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Mating Choices -- Flawlessly

The title of this post is a bit misleading.  The great racemare Flawlessly won nine grade I contests and $2,572,536 during her multiple-championship career -- but her produce record is too short to judge, with only two Storm Cat fillies produced. Of them, the 1996 Flawlessness was a maiden winner who died at age 4, reportedly because of the same colitis-x illness that recently claimed graded winner Sailor's Cap. That left full sister Dreamlike (pedigree), a 1997 model, to carry on her dam's female line.

And what a family it is.  Flawlessly's dam, La Confidence, was only a minor winner herself, but she produced a slew of good full siblings to her great distaff daughter. In fact, three other Affirmed-La Confidence foals went on to earn six figures on the track. The best of them, a grade III-winning son named Perfect, currently stands at stud in New Jersey. Granddam La Dame Du Lac produced six black-type runners from 15 foals, including a pair of Nijinsky II group III winners in Ireland. La Dame Du Lac was a half-sister to the great stallion Halo and to multiple champion Tosmah. Their dam, Cosmah, was in turn a daughter of the great matron Almahmoud, whose daughter Natalma produced Northern Dancer along with several daughters who have been the standardbearers of family 2-d. (This family, of course, has multiple branches -- just a couple of generations earlier in the female line was 1924 juvenile champion Mother Goose.)

La Confidence's pedigree reintroduced half-sisters Natalma and Cosmah: her grandsire was Northern Dancer, so she had Almahmoud 4 x 3. Flawlessly's daughter Dreamlike received another infusion of Northern Dancer via his grandson Storm Cat. (In fact, Dreamlike's pedigree exhibits quite a bit of inbreeding, with Native Dancer, Almahmoud, Bull Page, and Princequillo all doubled in the fifth generation.)

Now, Dreamlike was unraced -- but as the only source of Flawlessly, she's had a few good hits, so we'll take a look at the mates chosen for her and how they've worked.

