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It would be so amazing if this happens and truthfully it would be great to see, think about it, a mare who has produced 3 Belmont Stakes winners in a row, yes, she would be truly a hero and yes especially to women. I've watched the Peter Pan Stakes twice now and do believe that Big Brown will be facing a horse who can give him a true test but I also think that the way Denis of Cork closed in the Derby suggests that the mile and ahalf may suit him as well. I always watch for those closes from the Derby and Preakness when it comes to the Belmont Stakes. If Casino Drive wins I think we should have a day to honor Better Than Honour.

Any other year and we would all be pulling for Casino Drive for the very reason you give. However, as much as I think he and Denis of Cork are quality colts, the race shape of the Belmont should favor Big Brown. Kent can put him on the lead by himself and slow to a crawl and have plenty left in the drive; a replay of the first two legs. Many believe the Belmont favors closers when, in fact, the opposite is true unless the early fractions are suicidal as they were for Smarty Jones.

I get shivers thinking about what would happen should Casino Drive win. I guess I'm young enough to stick around and see if there really will be a TC winner, so I'm in no hurry to shoe in Brownie yet.

But Casino Drive is beautiful in so many ways...

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Just what my senses told me. This guy is the real deal, bring on Casino Drive. On another note though what the hell has gone into the mind of Gayego's connections? I told them before wait on The Breeders Cup Mile!!!!

I have learned over the years to never quickly call a horse the "real deal" or "great", I have been following horseracing since I was a young girl in the 60's and will be 50 next month so have seen my share of the triple crown races as I watch every year and from what I've seen the Belmont Stakes favors closers, there are always exceptions to the rule but horses like Seattle Slew, Affirmed & Alydar, Secretariat are few and far between now so I hesitate to label any horse great until I've seen more. It would have been truly interesting if Big Brown would have come in the generation of last year as there where many outstanding horses from that crop and one that is still running, Curlin, who I do not hesitate to use great with his name. 5 races does not make a great horse, they must be truly tried, don't get me wrong the potential is there for Big Brown I just need more time to be convinced, even if he wins the triple crown I just need to see more. Maybe having watched the greats I mentioned before along with the greats such as John Henry, Alysheba, Forego, Spectacular Bid, Sham and others it just takes me alittle longer to jump on the band wagon.

Robby Albarado picks up mount on Denis of Cork for the Belmont.  Brownie better not worry too much about Casino Drive, because Denis of Cork is gonna take the Belmont.

Julie L- i completely agree with you. he hasn't been tested....at all! look at the derby. He had the easiest trip, which makes him look good. the preakness had pretty much no competition. Gayego coulda done something.....IF he wouldn't have been on the lead. poor guy.

on the other hand....bring on the Drive!!! Desourmeax regularly rides him, and made a comment that, he doesn't stand a chance, that he was flat out in the Peter Pan. He's getting just as cocky as Dutrow's getting....i won't go in that direction though. =) Better than Honour seems to pass on that look, and heart onto her foals. the look both Rags and Jazil showed.

Better Than Honor is indeed a phenomenal broodmare.  Her pedigree is loaded with class (top and bottom), so much that her offsprings are all classic types.  The crossing of Northern Dancer (Nearco/Native Dancer as grand sires on top) with Traffic Judge (Hyperion/ Discovery as grand sires on the bottom) smacks of the canadian inspiration that gifted the thoroughbred world with Northern Dancer, Vice Regent, Deputy Minister and Dance Smartly.  If Casino Drive can finish within five lengths of Big Brown in the Belmont Stakes, his dam Better Than Honor would have scored once again.

Racing fans get set for yet another let down. Big Brown wins the Triple Crown but he & Curlin are 1000 to 1 to meet at Santa Anita this fall. The breeders can't afford these two to run up the synthetic track and get beat by Colonel John or Adriano.

I will concede that Big Brown looks good.  But a lot can happen in 3 weeks.  Casino Drive has been bred and primed for just this moment in time.  There were doubters last year too, that Rags didn't belong with the boys, but look what she did - not only did she belong, she beat them all in one of the most thrilling Belmonts I've seen since Affirmed & Alydar!  And that finish left me speechless!  I agree with Julie L.  It's going to take a lot more to convince me that Big Brown should be ranked up there with the truly greats, Seattle Slew, Affirmed, Secretariat.

I also agree that both Dutrow and Desourmeax are getting cocky and we all know what happens when you get to that point.  Bud Delp was so sure that Bid was going to take the Triple Crown too, but he forgot to mention the safety pin.

I didn't get the impression that Casino Drive was flat out in the Peter Pan - I thought he was well in hand.  But, I've just been a lifelong fan.  Any other opinions on Casino Drive from those that know?  Looked to me like he was looking for more.  

Oh and what about the bounce theory that Dutrow mentioned, that right off the plane, they'll win, but the second race is usually lousy.  Any truth to that, or does it just depend on the horse itself?

I'll be yelling for Casino Drive.  If Jazil and Rags could do it, then Casino can too.  His breeding alone says so.

My money is on Casino Drive.  I hope he spoils it all!  I'm only 26, I'm sure eventually I'll see a TC winner.  And I sure as heck don't want it to be Big Brown!

If this Japanese-owned colt can finish within five lengths of Big Brown we will all agree that he too is something special.  The reports suggest that he has the tactical speed, finishing kick and pedegree to try testing the "BIG ONE" however that is left to be seen.  I believe that Dennis Of Cork is a good colt and might upset Casino Drive for second money.  It is disappointing that the Breeder's Cup will be on the synthetic surface at Santa Anita this year and so I am wishing that the Jockey Club Gold Cup at Belmont or the Prix Del Arc D'Triomphe (wishful thinking?)will become the championship race where we see the match up of Curlin and Big Brown.  A victory over Curlin on "big sandy" or at Longchamp would once and for all shut up the skeptics and place Big Brown undisputedly among the immortals such as Secretariat, Spectacular Bid and Man O'War and heal some of the pain of the ill-fated Eight Belles even if he doesn't race as a four year old.  

I agree with gary c.  I was there for seattle slew's win of the triple crown. I have watched for years the races. I think Curlin belongs in the great catagory.  I also saw the great Forego (to me he was) run. what a closer he was. what a horse he was. Big Brown"s time wasn't as fast as Curlin's in the Preakness,however he was not challenged either.  They do seem to be getting a little "high on their Horse".  I would like to see him run against Curlin in the Cup.

He hasn't been tested because he is so good. Why is everyone so negative?  Even if he loses, Curlin lost two of the T-Crown races, and yet you say he is great.  If Brown breaks down then you will all go to whining again about the loss of such a great horse.

I think the mentality here is kind of sick.  A horse has to literally kill himself to win for most of you to call him great.  Casino drive has been referred to as so beautiful in so many ways.  He has raced twice.  How has he proven himself?  This is very sad and hypocritical.

Ruffian died trying to shut up skeptics because everyone had to have just a little bit more of her. She gave it.

the belmont goes to the freshes horse and it looks like there all fresh except B.B....

i guess it will take a triple crown to make believers of some . i believed after his third race! i have a poem for the non believers.

BIG BROWN

TRIPLE CROWN

Now this is the blog I wanted to see.......I'm rooting for Casino Drive all of the way. What a thrill it would be to see Mineshaft sire a Classic winner in his first crop, & how can you not love Better Than Honour after Jazil & Rags To Riches. I'm a Seattle Slew & Alydar fan, & I just cannot get in to Big Brown. I'm willing to wait a few more years for a Triple Crown winner. Big Brown is not the one. Come on Casino Drive! Do your family proud.    

And maybe the reason BB wasn't tested in the Preakness is because the competition was so flat out pitiful; not becasue he was so flat out superior.  BB might as well have been running at Charles Town.  That's the calibre of competition he faced in Baltimore.  Had he been in last year's three-year-old crop, he would have just been another horse.

