders and horsemen learn, cut out the steriods, don't let them race until the ARE three so that the bones can mature.  What is happening today.  Horses race only a few times a year, take a look back years ago, those horses would race two -three times a week and still held up....inbreeding to get the FASTER horse should be rethought by all.

Now that Polytrack has been proven to greatly reduce the number of serious on-track injuries, there is simply no reason why any racetrack in America should continue to run horses on dirt.  Do the right thing, Churchill Downs.  Rest in peace, Eight Belles.

As much as I love thoroughbred racing, it's hard to even think about the Derby or the Preakness or Belmont.  It just rips your heart out when such a beautiful and courageous animal die like that.  Big Brown performed amazing and I am glad for him, but Eight Belles gave so much in that race.  I know she will be running with Barbaro and Ruffian in a field full of clover and butterflies.  Maybe Eight Belles death will somehow make racing safer and save some horses lives.  I really don't know if I can watch the Preakness or Belmont this year, just too hard.

I would like to know if the manner in which the jockey rode Eight Belles contributed to her breakdown.

• Scot's reply: From multiple replays of the race, it appears Eight Belles never faltered, never hesitated, never gave any indication of pain or injury until well after crossing the finish line. Her jockey's anguish was evident as he wept and tried to comfort the filly when she was down.  There's sometimes more to a story than what first appears, but I don't believe we'll find that Gabriel Sayez (or Larry Jones for that matter) did anything wrong. It was a horrible event and they feel it more than anyone else.

I looked up stats for Unbridleds Song and found "nothing" that supports Five cross files statements about the unbridled line as well as Chips. His stats are aboove or well above industry averages in almost all categories of starter staististics, winners, stakes winners ect. In fact the Unbridled sire line has been one of the most if not the most important sire lines in the triple crown for the last decade. The hip shot generalization does not due Justice to the best influence of Speed and Stamina in American pedigrees. I also noticed that some scholar in the blog stated that Eight Belles was "bred Wrong" Hello? The Filly just beat 18 of the best 3yo colts in America in the most important TB race in America! Give me a barm full of ill bred horses like her.Her break down had little to do with her pedigree or sire line or inbreeding. It was a tragic "accident" that could have many physical variables. Its Amazing what people can cojure up as un substantiated theories in a tragic time. 700 horses per year are euthanized due to tragic circumstances such as hers which is roughly .003% of all races. She should be champion 3 year old filly of 2008 with 5 starts 4 wins and beating the best of the rest of the 3yo boys in Americas premiere race.

Get real, people, is this breakdown any worse than the $3000 claimer at CharlesTown?    The genetic makeup of the thoroughbred race horse will always be susceptible to this kind of tragedy.  Too much stress, too little support in the hoof area of the horse.  It is just what it is.  I am glad you bleeding - hearts liberals now voice your concern.  It is a risk.  It can happen to any horse.

My heart goes out to Mr. Porter and all of the connections of Eight Belles.  She truly was a special horse, but I feel what is lost is the fact that Big Brown put on an absolute show.  I know he has a tough road ahead in the Triple Crown but he stands out in a weak crop of 3-year olds.  As I watched Sportscenter this evening they had a 5 minute segment on the Derby and failed to mention the brilliance of Big Brown.  People in the media only want to portray the downside rather than the upside to a story and that is what saddens me the most!

I'd like to see the industry move away form drugs/steroids like Europe. Move toward synthetic tracks. And no racing of 2 yo until after Sept 1 of their 2 yo year. And stop those breezying practises at sales.

The Belle of the Ball deserves:-

   A race named in her honor

   Eclipse for 3 year old filly

   Burial at the Downs, in tribute

This is all we can do for her now, and she deserves it

RIP Belle.

It was great to see a filly beat all but one of the boys and very bad for racing when she went down.  Unfortunately, I believe, that it is not the track that is a fault, but the trainers.  If you watch the race she does appear to take an awkward step before the finish and she does drift toward the rail before the wire, because she was tired.  She had never raced beyond 1 1/16 miles and was not prepared to run 1 1/4 miles.  She ran the last part of the race on heart alone.  If you trained a human athlete the way we "train" horses not only would you not win, but you would be laughed at.  Where is the logic in breezing a horse 4 furlongs when you expect it to race 10 furlongs.  The horses need to be trained with longer but somewhat slower works to prepare them for what is expected of them, longer gallops and more 2:00 licks.  Then our horses would not be so tired.  They would be able to race more often and they would not bleed from the pressures on their lungs because they would be truly FIT!

derby post time until recently was 5:30, now post ime 6:05. This Derby went off at 6:15. Do to the later post time there are many shadows all the way across the racetrack. Any one who has ridden horses knows there adversion to dark areas. The last thing  they need is to be distracted by shadows, disrubts the stride, resulting in injury.