  1. 2000 - Woke Up Dreamin (SRO):  This son of Holy Bull (SRO) came into his own fairly late. He won an 8 1/2-furlong event at 2 but wouldn't see the winner's circle again until late in his 4-year-old season. At 5, though, he was hot: he followed up a win in the True North Breeders' Cup Handicap with another victory in the Smile Sprint Handicap (both gr. II) to clinch a career earnings total above a half-million dollars. Woke Up Dreamin now stands at Millennium Farm in Kentucky, where his first foals are juveniles of 2009. Not surprisingly given Dreamlike's signiicant inbreeding patterns, her first foal was an outcross at five generations (and in fact the only sixth-generation cross was the Domino-line stallion Shut Out, broodmare sire of both The Axe II and Exclusive Native).  Woke Up Dreamin is a sprinter type much more in the style of damsire Storm Cat than he is like his own sire; I would expect him to cross well with speed-bred mares, whereas I'd tend to send rangier mares to other Holy Bull sons.
  2. 2001 - Dame Blanche (pedigree):  Another outcross at five generations, this daughter of Cherokee Run (SRO) was a minor winner in France. The cross with Cherokee Run brought in line-breeding to Nasrullah and Somethingroyal, the ingredients that produced Storm Cat's damsire Secretariat. There are two ways that I'd go with Dame Blanche's own mating selections.  Pairing her with Northern Dancer or Halo-influenced stallions would reinforce the Almahmoud strains that she's already carrying -- and that is what her owners appear to have sought in her first three matings, with the Danzig son Anabaa (SRO) and the Nijinsky II-line stud Green Tune. The other possibility I would study is the Somethingroyal angle. Dame Blanche's sire and damsire both descend on the broodmare sire side from sons of Somethingroyal. Crossing Dame Blanche with an A.P. Indy (SRO) son would neatly reinforce both Bold Ruler and Somethingroyal lines.  Of course, Elusive Quality (SRO-- with not only Secretariat and Sir Gaylord, but also his own cross of Northern Dancer -- would accomplish both criteria.
  3. 2002 - Dream Art (pedigree):  This son of Atticus (SRO) proved to be a dud on the track, failing to place from seven starts. Here the inbreeding pattern might have overwhelmed this pedigree. Dream Art's sire, damsire, and third dam's sire all come from sons of Northern Dancer, and Secretariat is the damsire of both Dream Art's sire and broodmare sire. Nine horses are repeated at least three times each within the first seven generations. But while I would avoid the 3 x 4 dual male-line cross to Northern Dancer, I otherwise like the overall pattern -- Dream Art was just not destined to shine at the track.
  4. After a barren year, Dreamlike was sent twice to uber-sire A.P. Indy. While Holy Bull ($25,000 fee at mating), Cherokee Run ($20,000), and Atticus ($20,000) were solid mid-range studs, we've got to respect the decision to send Dreamlike to A.P. Indy -- a huge upgrade at $300,000 -- before Woke Up Dreamin's big stakes successes. At the time of cover to A.P. Indy, there was little to indicate that Dreamlike was to be anything special as a producer, even given her good looks and royal pedigree.
    • 2004 - Philly's Philly (pedigree): The first attempt at the cross with A.P. Indy yielded both success and failure. On the track, Philly's Philly was a two-time loser and retired early as a 3-year-old. In the sales ring, however, Philly's Philly brought $200,000 as a yearling and $400,000 as a broodmare -- that latter price while in foal on a $30,000 cover. She now has two colts: a 2008 yearling by Dixie Union (SRO) and an '09 by Unbridled's Song (SRO). Where Dreamlike's first two foals were significantly outcrossed, Philly's Philly joins Dream Art as a rather heavily inbred horse. (Interestingly, the outcrosses have shone on the racetrack where the inbred produce have been poor performers.)  Philly's Philly has a triple cross of Bold Ruler -- two of them through Secretariat -- as well as inbreeding to Round Table, and heavy line-breeding to Princequillo. The Somethingroyal factor is seen again, as of course A.P. Indy's dam is inbred to that mare. For Philly's Philly future matings, I'd probably aim for an outcross but would also be intrigued by a match-up with Tiznow (SRO).
    • 2005 - Dream Smart (pedigree): This repeat mating with A.P. Indy looks better than the previous attempt because there's a mark in the "win" column -- but unless this gelding has a break-out season sometime soon (he's still racing at 4), his maiden claiming victory probably won't convince anyone that this cross was anything other than a failure.
  5. 2006 - Denomination (pedigree): Dreamlike's owners caught the hot sire Smart Strike (SRO) on the way up. He had not yet had the success of sons English Channel (SRO) or Curlin (SRO), but he was already seen as a rising commercial sire. Smart Strikes' $35,000 fee at conception seems a bargain when looking at Denomination, who's already won over $160,000 including a French group III contest a couple of months back. She's still racing at age 3. Denomination's five-cross pedigree makes her appear to be a reasonable outcross (only Raise a Native appears as an inbreeding), with Nearco (three crosses each on sire and dam sides) as an important line-bred influence.
  6. 2008 - [Unnamed]:  This yearling colt by Lemon Drop Kid (SRO) combines Charming Lassie -- Lemon Drop Kid's dam, bred on the same cross as A.P. Indy -- and Kingmambo, like Smart Strike a son of Mr. Prospector.

The question I have is why we haven't seen a repeat trip to Darley's Holy Bull to produce a full sibling to Woke Up Dreamin?


Additional reading:  2004 Hall of Fame Inductee: Flawlessly

19 Comments:

I absolutely loved FLAWLESSLY, I think she was one of the greatest turf mares of all time. I would go out of my way, literally, to be at the racetrack when she ran. What a gorgeous girl she was.

Her only surviving daughter, DREAMLIKE, should probably be sent back to HOLY BULL, I would say. Of course, I would love to see her have a foal by TIZNOW as well.

Mike S 26 Jun 2009 1:30 PM

For Mike S, Tiznow checked in with an A++ for Dreamlike.