I love watching Big Brown and will cheer for his Triple Crown, but I am disgusted that his connections have already said he will not race beyond this year.  Unless he beats a horse like Curlin, there is no race this year with a superstar to beat that can propel him to superstar status.  I know money drives the business, but a horse that flashes by for one year does not get superstar/hero status.  Secretariat at least was a superstar for two years before he retired.  Street Sense had that possibility since he was a star at two.  If Curlin had not raced this year, he'd already be a long ago postscript.  Bernadini had the possibility - then he was retired and gone....

Big Brown is in for a suprise come Belmont Day. Casino Drive may only have two starts but he's bred to win the race, he's trained to win the race, he's been shipped up from Japan for this race. History tells more than luck. Big Brown saw soft fields in his two prep races and got a dream trip in the Derby. The Preakness was full of Derby leftovers who have done absolutely nothing special so there was no reason for him to be challenged. he WILL get challenged in the Belmont and no one know who he will react. He's not battle hardened. He's soft. Good horses get beat at Belmont. Casino Drive has history on his side. Jazil came from nowhere and stole the show. Rags proved just how good she was in a dogfight to win. All that bodes better for Casino Drive than it does Big Brown. He's a nice horse but he's not a great horse until he's challenged(really seriously)and he prevails. Curlin would nearly crush him if they were to meet.. he's a far classier and tested champion.

A horse that flashes by for a year or less does get superstar status. People say Barbaro would have won the T-Crown, Eight Bells was a superstar, and many others go the same way.  There are so many what ifs, and not liking BB's connections is fine, but most of them are not the horse himself.  He may have gotten beaten last year, but he may not have.  Who is to say?  You are just second guessing. Yes, the field may be horrible and BB may have competition elsewhere, but he may not...  I would say that BB is great if what he produces carries on great racing for the future, because once off the track, that is his legacy.  Only time will tell. Same with any of the other horses that you call "great".

Wendyg: *snorts* Curlin actually had horses to race!! I reassure you, BB would be drove into the ground when it came to last years 3yolds. that is what frustrates me so damn much, that people are calling him a "freak" and "unbeatable". HE'S NOT. he's a good horse, yes. but he is nothing like secretariat, or Forego, or the Slew. even if he wins the TC, i will till the day i die say he is not in teh same class as the other great TC winners. too many ppl on the bandwagon for my confort.

my money is on Casino drive to win, Brown second, Macho Uno third.

does anyone know who has the mount on Casino Drive??

Mike Smith i hope....he's good at spoiling good races....Afleet Alex anyone?

O.K.- You people really bother me. For all of you that say BB had no competition in the Preakness and wasn't tested, think again. The fractions of the race were not slow by any means. In fact, he came home in 19:08, which is one the fastest closing fractions in Preakness history. It was also clear he was being eased up at the end of the race and was never asked to really run. He could have had a remarkable time. Also keep in mind he ran from the 20th post in the derby. All you people saying he had a dream of a trip in the derby, get serious. Let's see, I believe it was something like 1929 when the last horse won coming out of post 20. Anyone who knows anything about racing knows that is the farthest way around the track. BB did it with ease. I have been an avid racing fan my entire life. I have watched some great horses and BB has something folks. His turn of foot is something I have never seen. Not like that. Stop looking for all the reasons not to like this horse. He hasn't done anything wrong. He is all class. Yes, he will need to face Casino drive in the Belmont. Good, maybe he will have a horse that can stay with him. I think BB will win but of course anything can happen in racing. Regardless, BB is that good.

I am in agreement with everyone saying I hope Casino Drive or Denis of Cork (or anyone for that matter) beats BB in the Belmont. Does anyone agree with me that in 04 Smarty had waaaayyy better horses to beat during the TC and they ran him into the ground the first mile of the Belmont. Everyone was practically giving the TC to Smarty before the race was even run so I don't see how you could just give it to BB. I hope someone upsets him and like others are saying I can wait for a TC winner just not BB, but don't worry people, Desormeaux will screw it up!!!

Here is something to ponder. Street Sense winning time in the derby 2:02.17 on the rail. BB winning time 2:01.82 from post 20, four wide the entire race. Preakness winner, Curlin's time 1:53.46, BB winning time, 1:54.80 under a hand ride and being pulled up. Seems to me he would have easily measured up to last years competion and chances are, would have beat them as well. The times don't lie. The track conditions were fast.  This years crop seems so mediocre because of BB. Think about it.

My applause to the owners and trainer of Casino Drive.  While Big Brown is on a roll and other horses are ducking left and right to get out of his way, Casino Drive will be right there. Untested in the highest company, but extremely promising, and at Belmont to try to do something for the record books - not for him, mind you, but for his dam!  In a sport that's reeling from problems and searching for sportsmanship - here's one for you folks, the story of Casino Drive.

I hope it's a wonderful day and a dry track and a great horse race!

• Scot's reply:  I'd settle for a dead heat.  :-)

Frank, Smarty was a great horse. He was a completely different animal than BB. Different running style all together. He had a harder time relaxing and struggled not going to the lead with the competion. His Preakness time was 1:55.59 over a fast track. Smarty's time in the derby was over a sloppy track so can't really compare.  Barbaro's time in the derby was 2:01.82.  I don't beleive anyone is giving the triple crown away to BB. If he wins, he will deserve it. If he doesn't he will still be deserving of the accomplishments he has made. Keep in mind all the horses running in the Belmont will be fresh. Something BB will not have the luxury of having. With that said, I believe based on what I have witnessed, it is going to have to take a fresh horse and some goofy circumstances to over come BB. He is on fire.

To Flyin Home: I think you should do a little more research. It would seem to me you don't like BB connections so therefore you don't like BB. What needs to be noted about BB that is a huge factor in his races is his ability to listen to the jockey and rate. He relaxes, he doesn't get excited, he is a push button horse. He doesn't get run into the ground because that is not his style. He waits, then he pounces. Regardless of who he is racing against, it doesn't matter. The only hope is that they have more left in the end then he does and so far, that hasn't happened.  When Smarty went for the triple crown it was a huge concern that he would have a target on his back because smarty was hard to relax. He was hot headed and wanted to be in front. What many predicted would happen with Smarty, did. BB will be more difficult. He can run from any post, he can go with the pace or lay off of the pace. He relaxes and waits for his time. That is what makes him special. When you combine his mind with his talent, you have yourself a racehorse.

It is also important to note that yes, Casino Drive is bred to go the distance. But don't be so quick to think that BB's pedigree doesn't show it. Boundry is a sprinter yes, but look a little deeper into his pedigree. Also remember that technically and on paper, BB should be a turf horse, not a dirt horse. He has some interesting inbreeding and outbreeding. He has Northern Dancer on both sides in the male line and his female line is Damascus and Roundtable. Hmmm...... as it was stated in the Bloodhorse. This breeding didn't happen on accident.

Karen, you give valid points, but all I'm saying is when Smarty won by 11 everyone was saying "who's going to beat him" over and over again. So Smarty goes out and puts down everyone else until Birdstone deflates everyone's hopes. All I'm saying is it's not a sure thing by any means and it would not be a shock at all if BB lost, I just have my doubts after all these years!