Love mdtbred's comments. Citation ran in the derby trial. and then back in the derby, ran again in-between Preakness and Belmont.Train them 4furlongs and then run them mile and a quarter. Then comment in chart, close tired, that's all i read tired, tired. This is very knowledgeable blog. The breeding has hurt the durability of horses, drug have hurt. If you think they are running off the feed bucket, you are foolish. Now every horse need bleeding med. I remember working at the track and can't recall ever having a bleeder.

I AM FINDING A LOT OF FRUSTRATION IN READING SOME OF THE POSTS HERE.    I FIND IT SURPRISING HOW MANY PEOPLE EXPRESS AN OPINION WITHOUT HAVING THE FACTS. WHY ARE SOME OF YOU SUGGESTING ALL TRACKS MOVE TO SYNTHETIC SURFACES WHEN THEY REMAIN UNPROVEN.  YES SOME INJURIES HAVE BEEN REDUCED BUT OTHER INJURIES  ARE MORE FREQUENT. IN FACT THE LAST PUBLISHED STATISTICS SHOWED VERY LITTLE OVERALL IMPROVEMENT-WHICH SURPRISED THOSE WHO WERE CONDUCTING THE STUDY SO MUCH THAT THEY ARE RE-LOOKING AT THE RESULTS. WHAT HAPPENED WITH EIGHT BELLES WAS A TRAGEDY BUT IT IS NOT THE FAULT OF ANYONE-IT IS UNFORTUNATELY PART OF RACING. I AM ALL FOR TRYING TO MAKE THINGS AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE AS IS EVERYONE IN RACING AS WE LOVE THESE ANIMALS! BUT NO MATTER WHAT IS DONE-ACCIDENTS CANNOT BE AVOIDED. THESE ANIMALS ARE GIVEN THE BEST OF EVERYTHING AND ARE VERY LOVED.  INJURIES ARE NOT A RESULT OF EARLY TRAINING (RESEARCH CLEARLY SHOWS THAT EARLY TRAINING IS BENEFICIAL FOR THE HORSE-LONG EXPLANATION NO ROOM FOR DETAILS HERE BUT YOU CAN LOOK IT UP)AND IF YOU LOOK AT HISTORY 2 YEAR OLDS WERE RACED MUCH MORE 50-60 YEARS AGO (OFTEN MAKING 20+ STARTS). WHAT WE HAVE NOW IS A HUGE NUMBER OF HORSES RACING (WITH A PROPORTIONATELY SMALL INJURY RATE) AS COMPARED TO YEARS AGO AND A LOT OF PUBLICITY SURROUNDING INJURIES AS THE MEDIA DWELLS ON THE NEGATIVE FOR ITS RATINGS. YES TWO YEAR OLDS ARE BREEZING AT THE SALES BUT BACK IN THE DAY THOSE TWO YEAR OLDS WOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN RACING. DO I AGREE - NO, THEY SHOULDN'T RUN UNTIL SUMMER OR FALL BUT IT'S BEEN HAPPENING FOR 100+ YEARS SO THIS IS NOTHING NEW.  I ALSO DON'T SEE WHERE THERE IS ANY PROOF THAT HORSES TODAY ARE ANYMORE UNSOUND THAN IN THE PAST EITHER. IN FACT NOT TOO LONG AGO AN ARTICLE WAS PUBLISHED COMPARING AVERAGE NUMBER OF STARTS ETC FOR TODAYS HORSES COMPARED TO YESTERDAYS HORSES AND IT DID NOT SUPPORT THE UNSOUNDNESS THEORY. HAS MR PROSPECTOR HAD SOME UNSOUND OFFSPRING?  SURE BUT HE ALSO SIRED 1178 FOALS-DON'T YOU THINK SOME MAY BE UNSOUND? HE ALSO SIRED A DERBY WINNER AND A TON OF EXCEPTIONAL HORSES. A LARGER NUMBER OF FOALS WILL LEAD TO SOME HAVING PROBLEMS - COMPARE HIS TOTAL WITH THOSE OF YEARS AGO FOR EXAMPLE BOLD RULER WHO SIRED ONLY 246 FOALS. HORSES ARE NOT RACED AS OFTEN TODAY WHICH IS A GOOD THING AND THEY HAVE SHORTER CAREERS BECAUSE THEY ARE TOO VALUABLE AS BREEDING ANIMALS SO OWNERS RETIRE THEM-WHICH I DON'T AGREE WITH. INJURIES HAVE ALWAYS HAPPENED BUT THEY ARE MORE PUBLIC TODAY. CIRCUMSTANCES ARE ACTUALLY MUCH BETTER FOR THE HORSES NOW AND ARE IMPROVING ALL THE TIME WHICH IS GREAT! SO PLEASE KNOW THE FACTS BEFORE PUTTING DOWN RACING!

• Note from Scot: I appreciate your thoughtful reply... but please use lower-case type in the future.  Thanks!

I don't know what's going to come out of this tragedy, but I hope something good does.  Whether it be our ideas on breeding on how far and how fast we can push these fragile animals; I hope something changes for the better.  The horses just aren't as durable as they once were.