There were quite a few more A++ ratings for this apparently versatile mare. The variants varied (no pun intended -- I don't understand them anyhow). These stallions included:

Albert The Great, Candy Ride, Curlin, English Channel, Mr. Greeley, Street Cry, and Street Sense.

Stallions rated an A included Alphabet Soup, Lemon Drop Kid and Unbridled's Song.

Awesome Again was a B+.

In addition to sending Dreamlike back to Smart Strike or Holy Bull, I would suggest Mr. Greeley or Candy Ride. Mr. Greeley had quite a few graded winners on the cross. Candy Ride has done well with lesser mares. Of course, I would love Tiznow as well.

Jim P 26 Jun 2009 4:13 PM

I'm guessing because Woke Up Dreaming was a later developer and not be a hot commercial sire they haven't returned to Holy Bull.  

I'd be taking her back to Smart Strike or even Curlin, especially if your looking to sell as a yearling.

hardlyhatful 26 Jun 2009 4:18 PM

After reading the comments on Woke Up Dreaming i a'm really excited about a yearling filly that we have at Millemium Farm out of a Sulrty Song mare "Blue Song" that was horse of the year in NM in 2005.We hope she will follow in the great footsteps of her family.

Michael Sena 26 Jun 2009 5:25 PM

My suggestion would be to try Broken Vow or Eurosilver as I have seen many times seen phenotypic resemblance to the broodmare sire rather than the sire. This cross has produced graded winners and creates a 3x4 to the great

Nijinsky II. I believe Flawlessly's greatness came from him and Broken Vow's photographs show similarities. Any thoughts regarding the apparent dominance of a broodmare sire over the sire?  

  • Scot's reply:  I'm interested to hear what others think, as well.  Personally, I think the best example of that phenomenon in recent times is Fappiano (pedigree), whose influence is much more on the lines of damsire Dr. Fager than the typical Mr. Prospector traits.
Michael D 27 Jun 2009 9:56 AM

Sorry, I forgot to mention, Broken Vow to Flawlessly is an A++ TrueNick. Thanks, I love these articles, great fun!

Michael D 27 Jun 2009 10:01 AM

From the looks of Woke Up Dreamin, suspect that Dreamlike bears little physical resemblance to Flawlessly, and is much more the Storm Cat-type in appearance (too bad). Affirmed's get were somewhat elegant, with leg, and La Confidence gave them a bit more body, and strength, without loss of leg or quality. Looks as if Storm Cat negated the leg and overall nice refinement. Flawlessly's daughter, Dreamlike, wasn't offered much help in this regard, as of her mates only Holy Bull can, at times, offer some "leg" (but generally, not refinement). Can't tell for certain, but suspect that Dreamlike may have had soundness issues. This causes some hesitancy when suggestimg two possible mates for Dreamlike; Indian Charlie and Unbridled's Song.      

sceptre 27 Jun 2009 1:19 PM

Just thought I should add a bit more, and say a few words about Flawlessly's spectacular heritage.-While Natalma seems to get most of the press, her 1/2-sister, Cosmah, was the far superior producer. Those less familiar should really take a close look. In addition to Flawlessly's 2nd dam, La Dame Du Lac (a Saratoga sale-topper), Cosmah also produced Halo, Maribeau (very gifted), Father's Image (among the best 2 yr. olds of his year), Queen Sucree (KY. Derby producer), and, best of all, the nearly incomparable Tosmah. Tosmah was truly brilliant, and could stretch. I rarely missed a race of hers, often cut school to watch her up close, and did finally manage to acquire one of her rare granddaughters. A real shame that she never had the opportunity to display her gifts as a broodmare (her one decent cross-to Ribot-produced a filly that died young). Had things transpired otherwise, I'm certain Tosmah's name would have gone on in pedigrees for generations and generations. The two most talented fillies I've ever witnessed were Numbered Account and Tosmah.        

sceptre 28 Jun 2009 1:32 AM

Thanks sceptre, I believe Queen Sucree was the first million dollar broodmare, caring a full brother to Cannonade, correct?