It's hard to explain I guess why some of us hold out calling Big Brown "great". I don't know how long some of you have been following horseracing but for me it is a passion as I grew up with horses having rode in barrelracing events and read everything I could on the great horses of the past, my favorite and the one I consider the "greatest" is Man O' War. When you look at the types of tracks that they ran on and the weight that they carried it made me love the heart and soul and determination of the Thoroughbred. I love the beauty and majesty. I study the pedigrees and know too that champion to champion does not always produce the great one, some come from very humble pedigrees but the excitement of two champions battling and doing what they do love to do, "run". I owned a Thoroughbred and believe me she loved to run, her name was Lady Annabella, Belle for short. Big Brown's crop of three year old competitors may not be the best and some have yet to really come into their own, that is why Big Brown needs to continue to race, to challenge those that become better runners, to show that he can go stride for stride with the likes of Curlin who showed through his performance in the Breeder's Cup Classic against older horses and in the Dubai World Cup against international horses that he is truly a "special" horse and if Big Brown is that "great" then he just might put his nose in front of that chestnut nose then he is showing what it is to be a Thoroughbred, "heart". We do not want to see them run into the ground, those who think that are missing the point. Go to the track in the early mornings, the farms with newborn foals who already believe themselves to be champions and then maybe you will understand those of us who hesitate with the word "great".

It takes a great horse to win the Triple Crown and if Big Brown achieves this then he deserves to be called great. It takes a special racehorse to run in the three races that make up the Triple Crown and if he wins all three then he's proven that he's got the physical and mental toughness that breeders' are looking for along with that priceless gem instant acceleration.

I hope he gets the change to race against the great CURLIN.

Karen: you're right about him being talented about listening and being able to rate. There is no speed in the races he's been in! do your research! that's why he's won. he runs his own race as if he's the only one. he WOULD be drove into the ground by last years horses....Hard Spun had speed and stamina, and well, would OUTRUN BB. i don't know why you think he went 'really fast' in the preakness, because techincally, i've seen and had CLAIMERS run a stretch as fast and faster than he did. And i understand he could go faster because he wasn't pushed. Curlin had to close and runa fast stretch to catch Street Sense and was faster than the time BB put up. Also, of COURSE he's had more left than the other horses???!! who the hell was he racing? those colts are small, and some had no business being in the race. everyone knows that the kentucky derby never counts. again, do your research. too much traffic, and competition in the way.

Big Brown Won't run away with the Belmont, because in the Kentucky derby, sorry to burst anyone's bubble, but Belles was catchin up to him. watch the replay un-biased. The belmont stretch is EXTREMELY long and goes on and on. A grinder (strong but not fast closer) can catch a horse easily. BB will most likely make his move where he usually does. at the top of the stretch, like he's done since he was in training. That stretch is going to be tiring, but not only that, he'll most likely not cooperate a new routine of changing leads late, and having to make a move late if he's to win like he usually does. Dutrow has "boasted" that his horse's training won't change. Sorry to say this, but most horses can't do a 3-4 furlong blowout and come back later in the day to run a mile and a half (12 furlongs).

Keith M: I would like to see him run against Curlin just to see him make an absolute fool of his connections. get Dutrow off his hi horse=)

Not only could Big Brown become the first Triple Crown winner since Affirmed, but I'm tempted to say that he really  looks like the best 3-y.o. since Affirmed, as well.  Of all the other colts who had a chance to sweep the classics heading into the Belmont, when else has it actually seemed more likely than not to happen?  Silver Charm and the others did not seem nearly as dominant over the rest of their generation.  I realize that BB has not been beating the likes of Street Sense, Hard Spun, Curlin and Rags to Riches from '07, but I think he is leaps and bounds ahead of where those horses were at this point last year.

It would be a serious detraction from his reputation and legacy, though, if he doesn't meet older horses later in the year.  The only way to prove that BB, as 3-y.o., can beat top older horses is to beat them!  That said, Curlin, look out!

Is it OK to root for a deadheat?

• Scot's reply: Heck, I'd be thrilled to see a triple dead heat between Big Brown, Casino Drive, and Macho Again.  Wouldn't *that* be one for the history books!

get real, there is no horse on the planet that could beat BIG BROWN at Belmont or any other dirt track ,providing he remains sound...He hasn't even warmed up yet!!

CO Greg,

If Big Brown wins the Belmont, he will never set foot on a track again in his life.  His life as a stud is already set and his connections are not going to risk a loss or injury to jeopardize his future (read:  $$$).  

Sure, he's a good horse.  He may be very very good, for that matter.  But we will never know just how good.

If you watched the Derby and Preakness I think only the uneducated fan could be posting BB is going to be beat in the Belmont. Dennis of Cork?-Get Real! I was truly impressed by Casino Drive and just maybe he is a superhorse-maybe? He obviously is something special in any regard and it makes the Belmont interesting at least.

I took this from another post I made regarding great horses-it fits here with a few changes.

Big Brown-Great-maybe? As to the horses he is running against? "Immaterial" because they are not in his league and he can’t help that. Beating the best of your generation is all a champion can do.  The hook up with Curlin-maybe on a polytrack? Will that solve it? Probably not.

I think Secretariat was a great horse but I have him under a number of great ones because he could get beat on a given day. I never rated Sham as a world beater and the 31 length win was over Twice a Price who wasn’t really a good Allowance horse in my mind having seen him run since he broke his maiden for Campo at Gulfstream. Sham would have won 2 and maybe all three Triple Crown races in another year and been the champion-of course he would have had his head handed to him by some that Big Red beat later on.

In my mind the best 3 horses to hit the track in a race at one time were Damascus, Buckpasser, and of course Dr. Fager who I rate as the greatest horse of all time. A) NO ONE could beat him sprinting-period! B) They needed and used rabbits as a way to beat him. C) He could beat Damascus who other than on the mud was a superhorse. (His only race against Buckpasser the rabbit killed him in 1:06 for the first 6F and Damascus beat them both) D)He carried high weights that todays horses don’t E) Probably the biggest factor-he didn’t seem to like the turf but still beat the best turf horse of that era in the US-Fort Marcy on heart and I believe at a 1 1/4 in the United Nations Handicap. It was  one of the big turf races at the time. Then we are forgetting  the Bid who really was one the the greatest-certainly top ten at least.

Big Brown has won on turf as well as obviously dirt and has beat everyone he has faced easily. What more can you ask? Greatest horse of all time and just great horses-period, will always be an opinion, nothing more. With the breeding game of today unless we see a great gelding like Kelso who would have made $25 million with todays purses usually carrying 130lbs or more. We will always wonder-how good would he be if he ran today? 6F on the mud to 2 miles  and he was just as good on the turf and he was Horse of the Year for 5--yes 5, consecutive years and he beat great horses in each.

I laid out my reasons for my choice but, I wasn’t here to see Citation or Man of War run, lets just say he is best of his generation-IF- he beats Curlin. For the moment enjoy him and hope the big two meet. (on dirt)I look forward to that day for racing as a fan.

An Idea---

The only way you could really define him as one of the greatest ever would be send him to the Arc in France and have him win. No horse raced in the US exclusively went the other way across the ocean has ever done that to my knowledge. The hell with the Dubai Cup, the Arc is a much harder race to win. It would satisfy me.

PS If Curlin could do it, I would think the same of him.

• Scot's reply: Lots of interesting analysis, Marc -- thanks.  Your comments on Dr. Fager / Damascus (and Buckpasser) are of special interest.  I just finished up wiring a book chapter on their rivalry.  Dr. Fager is one of my all-time favorites, too -- and had some of the same whispers about soundess that Big Brown is facing now.

I hardly think BB is better then any other 3yo since 78.  Does anyone remember Spectacular Bid?  Silver Charm?  John Henry?  I suppose what Rags did last year was nothing?  Now, I don't really like Curlin (I prefer Rags to Curlin), but I respect him enough to know that he is indeed a wonderful horse.  I agree with others, let Curlin hook him and BB is in for a big surprise.  

I was 12 years old when I saw Slew win the Champagne Stakes.  I knew that night that Slew would win the TR and remain undefeated through it.  Don't know how I knew, it was just a gut.  I (and many others) watched as he was "only the best of a bad lot" - but look at the legacy he's left behind.  Over 100 stakes winners as a sire and over 100 stakes winners as a broodmare sire.  Slew set the bar pretty high as far as great goes.