WHY IS NO ONE TALKING ABOUT THE FACT WERE IT NOT FOR EIGHT BELLS BIG BROWN WOULD HAVE CRUSHED THE FIELD BY 9 LENGTHS OFF OF ONLY THREE RACES THIS HORSE COULD BE THE FIRT TRIPLE CROWN WINNER IN 30 YEARS NOT ONLY THAT HE REPRESENTS THE KIND OF STAMINA THAT COULD REALLY HELP THE NEXT GENERATION OF THOROUGHBREDS AS A SIRE.

• Note from Scot: Again, your comments are welcomed -- but ALL CAPS is not fun to read; please use lower-case type in the future.  Appreciated!

Awesome idea on bringing in Arab blood. Also how about allowing AI breeding to throughbreds standing outside the US? This would allow US breeders to bring in more bloodlines and increase our gene pool. How about increaseing purses for races for older horses? Make keeping a horse racing sound until 4 or 5 lucrative. STOP racing 2 year olds. Todays throughbreds can't do it and stay sound. That's our fault. We've bred our selves into a corner. When we do race these horses, put fetlock support boots on them. Nearly all the other equine sports use them. If all horses racing wear them, it will be an even playing field. And finally... BAN the use of steroids. It's not allowed in human sports, why in heavens name are we using it in these animals. They cannot make these choices for themselves. We create these spectacular animals. We OWE them all better than this.

• Scot's response:  Thanks, Jodi.  Your comments touch on a lot of interesting ideas.  I'm going to do some research on infusing "outside" blood into Thoroughbreds.  Your suggestion about AI, I believe, is one that The Jockey Club deserves some credit for avoiding, however.  Look at the American Quarter Horse problems over the last quarter-century... let's learn from their mistakes.  They opened the door, and now there's no closing it!

It’s not just the tragedies of loosing young champions, it is the tragedy of an industry that will not correct itself (not that Eight Belles was not loved an cared for), and then this business has the nerve to complain it is loosing fans.

The problems: horses are raced late in the day at the derby with shadows on the track, raced before bones solidify, raced on surfaces that are to hard or cause soft tissue injuries on synthetics; given hormones that screw up their bodies; given meds that cut off healthy forewarning pain; bred for speed not stamina; not salvaged of reproductive capacities in the event of euthanasia.

The solutions: stop kowtowing to the networks and race before shadows hurt vision on the track; do not race before age four for bone health so that surface is not such a major problem; stop pushing medicines that promote too fast of growth or hide pain; get off the addiction to speed and breed in some stamina - think Seabiscuit;  save the reproduction of the great horse, put in a salvage program of harvesting sperm, eggs or even cloning.

Yep, insurance rates would skyrocket, but at least by age four connections would better know how good and sound their horse is.  I am a retired physician assistant who worked on a transplant team and know that such harvesting has been medically advanced for years.  I can vouch that it is a great relief and kindness to survivors to know that their loved one will in some way live on. With animals there’s even cloning to prevent the waste we see all too often on tracks.

Another word to the industry.  To the public this is not the past when horses were considered chattel.  We no longer live on farms where we are inured to birth and death as a common occurrence.  Attitudes have radically changed.  Even rescue squads have oxygen masks for pets.  Look at Katrina, 70% of New Orleans households had pets with owners who wouldn’t leave them.  We love our pets and spend billions a year on their welfare and health for the pleasure they give us.  It is no different with thoroughbreds.  The industry is expected to live up to its DUTY to do what is best for the horse, not money.  You will literally kill the horse (and racing) that lays the golden egg by turning off fans because of problems to which solutions should have been implemented long ago.

I knew Big Brown would win after seeing his phenomenal acceleration in other races.  And he would have been 8+ lengths ahead if it weren’t for Eight Belles.  There she was  4+ lengths behind trying to catch up with him.  Bless her stubborn heart.  It was such a great race, this Derby.  But it ended with us all feeling so terribly empty.  The only solution to that emptiness is to demand that changes be made now for the future of the sport.

I haven't heard any news on Gayego or Pyro and how they came out of the race.  I know they both had rough trips and were closed off during the race, any word on how they fared or if they are planning on racing in the Preakness or Belmont?

• Scot's reply: Nothing much on Pyro right now; I'll let you know when I hear something.  As for Gayego: Trainer Paul Lobo says "He came back very well - so far, so good" and indicated that his colt is heading west after a disappointing try at the Derby.  He could be pointed towards the 9-furlong Swaps Stakes to be run July 12, and probably a prep before then, but regardless, he'll get a couple of weeks off.

well just to let everyone know they had another breakdown at hollywood park today they won't even talk about it, there so afaid to speak the truth, mike smith and alex solis collided and one horse was injured it was a filly miss cozzy cat i haven't been able to find out if she was euthanized it's like they are all sitting on pin and needles how are we going to deal with this if they won't even discuss it. hello people it's not going away.....