Michael D 28 Jun 2009 11:21 PM

One of my favorite Flawlessly races is when she and Hatoof were neck and neck at Arlington in the Beverly D. That was a good race.

David 29 Jun 2009 12:02 AM

To Michael D:

Re-Queen Sucree, you may be correct. I know that Franklin Groves purchased her at Keeneland (from John M. Olin Estate) for big bucks, while in-foal to Bold Bidder. This was November, 1976.  

sceptre 29 Jun 2009 12:45 AM

LOVE Flawlessly, natch. And since I feel the same way about English Channel, I can't say no to the possibility of that cross. Would also like to see either of the Street boys (-Cry and -Sense) but then I'm also a fan of Candy Ride.

Such a lovely pedigree, so many choices. If anyone would like to gift me a daughter, I won't say no, LOL!

Jill 29 Jun 2009 1:29 AM

Regarding dam sire, I've had the experience of breeding a TB mare to a warmblood, both good sized horses.  The TB mare's dam was kind of the lanky type too.

The resulting foal seemed to throwback the most to the TB's  damsire- a rather short, chunky TB.

Not a total TB experience but seems the dam sire in this case negated everything else, including the warmblood.

HorseFirst 29 Jun 2009 5:22 PM

We have a 2 yo colt by Thunder Gulch o/o Fully Confident by AP Indy, the 2nd dam is Successfully, a full sister to Flawlessly....he should start at Calder in late July/early August.

I thought it'd be interesting to check TrueNicks on TG/Flawlessly and it's an A+.

TKLawless 02 Jul 2009 12:23 PM

I would go to a Seattle Slew/A.-P.Indy cross with her.

Diego Garcia 03 Jul 2009 12:01 AM

        What do you think about Rockport Harbor as a possible mate for Dreamlike ?? From what I saw ,his pedigree is pretty much free of Northern Dancer ,plus he has a good Dosage rating of 1.67 with a CD of O.17 !! What do you think ??

  • Scot's reply:  You have to go back six generations in Rockport Harbor (SRO) to find Northern Dancer so in that respect it's a good outcross.  For a mare like Dreamlike (unraced but with a couple of good winners) I'd personally opt for a stallion whose career included 20+ races. (Rockport Harbor was a good juvenile stakes winner and took an 8 1/2-furlong grade III at 4, but he ran only eight times in all.)
Pedigree Shelly 14 Jul 2009 1:48 PM

         I think Rockport Harbor would be a good choice ! Idid the hypothetical mating and it looked pretty good ! The only inbreeding was Northern Dancer on the dams side >

Pedigree Shelly 15 Jul 2009 12:42 PM

      Hey Scot , I know this might be way off the subject ,but I've been dying to ask you this Question ! What do you think of the Bruce Lowe numbers on female families ? I find it quite interesting !! I found out that Pulpit and Northern Dancer come from family # 2 ! There are are many others too numerous to mention !The book I like to use for reference is called Champion Horses by Maurizio Bongianni .He covers every horse from Eclipse to Secretariat !

  • Scot's reply:   I'm all about female families!  You'll notice that I include family numbers in many of my posts.  I touched on the numbering system a while back in an old post:  Thoroughbred Female Families -- Family 4 Goes 1-2 in Alabama Stakes.  ...  If you're not already a subscriber to TBH MarketWatch, now's a great time to start getting this professional newsletter.  Starting in the July issue, there's a feature series on "sire-producing families."  Avalyn Hunter explores the trend of certain families producing top-ranked sires.  She starts off with a feature on family 13-c, which is responsible for Seattle Slew and Mr. Prospector, among many others.
Pedigree Shelly 15 Jul 2009 4:43 PM

          Scot, Thank you for the information ! By the way I'm working on my reasearch ! :)

Pedigree Shelly 16 Jul 2009 2:38 PM

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