Are we really that desperate anymore that we'll just "settle" for great?    Personally, I'm looking forward to a Triple Crown win - of another nature.  I mean, Jazil, Rags, Casino Drive...now wouldn't that just be extraordinary?  After all, Casino Drive is bred to go that far.  And that Belmont stretch has done in an awful lot of other "pretenders"...

Flyinhome,

I think you are exactly right. I don't think BB beats anyone if he runs in last year's Derby. I also think he's going to get stuck and tire around the far turn in the Belmont where someone will catch him. BB is no match for Curlin.

Flyin home: I have done my research. He closed in 19:08. That is not slow my friend.  Secondly, you can't say there wasn't any speed in the race. The fractions were brisk.Yes, they were slightly slower than last years preakness, but not slow by any stretch of the imagination. I have seen much slower. BB could easily run with Hard Spun and Street Sense. Look at the derby times than consider he was breaking from the 20 post and ran 4 wide. How can you not commend that? Yes,the derby does count. Especially when you can over come all the adversity and still win. Why don't you think those colts had any business in the race? They earned their right to be there.   You have issues with the trainer and the jockey so therefore you are blind to what BB can and has done. I think we are all aware of how long the stretch is at Belmont. I think it would be safe to say that Kent D. knows how long it is as well. He will know how to rate BB and BB will listen and then he will make his move. Who's to say BB won't be the late closer stalking the one in the lead?? Sure, BB may lose. Anything can happen. But I'm not convinced by anything you have failed to prove with your rants about BB. BB has Damascus strong in his female line.  Damascus had a powerful turn of foot and the heart and stamina to match and won the Belmont. Don't be to quick to think BB can't win this race.

Flyin home: I can't help but point out something. You said, the Derby doesn't count. To much competition and traffic in the way. What????????? But then you said the colts in the derby had no business being there. They were "small"??? So, the derby doesn't count because it has to much competition, but the colts BB raced had no business being there because they are small?? So, BB had to much competition, but the colts were small??  You make no sense. You remind me of someone who runs claimers.

Frank K....

Speaking of Colonel John, where is he?  Have not heard a word.  I surely respect the trainer and owners on realizing the synthetic talent that this horse does have and that they are saving him for the latter part of the year...  they really care about the horse.  He is ''still'' my fave....

I think everyone is so hungry for a triple crown winner and another superhorse that those feelings outweigh all reasoning and for those who so believe in Big Brown I hope you're right but I have felt the sting of disappointment too many times, I really liked Real Quiet and when he lost the triple crown by a nose what a blow that was or watching Alysheba run fourth in the Belmont just killed me as I so wanted a son of Alydar to take the crown. Next year we will all be arguing over who the new great horse is, won't that be interesting. Too bad Big Brown won't be around racing on the track to show his greatness that all believe is there and I hope that greatness is.

Melanie: Sorry. But just because a horse gets beat in the Belmont, does not make them a "pretender". Curlin got beat by Rags. However Rags never came back after that, but Curlin did.  The entire point of the triple crown is to find a horse great at different tracks, under different circumstances, at different distances and against the best competition in his class not to mention horses that have sit on the sidelines waiting, nice and rested, to take on the winner. So you take a horse like Casino drive and put him where he is bred to run the distance. Great. What else is there for him? So, possibly he spoils the triple crown. Does that make the others "pretenders"? I think not. It is said that Northern Dancer is one of the greatest sires of all times. He wasn't bred to go a mile and a half. He ran his best race at a mile and a quarter. That was his distance.  If BB wins, he will win more than the triple crown. He will win a spot in history amoung the greatest because he deserves it. Even if he doesn't win, its hard to not see he has something special.

Amazing how so many people jump on the Big Brown Express- it reminds me of War Emblum before he flopped. This crop of 3 year olds is exceptionally bad as Eight Belles had no right finishing 2nd in the Derby. She lost 4 of her first 6 races- none stakes- then won two stakes in a row over Pure Clan who hasnt won since November. One other Derby horse went to Pimlico and had to run from the start as per the bad post and tight Pimlico turns, in regards the to Florida Derby field- it was pathetic. I don't blame Brown for the poor quality of the 3 yaer old division, HELL- even Zanjero would have easily beat this crop of 3 year olds- let alone Hard Spun, Curlin, SS and Any Given Sat. Before you roll out the red carpet, throw the parties and celebrate- let Brown go the mile and a half at Belmont. He will have Casino Drive's stable mate to test a realistic pace- then Casino Drive in the stretch to deal with.

Casino Drive wins a huge upset and leaves a crowd of 140,000 at Belmont in shock.  

Julie: I do agree that we are hungry for a triple crown winner. Especially after such a tragic breakdown of Eight Belles during the derby. For some of us, a triple crown win by BB would be a tribute to not only Eight Belles, but to those lost before her. We have suffered a great deal in recent years and have spent our time trying to defend our love for this sport and these horses. Not just to the world, but to friends and family. If your like me, you can't quite put your finger on why these horses run through our veins the way they do. The easiest explanation is the horse and the way it makes you feel when they run. With that said, I'm not sure I understand your comment about our need for a triple crown winner is so strong we outweigh all reasoning. Reasoning for what? The only reasoning we have is every reason to believe BB has a great chance at conquering the triple crown. I have also been extrememly disapointed when it doesn't happen and I think we are all aware that anything can happen and nothing is a sure thing. But make no mistake. BB has a great chance at making history. He has as great of a chance as anyone but he is the only one with the crown on the line.

If you watched the Derby and Preakness I think only the uneducated fan could be posting BB is going to be beat in the Belmont. Dennis of Cork?-Get Real! I was truly impressed by Casino Drive and just maybe he is a superhorse-maybe? He obviously is something special in any regard and it makes the Belmont interesting at least.

I took this from another post I made regarding great horses-it fits here with a few changes.

Big Brown-Great-maybe? As to the horses he is running against? "Immaterial" because they are not in his league and he can’t help that. Beating the best of your generation is all a champion can do.  The hook up with Curlin-maybe on a polytrack? Will that solve it? Probably not.

I think Secretariat was a great horse but I have him under a number of great ones because he could get beat on a given day. I never rated Sham as a world beater and the 31 length win was over Twice a Price who wasn’t really a good Allowance horse in my mind having seen him run since he broke his maiden for Campo at Gulfstream. Sham would have won 2 and maybe all three Triple Crown races in another year and been the champion-of course he would have had his head handed to him by some that Big Red beat later on.

In my mind the best 3 horses to hit the track in a race at one time were Damascus, Buckpasser, and of course Dr. Fager who I rate as the greatest horse of all time. A) NO ONE could beat him sprinting-period! B) They needed and used rabbits as a way to beat him.

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1. I agree that Denis of Cork is laughable- the fact he came in 3rd in the Derby and Belles came in second is a clear reflection on the poor quality of the field. Should Brown be blamed for that? Hell no- but it is a fact to show he is no super horse- as a matter of fact- even Zanjero would have beat that Derby field!

2. Talking about Sham....he ran the 2nd fastest Preakness up to that time behind Secretariat with two broken teeth and a mouth full of blood. After the Belmont- he never ran again- it is immaterial what Twice A Prince did in his career as Big Red's record time stands as an incredible feat.

3. You listed Dr Fager as your greatest horse- KELSO WAS HORSE OF THE YEAR 5 TIMES AND won the JCGC every one of those years-  Carried at least 130 pounds on 24 occasions, winning 13.

4.The greatest 3 races run in a row- as even Andy Beyer pointed out- was Seattle Slew in the 1978 Woodward-Marlboro and JCGC. In the Marlboro he easily beat Affirmed and was only 2/5 off the track record. In the Woodward he destroyed the track record for a mile and a quarter crushing Excellar- then followed that with the legendary JCGC- one of the greatest performances you will ever see. As with Dr Fager- the only horses to beat Seattle Slew were champions.  

on the other hand....bring on the Drive!!! Desourmeax regularly rides him, and made a comment that, he doesn't stand a chance, that he was flat out in the Peter Pan. He's getting just as cocky as Dutrow's getting....i won't go in that direction though

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Kent rode the horse one time- and it was he who pressed him in the stretch- after the Peter Pan- Kent said; " He’s a phenomenal talent, and we’ve got our hands full with this one. It’s going to be ultimately exciting for all of the fans. He’s got that stride.” Kent changed his tune after the Preakness.....Brown and C Drive have big questions- but at 1-20 I pass on Brown- Casino Drive will be worth a big win bet at 7-1 or so.

I too was 12 when Slew came about Melanie.  While he may have been the best of a mediocre lot in 77, the difference was that he returned as a 4 year old and did not shun competition, despite the fact that everyone expected Affirmed to beat him.  His greatest race was actually one of defeat -  losing the 1 1/2 Gold Cup to the great stretch runner Exceller after hooking up in a speed duel.  (would have made the great Dr proud!) Now THAT WAS A HORSE RACE!  Wow, how far racing has deteriated over the past 30 years.  No 1 1/2 mile races to be found, and horses shun any hint of competition to win one race - the Breeders Cup, of which we crown them off that one race.  So, now the sport hopes and prays that Big Brown wins the Triple Crown to "save the reputation" of horse racing?  And what we end up with is a horse that will race 6x in his life, bad feet, runs with front bandages, injected monthly with steroids and off he goes to the breeding shed.  And so the cycle continues.  Personally, I would love to see Casino Drive pull it off.  Great stamina breeding and maybe we'll get to see him a few more races before he disappears.  Just maybe.  

The comments are improving. At least people are really starting to analyze. Thank you Karen. I knew there was someone out there with proof to back it all up.  As far as Curlin racing BB, I love both.  Curlin was my horse last year even when he didn't win.  I don't think a race between he and BB would be appropriate this year, because Curlin didn't come into his own completely until his 4 year old year.  I think BB would have to be allowed to mature also, so a race mid-year next year would be beneficial to both.  Curlin won't be much older, but BB will be allowed to grow up a bit.  It is a race I would not bet on.  Apparently it is not something that will happen as BB is to be retired.  

Great comments Karen and Frank.

One more thing.  Casino Drive is promising, but far from having proved himself.  He is still an individual no matter what his pedigree is. He may win the Belmont, but BB is proven, and much more experienced. If Casino wins, it will be well earned, because short of something happening to BB, Casino will have to work for it.  

Oh, and yes many of us have either owned horses and followed racing for years, or just been involved in following racing for many years.  I remember Genuine Risk a great filly, and Seattle Slew.  I would love to see a T-Crown this year. Good luck to all of you on all of your choices.

Melanie you seem like a nice young lady, but are basing your facts on ideas and dreams.  Good luck. Keep studying the horses, riding the barrel racers, although I do not see what that has to do with anything, and I wish you the best. To everyone else, lets not forget Pharlap, also one of the greats. He was also labeled a freak, and possibly died for it.  

Julie, I'm glad to hear someone else thought Real Quiet was a worthy contender. I was also pulling for him to take the call on that head bob.

I am amused at how many people say Big Brown has not won any impressive  races. I think the most frequently used excuse for a horse failing to win a race he is supposed to win would be the standard "he was much the best horse, but he got a wide trip and ran so much further than anyone else..." Well, if ever a horse has destroyed that excuse it would be BB at CHD. He stayed just off contact with the chaotic pack, hung out there out of trouble, but he had to run many yards further than any other horse in the Derby. I wish CHD used the function Keenland has, which measures how far each horse ran in comparison to the winner.

It's not like his times are a crawl either, he is posting respectable times, even when he is being pulled up and cantered home in the clear.  I hear people say he couldn't have faced the big three from last year, yet his Derby time is faster than the time from last year. If he wins the triple crown he deserves credit for showing up and doing what it takes to get the job done. If he doesn't win, he won't be the first grand horse who lost an important race.

I was a fan of Jazil and especially Rags, and I am a strong advocate for the distaff side of a pedigree, so I will be happy to see Casino Drive turn out to be a superstar. However, I can't deny I really want to see a worthy triple crown winner. If he comes home first on 06/07/08, I think Big Brown is worthy.    

Hey Scott, If we have a dead heat does Big Brown still get the triple crown? Or will he always have an asterisk next to his name? I think I'd rather see a blanket finish with BB getting the nod by a hair... :)

• Scot's reply: I've got to think that any such asterisk would serve only to make the race more historic, more legendary. In such a scenario, the 2008 Belmont would go down as easily one of the top 5 all-time races in America. But -- it's a one-in-a-million chance.  The real story is that we've got TWO opportunities for a Triple Crown this year:  Big Brown's or Better Than Honour's.

Melanie said; I was 12 years old when I saw Slew win the Champagne Stakes.  I knew that night that Slew would win the TR and remain undefeated through it.  Don't know how I knew, it was just a gut.  I (and many others) watched as he was "only the best of a bad lot"

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Mel, Nobody ever called Slew 'the best of a bad lot', as a matter of fact- even Beyer wrote that fall that the '76 juvinille crop was one of the better in almost a decade. If you read all the articles and stories back then- you will clearly see how impressive Slew was no matter how you looked at him. When Slew won the Champagne- it was the fastest mile ever run by a 2 year old in history- simple as that. As an historian of racing- I can tell you that is exact quote was in Bloodline; ' "Seattle Slew was favored over a fine field of more seasoned two-year-olds in the Champagne. He was well cast as the favorite, easily beating back the challenge of Futurity (gr. I) winner For the Moment. He drew away handily to win by almost 10 lengths in record time for the 109-year-old race."  Slew won the divisional title over Run Dusty Run who won an amazing 5 graded stakes- as well as the excellent For the Moment.

Karen:  So you're saying Rags is no good?  I prefer to look at it the other way. Yes she did beat Curlin, but look at what Curlin's done.  Look at all he's accomplished & if she was good enough to beat him, what does that say about her?  In my opinion (and it's just that, my opinion) she was that good.  Oh, and she traveled too - she won at SA, CD (in the mud which she didn't particularly care for - great horses do that too) as well as Belmont.  I can't say I wasn't disappointed when she spent the fall on the shelf, but I was fortunate enough to see a wonderful, beautiful animal who displayed enormous heart.  Did you complain about seeing history made when she became the first filly to take the Belmont is how many years?  

Sure, history might be made in a few weeks, but I agree with everyone else - this is a weak crop, at least at this point.  As for his place in history - I'm sorry, but I just don't see him in the same category as War Admiral, Slew, Secretariat, or Affirmed.  At least not now.  Sure, he'll join Slew as the 2nd undefeated TC winner, but there was something about Slew that just isn't there with BB.  At least not for me.  

Why doesn't the use of anabolic steroids matter to anyone? Big Brown's "juice" seems similar to the enhancement provided for baseball players. Obviously, I have no personal knowledge, but I read that he gets  anabolic steroids once a month. Any way you shake it his performance has been enhanced by artificial means.

Someone please tell me I am wrong and that BB is not on steroids.

Robert:  I so agree with you.  I cried when Slew lost the JCGC to Exceller, but being only 13 years old at the time, I didn't understand until years later that in losing the way he did, he'd really won. That was Slew's greatest race (though I'm rather fond of his Belmont run too).  That drive, determination to win - it ran through Slew's blood, through A.P.Indy's, through Mineshaft, and now through the great grandson.  Together with the grit and heart that Better Than Honor's babies have shown, how can people not see that Casino Drive is the colt to make history this year.  A Triple Crown can be won any year.  The legacy of 3 siblings winning the Belmont - this is a once in a lifetime chance.  Now's the time!

I read at some board that Casino Drive's owner's a real sportsman; he knew the people wanted to see another of Better Than Honour's foals try to take the Belmont Stakes for the third year in a row, and so primed the colt for this race. It's also suggested that he doesn't look for money; he's an entertainer and he may keep Casino Drive running long after the age most of the promising young horses do.

It's frustrating for a young adult like me to get into horseracing at a time when all the potential superstars keep disappearing. I was livid when I found out Empire Maker wasn't making it to the 2003 BC (especially because I was there) and to hear that Big Brown won't be running as a 4 year old, sure as day, makes me even angrier, and I'm sorry to say that it overshadows Brownie's accomplishments. Triple Crown winner? I have at least fifty years. A horse with winning blood and real connections? I don't care if they're Japanese, let them win.

1. Curlin came to age in the JCGC- all things being equal- a good 4 year old will always beat a good 3 year old, yet Curlin came of age during that stretch run and proved he was a special horse. The fact he lost the Belmont the way he did means nothing in regards to being critical of him- *** happens in racing- simple as that.

2. Rags To Riches- She won THREE grade 1 races leading up to the Belmont- for those of you that don't understand what that means- the point is lost- she had won 5 of 6 leading up to the Belmont- the last 3 all Grade- 1.

3. Eight Belles- it was a tragedy, but she was no Rags to Riches! Belle lost 4 of her first 6 races- none of them stakes- not even minor. Her claim to fame was winning her last two stakes against Pure Clan- a filly that hasn't won since Nov.

4. I never said Casino Drive was the next coming- I said that this is a sport of gambling, with all the fans betting BB down to 1-20, CD will be a great bet heavily to win at around 7-1.

5. If BB needs to win the TC to save racing- it would only show the sad state that racing is in. Long gone are the days where we would see incredible two year olds mature and race for years- horses like Seattle Slew, Affirmed, Spectacular Bid, or see great battles like the Alysheba-Ferdinand saga- far more than the past- all racing is about today is money.

6. In regards to Seattle Slew- to the person who said he didn't really beat anybody- LMAO!

Run Dusty Run won 6 graded stakes as a 2 year old, as a matter of fact, For the Moment was the most talked about juvinille in many years before he was crushed by Slew in the Champagne. He easily beat Affirmed twice- it wasn't even close, saddle or no saddle slip in the JCGC- Affirmed was never beating Slew. The only times he lost were to champions- J.O Tobin, then in photos to champions Dr. Patches and Exceller.

No, Melanie, I am not saying Rags wasn't a great filly. Quite the contrary. I loved Rags and will never forget the heart and courage she displayed to beat Curlin. You made a comment that horses that lose the Belmont are "pretenders". My point was no, they are not. Curlin is case in point. I am not one to speak ill of any of these horses. I love them all. Some run great at 1 1/2, some run great at 1/1/4 some are sprinters. If you read these comments they all have special places in someone's heart because of something they have accomplished in their lives. They all put it all out there for our enjoyement. BB is no exception. I for one will never forget the rocket acceleration he showed in the Preakness and how exhilerating that was for me. Win or lose the Belmont, that will stand out in a lot of horse racing fans minds for many, many years. Clearly we could all argue for our favorites and for many different reasons and we all make valid arguments for all. My argument for BB was to fend off all the naysayers that can't admit to the accomplishments he has made. What I see is it's because of dislike for his jockey or trainer. Or because they have chosen not to race him past 3. None of those issues reflect on the performance of BB.

Stan:  As for as the use of Anabolic Steroids, it is said that 95% of horses in training our given these on a very routine basis. There are regulations and they are "suppose" to be used for therapeutic reasons and I believe cannot be given 30 days prior to a race. All horses tested after the derby were negative for steroid use. You simply can't believe that BB is the only horse in the field receiving these meds while in training. It is suppose to help with the lung function and keep the airways open. I for one believe all medications should be banned from racing.

In response to why I said that all reasoning is basically thrown out the window in regards to Big Brown and wanting a Triple Crown winner is that are judgement in assessing whether a horse is "great" or "special" gets lost we let our emotions rule over facts. Don't get me wrong I would love to see Big Brown win but part of horseracing is trying to figure out just who could maybe sneak past and win. You have to factor distance, breeding and if maybe the horse is alittle tired. I hold out hope for Denis of Cork and I have explained in another blog that I hold sentimental reasons in regards to Denis of Cork as my family is from County Cork, Ireland and I have an Uncle Dennis now is that true reasoning for betting him to win...no but we all do it.  

For the record, don't get excited about Casino Drive racing for any extended time. I know directly from the principle actor that his stud deal is being hammered out today, as we speak (type?).

And the steroids, you will have to work hard to find a horse on the track, or a colt headed to sale that has never been given steroids. It is a fact of life. I have been part of that world for a long time, and I hope it will change, but until it is strictly regulated, there is no reason to point fingers.

I want to be clear that I am not suggesting that I have knowledge of anyone using steroids on a Derby horse during any race. It has been well publicized that all horses tested clean for steroids on the day of the Derby. But, in my experience, they are widely used in training and sales prep.

Talking about Sham....he ran the 2nd fastest Preakness up to that time behind Secretariat with two broken teeth and a mouth full of blood. After the Belmont- he never ran again- it is immaterial what Twice A Prince did in his career as Big Red's record time stands as an incredible feat.

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Robert -

It was the Derby, not the Preakness, where Sham smacked his face on the starting gate and broke 2 teeth and still ran the 2nd fastest Derby in history to that date.

And, if memory serves, the reason Sham never raced after the Belmont is that soon after that race he had heat in a leg, a foreleg, I think, and they found a vertical fracture so he was retired.  Some say that happened later in the summer, but Turcotte (Secretariat's jockey) and Pincay (Sham's jockey) said something happened to Sham during the race (besides a "broken heart").

s lee you're right in regards to Sham it was during the Belmont Stakes that he hurt himself and in fact had a pin placed in his leg and so was retired. Sham was a great horse and when both he and Secretariat had passed away both of their hearts were measured and weighed and they said that Secretariat had the biggest heart ever seen and Sham has the second biggest. He was a great horse too and should be remembered.

Robert,

Although most of your comments flatter mine-I loved Slew and he had that great will to win he had along with all his talent. (thats why I have him above Secretariat because I think he would have outgamed him.

Kelso-well, we need a horse like him.

I still can't make a case for Sham except he would have been a champion 3 yr old if not for Big Red. I truly believe he would have been dusted in races like the Marlboro Cup.

My knock on Secretariat is simple, Angle Light beat him in the Wood, Onion-poor Onion that ended up running at the old Waterford Park (Mountaineer) for $1500 claimers beat him at a mile after the Triple  Crown, Prove Out. You mention the unbelievable race when Slew came back at Exceller after being toasted (Of course Dr. Fager only went 1:06-name any other horse that has gone that fast ever other than downhill, let alone a distance race to the 6F when he got dusted by Damascus and Buckpasser beat him for second) That is what greatness is all about-talent and the will to win. Big Red had all the talent in the world, maybe more than any other horse ever, but he overpowered horses but didn't have the killer instinct-Eye of the Tiger. That is my problem with calling him the greatest. If he got looked in the eye or had to go the extra effort???????

Zanjaro-nice horse in a tough year-beat this Derbies field I seriously doubt it. It is far too difficult to say where the bottom of Big Brown's talent is. We can't say what he will do if looked in the eye----AGAIN THAT IS NOT HIS FAULT. Somebody talking about the Belle being beat early in her career, which was not your comment-dumb! She won every start in 2008 prior to the Derby. Secretariat got dusted in his first race. Northern Dancer lost his first to a nice sprinter called Rambling Road (I was there)  but later that year was beaten easily a horse called Garcon  d' Or- who was a nothing. Dance Smartly beat everyone, colts included after a good but not astounding 2yr old year, at 3 while going undefeated. She was probably a lot better than one would think. She just may have been as good as Rags To Riches although that is a stretch, but we will never find out. Like BB it is stupid to knock her.

The bottom line is we just don't know how good the colt is. He's definitely to this point, something very special. He won't race after 3 so it will be all a guess to how good? My money says he won't meet Curlin as their is a lot to lose in both camps if they get beat. $10 million racing does not equate to $25 million a year in stud fees. Even if a dud at stud you still have 3 years to harvest the rewards at some ungodly stud fee.

Let's just see if he wins the Belmont (and how he does it)-hope for a match-up with Curlin or some import like Invasor-it is all guess work right now. To knock a horse that has done everything right and easily is stupid. Chances are no matter what he does- save go to France and win the Arc my opinions on the greatest horse won't change. I do know he is the best of his group so far. How much more can you ask?

all i have heard is how strong last years crop was and blah blah blah the filly beat them in belmont in a slow race i think your gayegos and pyros would have stuck right with street sence and curlin , big brown on the other hand is incredible, win from the 12 in the fla derby win from the 20 in the derby leave them like they are standing still in the preakness.if this horse was trained by todd pletcher or zito or lukas it would be a nice feel good storey for you all ,but everyones problem is dutrow .all you great handicapers should take a little credance in kents words when a HALL OF FAME  jock says this is the best horse ive ever been on in my life it might save you some time and frustration. jerry baily said it best when asked what will be behind big brown he said scorched earth.

Liz, I'm glad too that you liked Real Quiet but you mentioned Big Brown racing wide which he did but there was another who did that with a large field, I believe there were 20 also, and that was Gato Del Sol who was part of the betting field, I seem to recall him coming from post 18 but this was early 80's so could be mistaken but Eddie D. who rode him kept him on the outside to avoid traffic problems the whole trip. I remember telling my dad that if he wanted a long shot to take the grey son of Cougar II, unfortunately Gato Del Sol did not win the next two legs. He was a nice horse though

Secretariat was like Sandy Koufax, only more so! At his best, he was THE BEST.

Stated differently, Secretariat's best was the best ever!

2:24 Belmont; 159 2/5 Derby, where each quarter mile was faster than the one before (negative splitting?)

Are you kidding me?

I breed and race horses and have seen all of the classic races for 51 years and believe me BB is the real deal. This years crop is weak but if you compare BB's time (and how far he had to run with his wide trip in the derby) with Barbaro's he ran much faster than Barbaro did who, by the way, was a very impressive horse. If nothing happens to him between now and the Belmont (whether you like his connections or not) he will win the TC. Remember they didn't run him to death as a 2 year old. He must be a very intelligent horse to be as professional as he is with his limited number of starts.

Julie, I agree that Gato Del Sol had grit, but he certainly took the path less traveled, didn't he? That "wide trip" is one of the favorite excuses along with "didn't like the surface" and  maybe "clipped heels" for a horse that doesn't win that race he is supposed to have locked up. I love to see a nice horse who can take the long road around and still come home out in front.  

Stanley, I agree about Big Red, there is no question he was a freak. Watch him in person, or look at him on paper, no one has come close.

Can someone explain the bounce theory to me that Dutrow was talking about?  He made mention that the horse will usually do well in his first off the plane, but then will fail his second test.  For this reason, he doesn't conceive Casino Drive as any kind of threat.  Personally, I don't think you can discount any of the other horses - you just never know...

As I said before, I'm just a die-hard racing fan.  My first KD was Foolish Pleasure - along came the big, beautiful, nearly black Ruffian, and then I was completely hooked by the Slew.  But I don't always understand, because I'm not on the "inside", so if the bounce theory and how it can affect Casino Drive could be explained, I'd really appreciate it!

Oh, another question.  How smart is it to send BB out for 1/4 - 1/2 mile blowout the same morning of a 1 1/2 race?  I'd think I'd rather save his energy for the big one.

I saw Casino Road run the Peter Pan.  The instant I saw him in the paddock I knew he would win it.  My advice to Dutrow and his team - keep your emotional level as calm and flat as possible, so as not to infect Big Brown with your over emotionalism - that is what made Smarty Jones rank and jittery in the paddock and post parade at his Belmont Stakes.  Any one could see Smarty was out of control that afternoon.  Don't let it happen to Big Brown - he will have enough to contend with running against Casino Road and Spark Candle!

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Nancy, you are right that the key to the Belmont is keeping the big horse calm. One major difference between BB and Smarty is brains. BB is willing to rate and is a normally calm horse. Smarty never wanted to rate and was a very high stress horse. If Smarty had ever been set down, like Kent did to pull BB out of that hole on the backside at Preakness, he would have lost his cookies. BB on the other hand lets his jockey use him any way he needs in order to place him in the most advantageous position to win his race. The only way Smarty could have won that Belmont would have been if he had gotten an uncontested lead and relaxed with a very slow pace and then used his great kick to leave the field in the stretch. Instead, Smarty's Belmont was lost within the first 3/4 of a mile; he used all his energy trying to go early when his jockey, Elliot, was trying to get him to relax and wait until it was the right time for him to run. Big Brown, on the other hand, will just lope along anywhere you put him, just waiting for you to push the button. He lets his jockey use him when and where he needs without loosing his cool. He has to be an absolute dream for a jockey to ride, just a giant source of speed and power available on demand.

Incidentally, Big Brown's calm personality indicates to me that he has not had a high level of steroids in his system. I know people are angry that Dutrow said he has administered that drug on a monthly basis at sometime. Obviously, the horse tested clean at the Derby, so I don't know when this occurred, but I can tell you it must have been a very low dose or this horse would not have such a quiet personality. I have  personal experience with the drug, and it makes them all want to tear your head off.    

When young I would mimic announcer Freddy C's call between Kelso and Mongo. I have worked for E.P. Taylor as a messenger in the Turf Club and watch races with him giving him updates where his horse was during races. I was there at Windfields in Oshawa when Northern Dancer didn't sell for 25K and the woman my dad was with bought a horse called Whitesborough won later won as stake at the same sale. I saw Northern Dancer get beat two times out of three I saw him run in Canada live. Seen many Derbies, Breeders Cup, Washington DC Internationals, Worked in Barns with the mare of Danzig, walked La Prevoyante when she was in Florida and Johnny Starr wasn't, clocker, gap man, owner trainer, met great jockeys, and worked for great trainers.

I DON'T KNOW HOW GOOD BIG BROWN IS?

1)I won't knock him like some-He's been PERFECT AND AWESOME to this point!

2) As he will never race as a 4 yr old or often we will only be guessing how good if he remains unbeaten. Even if meets and beats Curlin-so what-that will never change opinions on where he ranks against the all time greats. I not so sure Curlin would beat Invasor and neither other than in Newbies to the game rate these two in most Top Ten's. Even if he beat both which is impossible-people would argue on his merits.

If you could line up Secretariat, Dr Fager, Citation, Seabiscut, Man of War, Spectacular Bid, Damascus, Kelso, and John Henry and race them Mike Watchmaker would come up for an excuse why his pick and 3 others didn't win and print in the form. NOT to pick on him exclusively, he would not be alone. The fact is it is all conjecture.  

Enjoy the Damn Races if he wins we get a TC winner and more interest in the game giving it a boost-DOES ANYONE KNOW RACING IS A DYING SPORT IN THIS COUNTRY??? ---If--- Casino Drive wins something more impressive will occur but will be lost on the masses. How many people out of the game talk about Woody Stevens-including many who post facts and figures on blogs without referring to a computer search and couldn't tell a colt from a filly without looking under.

Debate is great----opinions are open to everyone knowledgeable and not-but people that knock perfection are idiots-SAVE THAT--- for when you can say "I told you so!"

Nancy P. That was Smarty's style and everyone knew it. He got excited while racing and had a hard time relaxing. He was hot headed and was fiercly competitive. He wanted no part of sitting off the pace, which is ultimately what got him beat in the Belmont. He just plain ran out of gas. However, Smarty was a great horse and I was extrememly disapointed when he retired. He only got beat by a length in the Belmont and he got beat by a fresh horse.  The TC run takes a lot out of a horse. I respect Smarty and in fact he will remain one of my all time favorites for many reasons. He was a little guy with a big heart and a big story.

Melanie: The bounce theory in my opinion is statistical and nothing more. I agree with you that Dutrow shouldn't be so confident and not count Casino drive out, but they are basing their opinion on the fact the Casino Drive is inexperienced.  Everyone was saying BB would bounce in the preakness but he didn't. I think you can look at the statistics and factor them in to some degree. Dutrow is a confident guy and I would imagine right now, if you can imagine the high he is on, he is weighing all the factors going in to this race and just can't see Casino Drive beating BB. BB is on fire and I think it will have to take a series of "goofy" circumstances to dethrone BB, but this is the Belmont and I never say never when it comes to the Belmont.

My other comment above 2 places is much more pertinent but a reprint of my comments on bounce

BOUNCE???????? Are all these people trainers? I have trained in a small way-2 horses over 35 years at least under my name, and certainly not an expert at it BUT there are many that are. If a top trainer isn't seeing anything wrong with his horse why do SO MANY FANS AND HANDICAPPERS think they know it all? Most have never been on the backstretch that use that term. It is one of the most overused word in racing.

A good trainer knows his horse and what to do to keep him right. Zito-Birdstone-small horse needed time between races. Carry Back ran 21 times as a 2yr and won the Derby and Preakness along with bushels of money for the era.

Please drop this "Bounce" talk. AND for the record, one of my horses was a cheap speed horse and in the days before as winter racing I ran him 3 times in 8 days at 4 1/2F the first two were 2 days apart he won both. He finished 3rd the next time to another horse that was coming back on 3 days rest off a win.

Track condition and surface-fevers-nervous,washing out , soreness, bad shipping trip, et., et., et., are are much more viable reasons for a poor performance than a "BOUNCE"!

I will say that ship in from different countries have run poorly in their second start. My theory is much more simple for this-go from NYC to Seattle the water is different and in horses so is the feed-hay (horses ship with own hay usually-at first) comes from a different area. I know in travels my stomach and well being sometimes is effected by changes in diet and weather, time zones- racing off the plane little is different but that changes after you re-adjust. We are all creatures of habit-horses more so. Thus the poorer performance, NOT because the previous effort weeks ago has drained them.

One other note---Smarty Jones I thought was the push button horse as far as rating came until the Belmont.  He rated beautifully in all the races leading up to that race at Oaklawn, the Derby and Preakness, and not badly in the Belmont, he just didn't want to go that far and the jockey didn't want to be pinned in. See Northern Dancer, Majestic Prince, Sunday Silence as other that really didn't want that extra 1/4 mile. He  wasn't hot headed-nor were the other 3, mention Dr Fager or Seattle Slew-they wanted the front and were hot-headed when they weren't there for good examples.

Horses don't love running long distances no more I did when I ran in a couple of Marathons-you ache get tired, runners you could easily beat  at a mile now beat you.

They also don't like muddy tracks- who wants mud in the eyes, slipping and the sting of clots---Some just are better at handling it than others. Put those myths with the bouncers.

The comment was; all i have heard is how strong last years crop was and blah blah blah the filly beat them in belmont in a slow race i think your gayegos and pyros would have stuck right with street sence and curlin , big brown on the other hand is incredible, win from the 12 in the fla derby win from the 20 in the derby leave them like they are standing still in the preakness.if this horse was trained by todd pletcher or zito or lukas it would be a nice feel good storey for you all ,but everyones problem is dutrow

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This has to be the dumbest thing I have ever read on any horse racing board! Firstly, to compare mules like Gayego and Pyro to Curlin, SS and Hard Spun is so laughable it only shows the lack of knowledge by the author. Whe Curlin won the JCGC- for example- it was an incredible feat for a 3 year old- that one race alone was better than anything I have ever witnessed from BB. In regards to Rags to Riches, once again, she won 3 grade 1 races going into the Belmont- she is a class horse- the Belmont made it 4 grade 1 wins in a row for her, Eight Belles lost 4 of her first 6 races- none of them even a minor stake. Since you mentioned the time of the Belmont- and want to go that road- what records did BB set? LMAO- you don't want to go that road with BB. I also have never said one word about his connections- my comments are strickly related to the horse.  

Bravo Marc, both comments above are right on the mark.

Marc said; 'Robert,

Although most of your comments flatter mine-I loved Slew and he had that great will to win he had along with all his talent. (thats why I have him above Secretariat because I think he would have outgamed him.

Kelso-well, we need a horse like him.

I still can't make a case for Sham except he would have been a champion 3 yr old if not for Big Red. I truly believe he would have been dusted in races like the Marlboro Cup.

My knock on Secretariat is simple, Angle Light beat him in the Wood, Onion-poor Onion that ended up running at the old Waterford Park (Mountaineer) for $1500 claimers beat him at a mile after the Triple  Crown, Prove Out. You mention the unbelievable race when Slew came back at Exceller after being toasted (Of course Dr. Fager only went 1:06-name any other horse that has gone that fast ever other than downhill, let alone a distance race to the 6F when he got dusted by Damascus and Buckpasser beat him for second) That is what greatness is all about-talent and the will to win. Big Red had all the talent in the world, maybe more than any other horse ever, but he overpowered horses but didn't have the killer instinct-Eye of the Tiger. That is my problem with calling him the greatest. If he got looked in the eye or had to go the extra effort???????

Zanjaro-nice horse in a tough year-beat this Derbies field I seriously doubt it. It is far too difficult to say where the bottom of Big Brown's talent is. We can't say what he will do if looked in the eye----AGAIN THAT IS NOT HIS FAULT. Somebody talking about the Belle being beat early in her career, which was not your comment-dumb! She won every start in 2008 prior to the Derby. Secretariat got dusted in his first race. Northern Dancer lost his first to a nice sprinter called Rambling Road (I was there)  but later that year was beaten easily a horse called Garcon  d' Or- who was a nothing. Dance Smartly beat everyone, colts included after a good but not astounding 2yr old year, at 3 while going undefeated. She was probably a lot better than one would think. She just may have been as good as Rags To Riches although that is a stretch, but we will never find out. Like BB it is stupid to knock her.

The bottom line is we just don't know how good the colt is. He's definitely to this point, something very special. He won't race after 3 so it will be all a guess to how good? My money says he won't meet Curlin as their is a lot to lose in both camps if they get beat. $10 million racing does not equate to $25 million a year in stud fees. Even if a dud at stud you still have 3 years to harvest the rewards at some ungodly stud fee.

Let's just see if he wins the Belmont (and how he does it)-hope for a match-up with Curlin or some import like Invasor-it is all guess work right now. To knock a horse that has done everything right and easily is stupid. Chances are no matter what he does- save go to France and win the Arc my opinions on the greatest horse won't change. I do know he is the best of his group so far. How much more can you ask?'

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Good post Marc- let me say the following;

1. The filly that came in 2nd in the Derby lost 4 of her first 6 races- non of them stakes, then got into the Derby winning to minor stakes against a filly that hasn't won since November. The Preakness field was so bad- there were only 3 horses in the race that had won a graded stake of any type.

Sham- If you had been saying that Sham would be dusted in the JCGC at a mile and a half- I would agree, but Sham ran the greatest race in Preakness history that didn't result in a victory- still, Sham won 14 o